NHTSA opens preliminary evaluation into the performance of Autopilot after first fatal crash
24 replies, posted
[QUOTE]We learned yesterday evening that NHTSA is opening a preliminary evaluation into the performance of Autopilot during a recent fatal crash that occurred in a Model S. This is the first known fatality in just over 130 million miles where Autopilot was activated. Among all vehicles in the US, there is a fatality every 94 million miles. Worldwide, there is a fatality approximately every 60 million miles. It is important to emphasize that the NHTSA action is simply a preliminary evaluation to determine whether the system worked according to expectations.
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What we know is that the vehicle was on a divided highway with Autopilot engaged when a tractor trailer drove across the highway perpendicular to the Model S. Neither Autopilot nor the driver noticed the white side of the tractor trailer against a brightly lit sky, so the brake was not applied. The high ride height of the trailer combined with its positioning across the road and the extremely rare circumstances of the impact caused the Model S to pass under the trailer, with the bottom of the trailer impacting the windshield of the Model S.
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[URL="https://www.teslamotors.com/en_GB/blog/tragic-loss"]Source[/URL]
Tragic, but to be fair what really caused his death was the shitty trailer underride protection.
I'm sure the Tesla was hauling ass too with how strong the compartment usually is.
[QUOTE=GhillieBacca;50623890]
I'm sure the Tesla was hauling ass too with how strong the compartment usually is.[/QUOTE]
A hit like that would decapitate a NASCAR stock car, something that has one of the strongest roll cages in all of motorsport. No civilian vehicle in the world stands a chance of saving you in a crash like that. Surviving it is 100% you seeing and ducking in time. Same reason we have those steel beams on the backs of semi trailers. They need to be put on the sides too, and covered with fiberglass fairings as those drastically increase fuel mileage as well as make the trailer more aesthetically pleasing.
An accident like that scares the shit out of me. Seen some crash tests of semi trailers and some of the results were shocking. Easy decapitation even at low speeds.
[QUOTE=OvB;50624516]An accident like that scares the shit out of me. Seen some crash tests of semi trailers and some of the results were shocking. Easy decapitation even at low speeds.[/QUOTE]
[video=youtube;C3MPKLy9qHU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3MPKLy9qHU[/video]
[editline]1st July 2016[/editline]
The guy who died credited the system for saving him earlier this year.
[video]https://youtu.be/9I5rraWJq6E[/video]
[QUOTE=TestECull;50624000]A hit like that would decapitate a NASCAR stock car, something that has one of the strongest roll cages in all of motorsport. No civilian vehicle in the world stands a chance of saving you in a crash like that. Surviving it is 100% you seeing and ducking in time. Same reason we have those steel beams on the backs of semi trailers. They need to be put on the sides too, and covered with fiberglass fairings as those drastically increase fuel mileage as well as make the trailer more aesthetically pleasing.[/QUOTE]
Oh I thought it crashed directly into the rear.
[QUOTE=GhillieBacca;50625932]Oh I thought it crashed directly into the rear.[/QUOTE]
Usually the people who die are the ones that see it and try to dodge last minute to the right... decapitating themselves in the process
[QUOTE=Blizzerd;50626848]Usually the people who die are the ones that see it and try to dodge last minute to the right... decapitating themselves in the process[/QUOTE]
Tesla said it was perpendicular so it must of gone under the trailer. It sounds like one of them clipped the other, causing the Model S to lose control and go under the trailer.
Apparently the radar system would of tuned it out due to it looking like an overhead sign:
[media]https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/748625979271045121[/media]
From the police report:
[QUOTE]The top of Joshua Brown’s 2015 Tesla Model S vehicle was torn off by the force of the collision. The truck driver, Frank Baressi, 62, Tampa was not injured in the crash.
The FHP said the tractor-trailer was traveling west on US 27A in the left turn lane toward 140th Court. Brown’s car was headed east in the outside lane of U.S. 27A.
