Honestly, even latest Call of Duty games did better with mixing action and scenes. But in terms of action, Wolf 2 really delivers.
I'm guessing the people rating dumb didn't even bother watching the video?
I felt the same way. I was actually making the same points last night to a buddy who disagreed, but I genuinely felt like the stealth was pushed on you instead of being truly optional - in TNO, stealth wasn't present in every level, but in New Blood/New Colossus they made every level stealth based at the start and I found it obnoxious. Some argue that you can ignore the stealth and just run in guns blazing, but it's really not a realistic approach especially on the harder difficulties as the maps are large and allow you to be fired upon from multiple vantage points.
It might be an unpopular opinion and that's fine, I just feel like TNO was the best representation of the series and followed a format closer to DOOM instead of just lazy stealth mechanics.
[QUOTE=jonoPorter;52840558]I'm guessing the people rating dumb didn't even bother watching the video?[/QUOTE]
I watched it. Awful review. His main complaints about forced stealth sections are fucking ridiculous considering they are all optional.
[editline]31st October 2017[/editline]
Unlike the new order which had sections which [b]stripped you of all weapons[/b] and literally forced you to stealth
[QUOTE=redBadger;52840650]I watched it. Awful review. His main complaints about forced stealth sections are fucking ridiculous considering they are all optional.
[editline]31st October 2017[/editline]
Unlike the new order which had sections which [b]stripped you of all weapons[/b] and literally forced you to stealth[/QUOTE]
They may be optional but the game definitely pushes you towards stealth with the low health pool for a good portion of the game and high damage of most enemies. Completely disregarding his other very valid points and criticisms over this is a little silly.
[QUOTE=Kegan;52840799]They may be optional but the game definitely pushes you towards stealth with the low health pool for a good portion of the game and high damage of most enemies. Completely disregarding his other very valid points and criticisms over this is a little silly.[/QUOTE]
To add to this the stealth sections are very annoying this time around. The game has a really bad habit of putting the officers all the way across the base. If you get spotted it's pretty much game over, since the sheer number of soldiers spawning all around you will kill you in a seconds, even on normal difficulty. The game really needed the ability to move bodies. The point that he made about not being able to tell where officers are in multiple story buildings is defiantly true, there's a moment in New Orleans where one of the officers you need to kill is just sitting in a corner on the third floor and the other one is sitting in a different corner on the other side of the building on the second floor. This happens a lot since the officers this time around will hide while screaming for reinforcements. Realistic I guess, but absolutely infuriating to try and hunt them down since the "x" feet away with a vague indication of where they are just turns into a red circle making tracking them down that much harder.
[QUOTE=Kegan;52840799]Completely disregarding his other very valid points and criticisms over this is a little silly.[/QUOTE]
Can I disregard his dumb points of being upset a game has too much of a story, too many cutscenes, and is too political? Dude's commentary on the story makes it sound like he never played TNO. How can you say TNC's tone and content is "out of place" in comparison?
He's presenting the game like it's on MGS4's level of cutscenes with stealth sections between them. That's so far from reality. Watch it again and see how little he actually talks about normal gameplay.
[QUOTE=Super Muffin;52840948]Can I disregard his dumb points of being upset a game has too much of a story, too many cutscenes, [B]and is too political?[/B] Dude's commentary on the story makes it sound like he never played TNO. How can you say TNC's tone and content is "out of place" in comparison?[/QUOTE]
Alright, how the hell did he make it too political? He barely touched that topic, at this points its literally "oh god somebody doesn't like or criticizes this game about killing nazis?! what a fucking nazi".
[QUOTE=jonoPorter;52840976]Alright, how the hell did he make it too political? He barely touched that topic, at this points its literally "oh god somebody doesn't like or criticizes this game about killing nazis?! what a fucking nazi".[/QUOTE]
Aight I was wrong on that part. Was mostly remembering the awful comments on the video. But the rest of my post still stands.
There's like a 50% chance when scrubbing through the video you'll hear "stealth mechanics" or "sneak".
Damnit, that's what I was afraid of. Too much cinematics and skipping them isn't an option if you want to understand what's going on. The Old Blood balanced cinematics and gameplay the best, was hoping the sequel would be similar.
[QUOTE=Aetna;52840571]I felt the same way. I was actually making the same points last night to a buddy who disagreed, but I genuinely felt like the stealth was pushed on you instead of being truly optional - in TNO, stealth wasn't present in every level, but in New Blood/New Colossus they made every level stealth based at the start and I found it obnoxious. Some argue that you can ignore the stealth and just run in guns blazing, but it's really not a realistic approach especially on the harder difficulties as the maps are large and allow you to be fired upon from multiple vantage points.
