I love how some people leaving look offended
seriously, get over it
EDIT:
windwakr
hey
get over it
oh no, someone pointed out our "holy" book is filled with evil acts. Time to leave in disgust.
"It's funny as someone who's on the recieving end of beatings that are justified by the bible, how pansy-ass some people react when you push back."
Wow. I like this guy.
[b]e:[/b]
[QUOTE=Skelmech;35770894]Dan Savage is an asshole 3/4 of the time though. He's got a "LGBT Advice column" in some newspaper and p.much enforces all the stupid gay stereotypes, oh and bi people aren't real to him. I've seen kids base their ideas of gay people around what he says and they're usually worse than straight homophobes.
[/QUOTE]
Okay well that makes me like him less.
[QUOTE=codemaster85;35770546]oh no, someone pointed out our "holy" book is filled with evil acts. Time to leave in disgust.[/QUOTE]
I can use the bible to demonize your lifestyle but if you question my bible I recoil and walk away all sad!!!!!
The video has over 1,400 dislikes.
Ahaha.
AHAHAHA.
-snip because I can't back this up-
As was expected he just brings up a whole bunch of old testemant law that isn't even supposed to be relevant to the religion anymore. Anybody who knows a little bit about christianity can see the flaws in his arguments.
[QUOTE=bIgFaTwOrM12;35771264]As was expected he just brings up a whole bunch of old testemant law that isn't even supposed to be relevant to the religion anymore. Anybody who knows a little bit about christianity can see the flaws in his arguments.[/QUOTE]
If you actually listened to what he was saying, the point he was trying to make was that the passages regarding homosexuality are no different to those on the subject of eating shellfish etc.
[QUOTE=bIgFaTwOrM12;35771264]As was expected he just brings up a whole bunch of old testemant law that isn't even supposed to be relevant to the religion anymore. Anybody who knows a little bit about christianity can see the flaws in his arguments.[/QUOTE]
Relevant to the religion?
What, is this the "It's the Old Testament; we don't listen to that" fallacy you're trotting out here?
Look, glad as I am that mainstream Christianity in-general is actively stepping away from the barbaric bits of the bible in appealing to their more secular morality —rather than embracing it and saying "it's the word of GOD! Who are YOU to judge it?!"— the thing is, they're just skirting the issue. Even if they were correct, that would imply that somewhere along the line, [I]GOD [/I]CHANGED HIS MIND, to a FRIGHTENING extent. A "perfect" being would never need a "change of heart" because that would imply it have been WRONG beforehand.
Perfection: GONE.
Now you're just left to the whimsy of a capricious, abusive psychopath telling you, "Yeah, I was a lost being, I did TERRIBLE things to my wife and children... but then I found JESUS! And that makes EVERYTHING okay!
....Right?"
[QUOTE=J-Dude;35772056]Relevant to the religion?
What, is this the "It's the Old Testament; we don't listen to that" fallacy you're trotting out here?
Look, glad as I am that mainstream Christianity in-general is actively stepping away from the barbaric bits of the bible in appealing to their more secular morality —rather than embracing it and saying "it's the word of GOD! Who are YOU to judge it?!"— the thing is, they're just skirting the issue. Even if they were correct, that would imply that somewhere along the line, [I]GOD [/I]CHANGED HIS MIND, to a FRIGHTENING extent. A "perfect" being would never need a "change of heart" because that would imply it have been WRONG beforehand.
Perfection: GONE.
Now you're just left to the whimsy of a capricious, abusive psychopath telling you, "Yeah, I was a lost being, I did TERRIBLE things to my wife and children... but then I found JESUS! And that makes EVERYTHING okay!
....Right?"[/QUOTE]
You do realize that the laws of the old testament have nothing to do with Christianity? Christianity is meant to be the discipleship of Christ, aka following what he said. Besides, there are prophecies in the old testament of Christ's coming and he said that he didn't come to abolish the law but to fulfill it(a reference to said prophecies). It just really pisses me off to have someone so arrogantly state such basic arguments that the could barely hold on their own if they were in a debate and didn't have a crowd of people cheering them on.