When the truck made a left turn onto NE 140th Court in front of the car, the car’s roof struck the underside of the trailer as it passed under the trailer. The car continued to travel east on U.S. 27A until it left the roadway on the south shoulder and struck a fence. The car smashed through two fences and struck a power pole. The car rotated counter-clockwise while sliding to its final resting place about 100 feet south of the highway. Brown died at the scene.Charges are pending.
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the guy was watching harry potter i dont think the car's to blame
Tesla's autopilot isn't quite Googles autonomous car just yet, but all the car manufacturers are starting to implement the basic stuff like lane follower and auto-park, which is a good first step
[QUOTE=Shadaez;50628009]the guy was watching harry potter i dont think the car's to blame[/QUOTE]
Where did you find that bit of information? It's not in the article.
[QUOTE=Aetna;50628435]Where did you find that bit of information? It's not in the article.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://bigstory.ap.org/article/e00bf3a4dd8d4b8083f6dd66856d9faf/tesla-driver-killed-crash-while-using-cars-autopilot[/url]
Truck driver heard it.
[QUOTE=Shadaez;50628465][url]http://bigstory.ap.org/article/e00bf3a4dd8d4b8083f6dd66856d9faf/tesla-driver-killed-crash-while-using-cars-autopilot[/url]
Truck driver heard it.[/QUOTE]
It wasn't in the police report and you can't play videos on the screen without rooting the car. Maybe an audio book?
I felt like I was missing something here, even after reading both threads on this event. For an accident to happen perpendicular like that, someone had to pull out in front of someone else, disregarding right-of-way.
[quote]When the truck made a left turn onto NE 140th Court in front of the car, the car’s roof struck the underside of the trailer as it passed under the trailer.[/quote]
Went and pulled this intersection up on [URL="https://www.google.com/maps/place/Williston,+FL+32696/@29.4105059,-82.5394596,17.5z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x88e892961891a471:0xa360cf68558cb07f!8m2!3d29.4105962!4d-82.5397624"]google maps[/URL], and there's no stoplights or stop signs, just a yield sign.
[t]http://i.imgur.com/mg1ZWEL.jpg[/t]
I can't make the call on whether or not being attentive would've saved the driver's life, because imo it seems like the truck driver made that turn without looking for oncoming traffic. There's definitely a difference between ramming something sideways at full highway speeds and slamming into it while trying to slow down, but in these types of accidents, the top of the car's getting ripped off either way.
[QUOTE=cebceb44;50629088]I felt like I was missing something here, even after reading both threads on this event. For an accident to happen perpendicular like that, someone had to pull out in front of someone else, disregarding right-of-way.
Went and pulled this intersection up on [URL="https://www.google.com/maps/place/Williston,+FL+32696/@29.4105059,-82.5394596,17.5z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x88e892961891a471:0xa360cf68558cb07f!8m2!3d29.4105962!4d-82.5397624"]google maps[/URL], and there's no stoplights or stop signs, just a yield sign.
[t]http://i.imgur.com/mg1ZWEL.jpg[/t]
I can't make the call on whether or not being attentive would've saved the driver's life, because imo it seems like the truck driver made that turn without looking for oncoming traffic. There's definitely a difference between ramming something sideways at full highway speeds and slamming into it while trying to slow down, but in these types of accidents, the top of the car's getting ripped off either way.[/QUOTE]
Still, there was a chance some kind of avoidance could have been made; swerving to the left or right may have caused the vehicle to strike one of the trucks wheels instead of going beneath it, or perhaps avoiding it completely (potentially sending it into oncoming traffic or w/e) but still a likely better result than what happened.