It might be an unpopular opinion and that's fine, I just feel like TNO was the best representation of the series and followed a format closer to DOOM instead of just lazy stealth mechanics.[/QUOTE]
They didn't.
My first play through I kinda failed at stealth and forgot it was even a thing in Wolfenstein, and played the whole game as an action game.
Playing through it again, stealthily on max difficulty really makes me realize how many options they gave you in this game, because it does feel like less, but it isn't really less.
[editline]31st October 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=Kegan;52840799]They may be optional but the game definitely pushes you towards stealth with the low health pool for a good portion of the game and high damage of most enemies. Completely disregarding his other very valid points and criticisms over this is a little silly.[/QUOTE]
I very strongly disagree based on my play experiences
Here are his New Order and Old Blood reviews for context
[Media]https://youtu.be/YGI1S92irRY[/Media]
[Media]https://youtu.be/WG-o7f73_IY[/Media]
The game should of been like TOB where it was about 10% story 90% action.
[QUOTE=richard9311;52841322]Here are his New Order and Old Blood reviews for context
[Media]https://youtu.be/YGI1S92irRY[/Media]
[Media]https://youtu.be/WG-o7f73_IY[/Media][/QUOTE]
Watching the first review made it seem liked he thought it was average.
But then immediately in the second one he makes it seem like it was the best game in the world.
[QUOTE=redBadger;52842654]Watching the first review made it seem liked he thought it was average.
But then immediately in the second one he makes it seem like it was the best game in the world.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, the biggest criticism I have with him is that he isn't very consistent between reviews.
He used to be my favorite reviewer but watching him more and more he's so inconsistent, he seems to selectively pick criticisms in his reviews for certain games and he shows a lot of bias, and people who mention it he seems to respond to with a snarky "you're wrong" attitude.
I cannot agree with this review more. Wolf 2 has been the biggest disappoint for me as an fan of TNO and TOB.
The gunplay is pretty damn amazing, but my biggest gripe is how clunky switching duel wielded weapons is. It's very cumbersome and really takes away from the action sometimes. It would've been done better if the F keys were available to you to switch instead.
The gameplay itself is just not enough, man. I was just ITCHING for more after I finished the game and I feel like there weren't nearly enough chair clenching moments like in TNO. And the end game is pitiful and all for just achievements which on their own do not feel worthwhile to grab. I could forgive all of this if the writing for this game wasn't so bad.
The writing is atrocious and honestly it's a coin flip between cringing or gagging whenever a cutscene pops up. There is no rhyme or rhythm to how the script is executed and all the emotion you felt from TNO is gone and out the window. The new characters are greatly shoehorned in and I honestly don't get the same kind of bonding experience with them like I did in TNO.
Overall, it's a 3 out of 5 at the very least. But a game that should be picked up on sale.
[QUOTE=Destroyox;52843060]Yeah, the biggest criticism I have with him is that he isn't very consistent between reviews.[/QUOTE]
Well he's human, and a guy who reviews mostly shooters on Youtube. I dunno how he became relatively mainstream nowadays, but it's not like he's particularly defining or special beyond his shiet sonny jims, just nice to watch. :v:
[QUOTE=OD78891;52843219]I cannot agree with this review more. Wolf 2 has been the biggest disappoint for me as an fan of TNO and TOB.
The gunplay is pretty damn amazing, but my biggest gripe is how clunky switching duel wielded weapons is. It's very cumbersome and really takes away from the action sometimes. It would've been done better if the F keys were available to you to switch instead.
The gameplay itself is just not enough, man. I was just ITCHING for more after I finished the game and I feel like there weren't nearly enough chair clenching moments like in TNO. And the end game is pitiful and all for just achievements which on their own do not feel worthwhile to grab. I could forgive all of this if the writing for this game wasn't so bad.
The writing is atrocious and honestly it's a coin flip between cringing or gagging whenever a cutscene pops up. There is no rhyme or rhythm to how the script is executed and all the emotion you felt from TNO is gone and out the window. The new characters are greatly shoehorned in and I honestly don't get the same kind of bonding experience with them like I did in TNO.
Overall, it's a 3 out of 5 at the very least. But a game that should be picked up on sale.[/QUOTE]
I honestly wish I understood what about the writing was "atrocious".
[QUOTE=redBadger;52842654]Watching the first review made it seem liked he thought it was average.