[QUOTE=erazor;35772056]If you actually listened to what he was saying, the point he was trying to make was that the passages regarding homosexuality are no different to those on the subject of eating shellfish etc.[/QUOTE]
I was listening and he mentioned passages from the new testament as well, which would make his point incorrect from a Christian perspective.
[QUOTE=Skelmech;35770894]Dan Savage is an asshole 3/4 of the time though. He's got a "LGBT Advice column" in some newspaper and p.much enforces all the stupid gay stereotypes, oh and bi people aren't real to him. I've seen kids base their ideas of gay people around what he says and they're usually worse than straight homophobes.
I can't bring myself to like dan savage, regardless of how right he is in this video, sorry.
inb4 boxs from atheists who just want to circlejerk over someone beating the bible.[/QUOTE]
Could you source this?
[QUOTE=Skelmech;35770894]Dan Savage is an asshole 3/4 of the time though. He's got a "LGBT Advice column" in some newspaper and p.much enforces all the stupid gay stereotypes, oh and bi people aren't real to him. I've seen kids base their ideas of gay people around what he says and they're usually worse than straight homophobes.
I can't bring myself to like dan savage, regardless of how right he is in this video, sorry.
inb4 boxs from atheists who just want to circlejerk over someone beating the bible.[/QUOTE]
I've followed him for a while and never came close to encountering anything of the sort.
[QUOTE=bIgFaTwOrM12;35771264]As was expected he just brings up a whole bunch of old testemant law that isn't even supposed to be relevant to the religion anymore. Anybody who knows a little bit about christianity can see the flaws in his arguments.[/QUOTE]
Just a notice I don't like the guy in the OP's video but his points here are valid nonetheless:
His point and my point to you is when Christians approach homosexuality they use use Leviticus 18:22 "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination" but you ignore the bits of Leviticus that deal with eating shellfish and pork as being an abomination aswell? Or the bit about wearing clothing from two different kinds of thread being a sin, I don't see Christians out their protesting outside seafood restaurants but given their bibles law in the same section they ought to be. None of this sounding batshit illogical to you?
Also if you're going to pull that last minute oh jesus abolished the law, that is never stated anywhere as you rightly stated he didn't come to abolish but to fulfill the previous laws put down in the Old Testament:
Matthews 5:17 , "Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish, but to fulfill."
Jesus is speaking about the Old Testament principles and authority of rule and revelation. When Jesus said that He came to fulfill the law, He came to establish it and demonstrate how it pointed to Him and how He would live it perfectly.
This is the most annoying thing I ever hear from Christians, oh that verse in the bible that doesn't matter anymore, oh that bit lets forget about that bit. It's straight up plugging your fingers in your ears and screaming "lalalla I can't hear you" like some little kid. You can't simply believe whatever parts you like whenever you want to. Is it not god's perfect book, why would god make sections to be later irrelevant, we're talking about the greatest intelligence in existence here. Talk about cherry-picking.
Also you do realize that the 10 commandments are part of the old testament. Oh but you want to keep that part well isn't that a shame.
[QUOTE=Drax-Quin;35775016]Just a notice I don't like the guy in the OP's video but nonetheless:
Let me get this straight, when Christians approach homosexuality they use use Leviticus 18:22 "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination" but you ignore the bits of Leviticus that deal with eating shellfish and pork as being an abomination aswell? Or the bit about wearing clothing from two different kinds of thread being a sin, I don't see christiants out their protesting otuside seafood restaruants but given their bibles law in the same section they ought to be. None of this sounding batshit illogical to you?
This is the most annoying thing I ever hear from Christians, oh that verse in the bible that doesn't matter anymore, oh that bit lets forget about that bit. It's straight up plugging your fingers in your ears and screaming "lalalla I can't hear you" like some little kid. You can't simply believe whatever parts you like whenever you want to. Is it not god's perfect book, why would god make sections to be later irrelevant, we're talking about the greatest intelligence in existence here. Talk about cherry-picking.
Also you do realize that the 10 commandments are part of the old testament. Oh but you want to keep that part well isn't that a shame.[/QUOTE]
No, most Christians use verses in the new testament, specifically quotes form Jesus, such as at the beginning of the book of Matthew. Also the ten commandments are in no way meant to be laws that you have to follow as they are impossible to follow, they are meant to be examples of what can condemn you to hell, then you get into the concept of grace and how Christians aren't supposed to follow any specific law to go to heaven.
