I can see a prison like this working only for non-violent offenders in the United States.
Also I'm annoyed at the accent of the guard. I can understand 90% of the words he is speaking because my ear is not trained for that accents.
What's the search term that prisoners search at 4:40?
[QUOTE=ROFLBURGER;50375751]I can see a prison like this working only for non-violent offenders.
Also I'm annoyed at the accent of the guard. I can understand 90% of the words he is speaking because my ear is not trained for that accents.
What's the search term that prisoners search at 4:40?[/QUOTE]
Searching for the names of other inmates to find out about them.
What are the numbers? Does it work? Are the numbers big enough to counter the intuition that criminals are not to be treated that way?
That guard was probably having a panic attack at the relatively low security there. I'd like to see a high ranking TSA executive tour a Tel Aviv airport terminal, those guys tend not to rely on fancy xray scanners or luggage searches to find terrorists.
[QUOTE=ROFLBURGER;50375751]I can see a prison like this working only for non-violent offenders in the United States.[/QUOTE]
The important thing is, people has to come out of the prison as whole people again.
If they have been mentally fucked by being in prison, there will be a huge chance that they will fall back into the criminal path again.
There are, of course cases where people just aren't meant to be in public, and always will follow the criminal path.
I think these types of prisons should be more widespread.
Why nordic countries have every luxury buildings .-.
[QUOTE=tisseman890;50375778]The important thing is, people has to come out of the prison as whole people again.
If they have been mentally fucked by being in prison, there will be a huge chance that they will fall back into the criminal path again.
There are, of course cases where people just aren't meant to be in public, and always will follow the criminal path.
I think these types of prisons should be more widespread.[/QUOTE]
They'd largely be ineffective in the united states where the prison system is largely captilistically based and a for profit institution. With the massive incarceration rate no independent builder would be interested in building such a prison as itd generate a massive profit loss.
In terms of the criminals, larger country larger incarceration rate, US especially given many of our unjust laws stuffing prison to capacity. Then there's the media aspect that makes prison some sort of badge of honor for quite a lot of people.
You have the guard mention at one point that the living conditions would offend the victim/victim's family of the inmate for living in such a nice condition. This alone more or less paints the kind of view most hold when it comes to prison in the US. It's not rehabilitation, it's punishment. So from this it'd anger victims as they feel the inmates are being rewarded almost. You could also wager that many would think such treatment would potential convince people to break laws who are in dire straights. Like how homeless will commit a crime solely to go to jail to receive daily meals and shelter, now the prison is a hotel like enviroment.
It's nothing to actually base anything on but given the mindset of incarceration in the US such as it being punishment not rehab, and it being a business above everything and its 'badass' glorification to some that makes someone more hard, these prisons would have come far too late to actually be feasible in the us justice system. Given how bad our system is it just wouldn't accomodate it and would rely on the whole system being reworked which i highly doubt will happen any time soon.
Oh and then theres the additional aspect that this is high security. There are some white collar minimum security facilities in the us that are SORT OF LIKE THIS, and i mean sort of. The closet we have to this is a minimum security prison meant mostly for those who commited crimes like fraud under a certain dollar amount but no aggresion or violent crimes. So if such a prison were to actually be made in the us, it'd be intended for white collar minimum security. Not at all maximum security like this prison in the video.
too long didn't read sadly the us justice system is far too broken to ever have anything like this and too far entrenced to possibly even have an effect if at any point from here on it was even introduced.
OP's video seems cut down. Full version here
[video=youtube;HfEsz812Q1I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfEsz812Q1I[/video]
When the guy says, "I think the crime victims would be opposed to this kind of living arrangement for the criminal." It highlights the difference between US and Nordic correctional systems. Prisoners in the US are sent to prison as a form of vengeance for the crime they have committed rather than to be truly rehabilitated back into society. However, I can't see a prison system like this working in the US. The US is not a welfare society and thus you'd probably end up with people purposefully committing crimes to get put into prison.
[QUOTE=Sgt.vodka95;50375784]Why nordic countries have every luxury buildings .-.[/QUOTE]
Taxation.
[QUOTE=Sgt.vodka95;50375784]Why nordic countries have every luxury buildings .-.[/QUOTE]
No siestas.
[QUOTE=FPtje;50375773]What are the numbers? Does it work? Are the numbers big enough to counter the intuition that criminals are not to be treated that way?[/QUOTE]
In the US, criminals have a very high rate of returning to crime. Norway has the single lowest return-to-crime rate after going to prison in the world. It works.
Gentle reminder that this is a single prison with 250 inhabitants and does not necessarily reflect or represent the entire Norwegian justice system.
[QUOTE=ForgottenKane;50376292]In the US, criminals have a very high rate of returning to crime. Norway has the single lowest return-to-crime rate after going to prison in the world. It works.[/QUOTE]
what are the other prisons in Norwegia like?
[QUOTE=343N;50376836]what are the other prisons in Norwegia like?[/QUOTE]
I know someone who went to prison once. He told me they had disco nights on Fridays.