But then immediately in the second one he makes it seem like it was the best game in the world.[/QUOTE]
I gotta say, I love thinking about TNO, but it wasn't all great when I was actually playing through it. Camping NPCs, weird spawn points, the item pickup mechanic (which they still left in TNC! What the fuck?)
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52843238]I honestly wish I understood what about the writing was "atrocious".[/QUOTE]
Severe tonal whiplash.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52843238]I honestly wish I understood what about the writing was "atrocious".[/QUOTE]
I wouldn't say it's atrocious, but with the focus the game puts on the story, the script's issues become apparent.
TNO had a weird tone, where it went "isn't it fun to punch Nazis and dual-weild giant shotguns on the moon?" right after BJ went on about Nazi camps and millions of killed Jews. It sort of worked in TNO, though, since it came off as parody of super-duper serious stuff other games did (Spec Ops comes to mind)..
In TNC the story tried to be more earnest, and it kind of kills the parody tone. We are expected to have fun bashing into Nazis and gibbing them, and care about BJ's future kids and abusive father. The fuck?
And the thing is, sometimes the earnest parts really succeed. The child scenes with Billy work amazingly well considering the game they're in, some small scenes on the submarine also work really well, the Max Hass stuff is still good.
Pretty mind boggling that you still need to mash the use key to pick up stuff. It was such a glaring and widely criticised issue in TNO that I was sure they would be changing that in the sequel.
[QUOTE=Ryo Ohki;52844028]Pretty mind boggling that you still need to mash the use key to pick up stuff. It was such a glaring and widely criticised issue in TNO that I was sure they would be changing that in the sequel.[/QUOTE]
There is an autopickup mechanic though it's a bit inconsistent.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52843238]I honestly wish I understood what about the writing was "atrocious".[/QUOTE]
I'll go ahead and throw down some but keep in mind they might be spoiler heavy
[sp]The first atrocious writing happens after a lot of the new characters get introduced. Super Spesh in particular is obnoxiously over the top and is used as a tension breaker this time around. His talk about space aliens with every single piece of dialogue that he has is drawn out and predictable. Even to his death. He's good in short spurts but the game doesn't think so and pushes him in your mission line until his timely expire.
Grace is the next offender and plays a stereotypical Black Panther Party member and moves in with the old crew too fast. No character build up or any sense of having these people not being trust worthy at the start or vice versa. The game should've had a conflict where you try to bridge these two groups together rather than "Oh hey I guess we should work together and take over and move in all our shit." It's highly unbelievable and breaks the flow of the story and leaves no room for imagination. Not to Mention Horton and Graces' ending speech is so forced and comes off uninspiring as well as just cringy. Wyatt's ending, that being said is actually quite good. Until the Twister Sister death metal cover comes on and ruins all of it. (gross)
Then there is the forced Abusive Dad scenes. Rather than show us over time through small pieces of dialogue or conversations with Blazko and another party; you get this shoehorned "YOUR DAD IS A BAD MAN!". In particular the scene where you are forced to miss/shoot the dog just made me angry on how tasteless it was. If you played Spec Ops the Line you should know that a game does best to make you feel emotion by making you feel like you're doing nothing wrong at all until the end. The one scene you think that his dad is actually human and shows some sense of being a father and maybe there is some good character development (The monster in the basement scene) is thrown out the fucking window when you find his dad just chilling in their old house still alive and now the same piece of shit he was back then.[/sp]
These are only just a few and I haven't even scratched the surface. It just sucks that all the great writing in TNO is nowhere to be found in this one.