It doesn't matter what Christians want to use, or what most use, it is distinctly part of their religion. Anyway didn't I already establish this is a fallacy of cherry picking, most Christians don't even know their own bible as studies have rightfully shown so to even begin with it's increasingly unlikely they even know which testament old or new they agree with or have decided to follow. I mean this video is pretty good depiction of this, all those Christians waltzing out the room because someone is quoting something from their bible, I mean it's right from their own book but they would rather not hear it, this is incredibly illogical.
They aren't rules but they are examples of things that could get you into hell can't you see the huge hole in that statement??? Iff they're things that could potentially get you into hell surely you would want to avoid commiting the things the commandments refer to, and if you are trying to avoid the things the commadments are refferring to because they could get you into hell you would therefore abide by them. If you're abiding by them, do they not become a set of rules? So doesn't that make them by their very nature RULES/LAW?
I would think you would run into controvesry with your fellow Chrisitians stating the 10 commandments aren't law anyway.
Also on that list of what can potentially condemn you to hell you have covert thy neighbor and working on the sabbath. You know it's always good to know you believe in the the torturing and damnation of people for all eternity, because that is such a beautiful thing your god has bestowed us with. I mean the entire vastness and complexity of our grand universe was designed by your god for the purpose of testing the human species and sticking them in heaven/hell, does he have way to much free-time on his hands or something, not to mention I fail to see what god receives from any of this bullcrap.
[QUOTE=bIgFaTwOrM12;35774233]You do realize that the laws of the old testament have nothing to do with Christianity? Christianity is meant to be the discipleship of Christ, aka following what he said. Besides, there are prophecies in the old testament of Christ's coming and he said that he didn't come to abolish the law but to fulfill it(a reference to said prophecies). It just really pisses me off to have someone so arrogantly state such basic arguments that the could barely hold on their own if they were in a debate and didn't have a crowd of people cheering them on.
I was listening and he mentioned passages from the new testament as well, which would make his point incorrect from a Christian perspective.[/QUOTE]
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place."
“For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.”
"It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid."
"All scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for refutation, for correction, and for training in righteousness..."
"Know this first of all, that there is no prophecy of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation, for no prophecy ever came through human will; but rather human beings moved by the holy Spirit spoke under the influence of God."
"Whoever curses father or mother shall die" in Matthew (This one is exactly the same as a Old Testament law; the reason I post this is because the amount of laws echoed in the new testament from the old testament shows something)
“...the scripture cannot be broken.” John 10:35
“Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law" “For the law was given by Moses" John 1:17
I don't think you've read the bible.
Thank you kind sir above me, that was greatly helpful.
[QUOTE=Drax-Quin;35775207]It doesn't matter what Christians want to use, or what most use, it is distinctly part of their religion. Anyway didn't I already establish this is a fallacy of cherry picking, most Christians don't even know their own bible as studies have rightfully shown so to even begin with it's increasingly unlikely they even know which testament old or new they agree with or have decided to follow. I mean this video is pretty good depiction of this, all those Christians waltzing out the room because someone is quoting something from their bible, I mean it's right from their own book but they would rather not hear it, this is incredibly illogical.
Also on that list of what can potentially condemn you to hell you have covert thy neighbor and working on the sabbath. You know it's always good to know you believe in the the torturing and damnation of people for all eternity, because that is such a beautiful thing your god has bestowed us with. I mean the entire vastness and complexity of our grand universe was designed by your god for the purpose of testing the human species and sticking them in heaven/hell, does he have way to much free-time on his hands or something, not to mention I fail to see what god receives from any of this bullcrap.[/QUOTE]
Christianity is meant to be the following of Christ, not of the old testament laws, it's something called the new covenant which was brought into existence by Christ. Also I got the sense the people leaving were too offended to listen, but knew it would be futile to try and argue with someone amongst such a large group of cheering fans, I would have done the same as I find it hard to listen to people criticize Christianity with such basic and easily shot down arguments.