[editline]1st July 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Shadaez;50628465][URL]http://bigstory.ap.org/article/e00bf3a4dd8d4b8083f6dd66856d9faf/tesla-driver-killed-crash-while-using-cars-autopilot[/URL]
Truck driver heard it.[/QUOTE]
And that quote by the trucker looks like a crock of shit to me, how could he have possibly tell that the driver was watching anything from inside the vehicle....? The screen is on the front center console, there's no way he would have been able to see it and it definitely would have been destroyed/at least turned off during the collision. Unless the driver had the windows down and the volume at full blast so the trucker heard "WINGARDIUM LEVIOSA" before the smash, I'm calling bullshit. The truck driver was 62 and probably trying to cover his own ass after pulling out in front of the Tesla.
Police report says there was a DVD player in the car, no one said it was playing on the Tesla. Why are you so suspicious of shit?
edit: I mean it's good to be skeptical, but put some thought into things?? a tablet or phone could have been playing it as well.
[QUOTE=Shadaez;50629397]Police report says there was a DVD player in the car, no one said it was playing on the Tesla. Why are you so suspicious of shit?
edit: I mean it's good to be skeptical, but put some thought into things?? a tablet or phone could have been playing it as well.[/QUOTE]
Maybe you read the police report from somewhere else? There's no report of a DVD player from my source.
[editline]1st July 2016[/editline]
Also truck driver said "TV". Which leads me to believe he was talking about a large screen, not a phone sized screen.
Video showing the aftermath:
[video=youtube;gQNMvHbL3jU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQNMvHbL3jU[/video]
[editline]2nd July 2016[/editline]
Also I wish people would stop calling it the first driverless car death, it's not a driverless car. It's only level 3 autonomy.
You can see the blanket where the body is and it looks headless.
Poor guy, at least he went out instantly and with a bang.
[QUOTE=Morgen;50630521]Also I wish people would stop calling it the first driverless car death, it's not a driverless car. It's only level 3 autonomy.[/QUOTE]
We knew this was going to happen. Doesn't matter what the stats show, the first fatality involving any type of autonomous behavior is going to be a national news item for days. Queue pundits talking about things with bullshit stats, and fear mongering.
[QUOTE=Zephyrs;50631979]We knew this was going to happen. Doesn't matter what the stats show, the first fatality involving any type of autonomous behavior is going to be a national news item for days. Queue pundits talking about things with bullshit stats, and fear mongering.[/QUOTE]
They don't seem to be doing a good job on the fear mongering part since TSLA stock actually went up in value yesterday.
[QUOTE=Shadaez;50629397]Police report says there was a DVD player in the car, no one said it was playing on the Tesla. Why are you so suspicious of shit?
edit: I mean it's good to be skeptical, but put some thought into things?? a tablet or phone could have been playing it as well.[/QUOTE]
Because pretty much any device in a collision like this would have been obliterated. And I have a hard time imaging someone as intelligent as the driver who's a well-educated and versed engineer being dumb enough to try to hold the wheel and balance a tablet or phone just to watch Harry Potter.
Driver's bio:
[quote=]Joshua graduated from Franklin Regional High School in 1994, attended the University of New Mexico and enlisted in the U.S. Navy in 1997. Joshua became a Master EOD Technician and due to his determination and dedication, he achieved his aspirations to be part of the Navy SEAL Teams. He dedicated 11 years to the Navy and was an honored member of the elite Naval Special Warfare Development Group (NSWDG). After his discharge he worked for Tactical Electronics and then created his own successful technology company, Nexu Innovations, Inc.[/quote]
It specifically states that the autopilot feature requires you to keep your hands on the wheel. Furthermore, the video above even states that "a movie was playing in the dash". I'm skeptical because the whole situation smells fishy, autopilot failing is very believable but there's no way that truck driver didn't pull out in front of the car.
A phone/tablet with a good case could survive a double impact like this, first impact with the trailer wouldn't even affect the device unless the driver was wearing headphones connected to it.
literally any phone or tablet would survive this crash, it wasn't that hard of an impact. it was where it was, the car kept going for a few hundred feet until it hit a utility pole.
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