[QUOTE=OD78891;52844170]I'll go ahead and throw down some but keep in mind they might be spoiler heavy
[sp]The first atrocious writing happens after a lot of the new characters get introduced. Super Spesh in particular is obnoxiously over the top and is used as a tension breaker this time around. His talk about space aliens with every single piece of dialogue that he has is drawn out and predictable. Even to his death. He's good in short spurts but the game doesn't think so and pushes him in your mission line until his timely expire.[/sp][/quote]
[sp]I'm playing through it again, he's in about 1/3 of the game, and yes he is explicitly comic relief. However I didn't really have a problem with that. Yeah the stakes are high, everyone else is serious, but here's a capable if not ridiculous character. The space aliens thing I think was done just because the plot was going to Roswell and it works as a good foil. I actually thought much of this was good writing, some of his comedic timing pieces were off. I feel like GGmanlives didn't put in the whole context of that "toilet humour" scene in though. In the scene he first sees the toilet he kinda freaks out, then you can listen to him shit in that toilet for however long it is, but he'll be in there until that next cutscene after the task you have at hand is done. I actually found some humour in that. Toilet humour doesn't make something lowbrow. And they do kill him very quickly I felt[/sp]
[quote][sp]Grace is the next offender and plays a stereotypical Black Panther Party member and moves in with the old crew too fast. No character build up or any sense of having these people not being trust worthy at the start or vice versa. The game should've had a conflict where you try to bridge these two groups together rather than "Oh hey I guess we should work together and take over and move in all our shit." It's highly unbelievable and breaks the flow of the story and leaves no room for imagination. Not to Mention Horton and Graces' ending speech is so forced and comes off uninspiring as well as just cringy. Wyatt's ending, that being said is actually quite good. Until the Twister Sister death metal cover comes on and ruins all of it. (gross) [/sp][/quote]
[sp]Well... She was? I mean I'm kinda tired of repeating this but she was based on a real life person during the civil rights movement, and I fail to see how that's bad writing because that's a character you personally struggle to sympathize with. The group gives her control because they're a democracy, and everyone sees merit to her plan. She's been fighting the nazi's as long as they have, she's qualified and she's a leader. Don't forget the death of Caroline was a massive, massive hit to the whole group, they were looking for anyone to believe in, and Caroline already believed in Grace so it was easy. The one thing I felt was poorly handled was Grace taking Carolines room. I think this is just an issue out of your personal taste, not example of attrocious writing. [/sp]
[QUOTE]
[sp]Then there is the forced Abusive Dad scenes. Rather than show us over time through small pieces of dialogue or conversations with Blazko and another party; you get this shoehorned "YOUR DAD IS A BAD MAN!". In particular the scene where you are forced to miss/shoot the dog just made me angry on how tasteless it was. If you played Spec Ops the Line you should know that a game does best to make you feel emotion by making you feel like you're doing nothing wrong at all until the end. The one scene you think that his dad is actually human and shows some sense of being a father and maybe there is some good character development (The monster in the basement scene) is thrown out the fucking window when you find his dad just chilling in their old house still alive and now the same piece of shit he was back then.[/sp][/QUOTE]
[sp]I'm sorry but I don't get this critique. I thought this was demonstrated really well. Abusive people don't always become redemptive, and I don't think BJ's dad was going to when the Nazi's was something he wouldn't have opposed in the first place back in the scenes we see in 1919.[/sp]
[QUOTE]These are only just a few and I haven't even scratched the surface. It just sucks that all the great writing in TNO is nowhere to be found in this one.[/QUOTE]
The only thing I really feel like TNO was better with significantly was the internal dialogue of BJ. That suffered. other than that I was pretty pleased with the writing.
[editline]1st November 2017[/editline]
Also, the more you just chill on the boat and walk around and listen to people as the story progresses, the more the game fills in things.
And I don't think that's any different from TNO.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52844281]
Also, the more you just chill on the boat and walk around and listen to people as the story progresses, the more the game fills in things.
And I don't think that's any different from TNO.[/QUOTE]
My main complaint about all this is that there is a lack of depth with every new character that is introduced. What you see is what you get. A good example of depth done well in a timely manner is Anya's story of her [sp] Going into great lengths in killing nazis and even getting pregnant and terminating her would be child and she tried to cover it all up by saying it's her cousins' diary.[/sp]
Things like that were missing and sometimes these almost perfect characters were found out to be more darker or even lighter in their actual first appearance.
[QUOTE=OD78891;52844630]My main complaint about all this is that there is a lack of depth with every new character that is introduced. What you see is what you get. A good example of depth done well in a timely manner is Anya's story of her [sp] Going into great lengths in killing nazis and even getting pregnant and terminating her would be child and she tried to cover it all up by saying it's her Aunts' diary.[/sp]
Things like that were missing and sometimes these almost perfect characters were found out to be more darker or even lighter in their actual first appearance.[/QUOTE]
Those were collectible journals in the first game.
That same kind of content still exists so I just don't really get it? Maybe it wasn't presented as well? I saw plenty of moments that fleshed out the characters around me by just wandering the uboat and reading and listening to things.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52844649]Those were collectible journals in the first game.
That same kind of content still exists so I just don't really get it? Maybe it wasn't presented as well? I saw plenty of moments that fleshed out the characters around me by just wandering the uboat and reading and listening to things.[/QUOTE]
They were not collectibles. Anya read them to you during certain segments in the game. Mostly when the action was low and you were traveling to a destination. BJ's inner monologues were also present during these times and were much better delivered.
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