Anyways if you're going to get into the whole concept of heaven hell, I'll just say that hell was meant originally for angels, not for people. God didn't bestow it upon us, instead we chose it out of our own free will. Also, what God gets out of this is our companionship with him, which is the sole reason he creates us.
If you're going to keep asking questions like this I suggest you either look through a bible or PM them to me, I feel like we're cluttering up the thread.
EDIT:
[QUOTE=Governer Goblin;35775207]"Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place."
“For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.”
"It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid."
"All scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for refutation, for correction, and for training in righteousness..."
"Know this first of all, that there is no prophecy of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation, for no prophecy ever came through human will; but rather human beings moved by the holy Spirit spoke under the influence of God."
"Whoever curses father or mother shall die" in Matthew (This one is exactly the same as a Old Testament law; the reason I post this is because the amount of laws echoed in the new testament from the old testament shows something)
“...the scripture cannot be broken.” John 10:35
“Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law" “For the law was given by Moses" John 1:17
I don't think you've read the bible.[/QUOTE]
Ah yes, these quotes, I can tell when someone hasn't read much of the bible when the use them as they always use them out of context. If you read more than just the one verse of Jesus speaking of the law, he is referring to the prophecy that he has come to fulfill as he speaks of the prophets. The statement on the commandments is meant to refer to the ten commandments in the sense that the all of an equal punishment. The statement of all scripture being useful in some way barely seems like an argument, I'm not saying there's nothing to learn from the old testament, just that we are not under its harsh laws. When you mention Jesus's statement of old testament law, he is literally just quoting Moses to make a statement on how the laws of the old testament were not properly followed to begin with. That quote from John 1:17 is taken horribly out of context as it is stating that we are no longer under the old laws but the laws of grace. Like I said, if you want to keep asking me quesitons please just PM me or read the bible more thoroughly.
You know, all those quotes I posted are from Jesus right?
[editline]30th April 2012[/editline]
i mean, those are FROM the bible.
The look of sheer butthurt on the faces of the people leaving is awesome
“Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law" “For the law was given by Moses" John 1:17
Now apparently you cannot even read. Please read the above quotes from your Bible. My point was the people who are offended are silly, they're offended by something from their Bible being told back to them! I didn't say that had to try and argue, no they should instead try and listen not run away like little kids from what is the actual truth.
Oh you're kidding me right the free will argument, is that what you're going to pull out really? You claim it isn't for humans but in the next sentence you state it is for humans but we have free will, well no we bloody don't mate because I have zero evidence of your gods existence that isn't free will that's a straight unfair trip to damnation for all etenity for me.
Also you completely neglected my point, what does an all powerful being greater then anything in existence get out of making a bunch of apes (if you believe in evolution, whice I hope you do) on a tiny spec of dirt in a vast galaxy, believe in him? WHAT DOES HE GET OUT OF IT!!! EXPLAIN! He's supposed to be omnisicent, omniprescent and omnibelovelnt yet he needs to construct such a futile and pointless test, that he needs to stick two people in a Garden of Eden and put a tree of temptation in front of them and then get all angry when they eat from it. SOmething I might add he was well aware of because he would have forseen in the construction of Adam/Eve and the tree that they would inevitably eat from it, that is fucking pointless and makes no sense, why build a giant universe to inhabit a single shity planet with our insignificant and miniscule existance. Why would such a being of such significant intelligence do anything of this kind. Why does he even give a crap??
Angels now really, what is this crap. I suppose those unicorns are true to right, I mean seriously dude, If we're just magicking things into existence with no evidence and no proof if that's the level you're on, then this is going nowhere fast.
No you look through your own Bible. I've read it. Also questions like what? I posed one question which was how can you refer to the 10 commandments in one statment as an example of how one would perhaps end up in hell but that they didn't somehow by that reasoning constitue rules. Which you didn't actually seem to answer.
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35775362]"Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place."
“For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.”
"It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid."
"All scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for refutation, for correction, and for training in righteousness..."
"Know this first of all, that there is no prophecy of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation, for no prophecy ever came through human will; but rather human beings moved by the holy Spirit spoke under the influence of God."