[editline]23rd May 2016[/editline]
Another form of punishment I suppose
When you look at childhood development, it has become almost unanimous in the field of psychology that punishment is harmful and doesn't reinforce good behavior into adulthood. I don't think it is much of a stretch to say that the logic still applies to adults.
When the state focuses on punishment rather than rehabilitation it solves nothing. It is even morally objectionable as it is just the state wasting money for people to get off on a philosophy of revenge rather than solving issues.
[QUOTE=DrTaxi;50376698]Gentle reminder that this is a single prison with 250 inhabitants and does not necessarily reflect or represent the entire Norwegian justice system.[/QUOTE]
Gentle reminder that halden is a model for Norwegian prisons that other prisons are taking important lessons from.
Here's a "shittier" prison cell in Ila. It doesn't have the high standard as Halden, but it sure beats a lot of prisons in the rest of the world.
[IMG]http://gfx.dagbladet.no/pub/artikkel/5/54/541/541708/fengsel_960_1216958063.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE=343N;50376836]what are the other prisons in Norwegia like?[/QUOTE]
They have the same systems, so the prisoners have the same rights as in Halden, just not the same facilities.
Beyond their freedom of movement, a prisoner should have every right as a free man.
For example, they can;
Complete their education up to and including high school.
Recieve a daily allowance of 7-10 dollars depending on their work.
Apply for leave to prevent a disconnect from society.
Never be forced to share a room longer than 30 days.
[editline]23rd May 2016[/editline]
Oh and they have the absolute right to hunger strike to their death. Because, you know, no one should be forcefully kept alive to be punished.
[QUOTE=ForgottenKane;50377191]When the state focuses on punishment rather than rehabilitation it solves nothing. It is even morally objectionable as it is just the state wasting money for people to get off on a philosophy of revenge rather than solving issues.[/QUOTE]
I thought it was partially to do with it requiring more time, money and effort than to just keep someone away from the rest of the world. With the prison system in America, I imagine that's one of the reasons.
Ideally, a prison should be less of a garbage dump and more of a "hospital of the soul". Not quite a mental institution or insane asylum, but still a place where the ills of the mind are resolved, to reshape even the hardiest of criminals into a peaceable and conscientious modern-day citizen.
Though even that has its issues, since people in power would try to enforce what they believe to be a "model citizen", reshaping people into drones and servitors for the pettiest and most victimless of crimes.
[QUOTE=Oscar Lima Echo;50377200]Gentle reminder that halden is a model for Norwegian prisons that other prisons are taking important lessons from.[/QUOTE]
That still doesn't mean Halden's standards in particular are responsible for the entire country's low return-to-crime rate.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/k84SG.png[/IMG]
The bit that surprised me is that they punish guards for interacting with inmates. Surely it's pretty obvious that interaction would be a good thing?
I love how he fucking hates everything he looks at. I love my country.
[QUOTE=Trumple;50377781]The bit that surprised me is that they punish guards for interacting with inmates. Surely it's pretty obvious that interaction would be a good thing?[/QUOTE]
I'm sure it's done more from a security standpoint. By playing ping pong with the inmates they are quite literally letting their guard (duties) down.
[QUOTE=Oscar Lima Echo;50377200]Gentle reminder that halden is a model for Norwegian prisons that other prisons are taking important lessons from.
Here's a "shittier" prison cell in Ila. It doesn't have the high standard as Halden, but it sure beats a lot of prisons in the rest of the world.
[IMG]http://gfx.dagbladet.no/pub/artikkel/5/54/541/541708/fengsel_960_1216958063.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]
That looks cozy as fuck.
[QUOTE=EuSKalduna;50375831]OP's video seems cut down. Full version here
[video=youtube;HfEsz812Q1I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfEsz812Q1I[/video][/QUOTE]
This should have been the OP video, the whole channel is amazing
[video=youtube;W-kANR1vJkM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-kANR1vJkM[/video]
[video=youtube;jbM9uCxEJDM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbM9uCxEJDM[/video]
[video=youtube;vMdfQ2MXHB0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vMdfQ2MXHB0[/video]
[QUOTE=Oscar Lima Echo;50377200]Gentle reminder that halden is a model for Norwegian prisons that other prisons are taking important lessons from.
Here's a "shittier" prison cell in Ila. It doesn't have the high standard as Halden, but it sure beats a lot of prisons in the rest of the world.
[IMG]http://gfx.dagbladet.no/pub/artikkel/5/54/541/541708/fengsel_960_1216958063.jpg[/IMG]
[/QUOTE]
Literally better then my Student "dorm" in Berlin.
this would never work in the U.S. lol crimerates would skyrocket
The dark filter they put on this makes it hard to watch
[QUOTE=Lolkork;50377838]In Norways case, not really. They are filthy rich from their oil.[/QUOTE]
Dude we pay fucking 20-30 percent income tax and then 25% VAT on nearly every purchase.
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