"Whoever curses father or mother shall die" in Matthew (This one is exactly the same as a Old Testament law; the reason I post this is because the amount of laws echoed in the new testament from the old testament shows something)
“...the scripture cannot be broken.” John 10:35
“Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law" “For the law was given by Moses" John 1:17
I don't think you've read the bible.[/QUOTE]
When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, "If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her." John 8:7
"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye." Matthew 7:1-5
Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained. John 20:23
You really can't say "These are the rules you must follow" in christianity because the bible is a giant piece of self contradicting garbage. You can pick and choose what rules you want to follow, because it is logically impossible to follow every rule.
[img]http://filesmelt.com/dl/obummer.png[/img]
The comments are cringeworthy.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;35775714][img]http://filesmelt.com/dl/obummer.png[/img]
The comments are cringeworthy.[/QUOTE]
Try finding a political comment on youtube that isnt.
[QUOTE=Drax-Quin;35775522]“Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law" “For the law was given by Moses" John 1:17
Now apparently you cannot even read. Please read the above quotes from your Bible. My point was the people who are offended are silly, they're offended by something from their Bible being told back to them! I didn't say that had to try and argue, no they should instead try and listen not run away like little kids from what is the actual truth.
Oh you're kidding me right the free will argument, is that what you're going to pull out really? You claim it isn't for humans but in the next sentence you state it is for humans but we have free will, well no we bloody don't mate because I have zero evidence of your gods existence that isn't free will that's a straight unfair trip to damnation for all etenity for me.
Also you completely neglected my point, what does an all powerful being greater then anything in existence get out of making a bunch of apes (if you believe in evolution, whice I hope you do) on a tiny spec of dirt in a vast galaxy, believe in him? WHAT DOES HE GET OUT OF IT!!! EXPLAIN! He's supposed to be omnisicent, omniprescent and omnibelovelnt yet he needs to construct such a futile and pointless test, that he needs to stick two people in a Garden of Eden and put a tree of temptation in front of them and then get all angry when they eat from it. SOmething I might add he was well aware of because he would have forseen in the construction of Adam/Eve and the tree that they would inevitably eat from it, that is fucking pointless and makes no sense, why build a giant universe to inhabit a single shity planet with our insignificant and miniscule existance. Why would such a being of such significant intelligence do anything of this kind. Why does he even give a crap??
Angels now really, what is this crap. I suppose those unicorns are true to right, I mean seriously dude, If we're just magicking things into existence with no evidence and no proof if that's the level you're on, then this is going nowhere fast.
No you look through your own Bible. I've read it. Also questions like what? I posed one question which was how can you refer to the 10 commandments in one statment as an example of how one would perhaps end up in hell but that they didn't somehow by that reasoning constitue rules. Which you didn't actually seem to answer.[/QUOTE]
Firstly I edited my post to respond to Goblin Lord's. Also I already stated why God created us for our companionship, no through his own making but through our own free will, the idea is we choose to love God or not. If you had actually read your bible you would know that hell was made for angels originally as it says in Matthew 25:41. As for the ten commandments, I already stated that they are impossible to follow, the aren't rules because we can't hold true to them. The ten commandments are supposed to condemn us while grace saves us.
[QUOTE=bIgFaTwOrM12;35775437]Christianity is meant to be the following of Christ, not of the old testament laws, it's something called the new covenant which was brought into existence by Christ. [/quote]
Yeah? Why don't you look a few posts above you. Jesus kinda' tells you, in no uncertain terms, that he's NOT overriding the Old Testament. You do not get to steamroll on without addressing this. Point is, christianity includes old and new testaments, and you DON'T get to wriggle out of that fact. The Christian religion endorses some terrible shit, and you either need to own that, or realize that maybe your god isn't such a nice guy after all.
[quote]Anyways if you're going to get into the whole concept of heaven hell, I'll just say that hell was meant originally for angels, not for people. God didn't bestow it upon us, instead we chose it out of our own free will. Also, what God gets out of this is our companionship with him, which is the sole reason he creates us.[/quote]
No, I'm sorry. If god doesn't want humans to go to Hell, then why the fuck would they EVER go to Hell?
Don't give me this "choosing" bullshit. Is he god or isn't he? Does he have power over what happens to people, or doesn't he?
The very fact that hell is something god created, and people he doesn't like go there to writhe in agony —FOR...EVER...!— is enough to know that the guy and his son are neither good, nor merciful. Especially if the one unforgivable sin that'll get you a straight-ticket to the bad-place is DISBELIEF.
Disbelief —by the way— that is NOT a choice. I can not CHOOSE to believe something, I can only be convinced by something compelling. Christianity has FAILED in doing this, and if god is real, that is HIS FAILURE, not mine. What fucking sense does it makes for one of god's prime deciding factors over whether you're a worthy person, is whether or not you'll believe he exists with NO compelling or rational reason to do so? How is that FAIR? How is that REASONABLE? How is it NECESSARY?
And how, possibly, can this god love you as unconditionally as a parent, and send your immortal soul to burn in everlasting pain in the same breath?
Know how you like pretending christianity has nothing to do with the Old Testament? Well Heaven and Hell are NEW TESTAMENT baby, and the concept of Hell is probably THE most reprehensible thing about the Abrahamic religions.
Old Testament, New Testament... either way, you lose.
[QUOTE=J-Dude;35776003]Yeah? Why don't you look a few posts above you. Jesus kinda' tells you, in no uncertain terms, that he's NOT overriding the Old Testament. You do not get to steamroll on without addressing this. Point is, christianity includes old and new testaments, and you DON'T get to wriggle out of that fact. The Christian religion endorses some terrible shit, and you either need to own that, or realize that maybe your god isn't such a nice guy after all.
No, I'm sorry. If god doesn't want humans to go to Hell, then why the fuck would they EVER go to Hell?
Don't give me this "choosing" bullshit. Is he god or isn't he? Does he have power over what happens to people, or doesn't he?
The very fact that hell is something god created, and people he doesn't like go there to writhe in agony —FOR...EVER...!— is enough to know that the guy and his son are neither good, nor merciful. Especially if the one unforgivable sin that'll get you a straight-ticket to the bad-place is DISBELIEF.
Disbelief —by the way— that is NOT a choice. I can not CHOOSE to believe something, I can only be convinced by something compelling. Christianity has FAILED in doing this, and if god is real, that is HIS FAILURE, not mine. What fucking sense does it makes for one of god's prime deciding factors over whether you're a worthy person, is whether or not you'll believe he exists with NO compelling or rational reason to do so? How is that FAIR? How is that REASONABLE? How is it NECESSARY?
And how, possibly, can this god love you as unconditionally as a parent, and send your immortal soul to burn in everlasting pain in the same breath?
Know how you like pretending christianity has nothing to do with the Old Testament? Well Heaven and Hell are NEW TESTAMENT baby, and the concept of Hell is probably THE most reprehensible thing about the Abrahamic religions.
Old Testament, New Testament... either way, you lose.[/QUOTE]
Christ states that he comes to fulfill not abolish, he fulfilled the laws prophecies of Christ and brought grace in place of the old law.
Also believing God exists doesn't save you form hell, Christianity is about far more than just that. It's about whether you love him and whether you believe Christ died to bring grace. The choice is not God's over whether we go to heaven or hell it's ours, he wants our love for him to be genuine rather than forced.
You keep ignoring my list of quotes bigfatworm
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;35776178]You keep ignoring my list of quotes bigfatworm[/QUOTE]
I edited my reply a few posts up, here it is.
[QUOTE=bIgFaTwOrM12;35776178]Ah yes, these quotes, I can tell when someone hasn't read much of the bible when the use them as they always use them out of context. If you read more than just the one verse of Jesus speaking of the law, he is referring to the prophecy that he has come to fulfill as he speaks of the prophets. The statement on the commandments is meant to refer to the ten commandments in the sense that the all of an equal punishment. The statement of all scripture being useful in some way barely seems like an argument, I'm not saying there's nothing to learn from the old testament, just that we are not under its harsh laws. When you mention Jesus's statement of old testament law, he is literally just quoting Moses to make a statement on how the laws of the old testament were not properly followed to begin with. That quote from John 1:17 is taken horribly out of context as it is stating that we are no longer under the old laws but the laws of grace. Like I said, if you want to keep asking me quesitons please just PM me or read the bible more thoroughly.[/QUOTE]
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