Obviously no-one is pro-rape, but a mass social movement just ends up as a mob when this requires finer action.
Just have some faith that people who know what they're doing are working on it, no need to save the world yourself.
Misinformation and moral fervor? Thats explains alot.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;44997405]Misinformation and moral fervor? Thats explains alot.[/QUOTE]
Alright so let's just point out your posting habits.
You come in, leave a heated statement, then back out before people are willing to argue with you.
Jesus christ could you fucking [I]stop it[/I] already.
[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;44997628]
You come in, leave a heated statement, then back out before people are willing to argue with you.
[/QUOTE]
Like all of those times I ended up arguing for 10+ pages with people?
All of this rape culture stuff is just getting out of hand. Its so obvious that society demonizes and hates rapists (but we can tolerate it if you're an athlete) but so many people say the opposite.
(Old as fuck)
[QUOTE=Dr. Gestapo;42310507]
Stealing. It's bad. We teach kids not to do it.
Assault. Bad. We teach kids not to do it.
Murder. Horrible thing. We teach kids not to do it.
Rape is bad, but some reason we don't tell kids not to do it, or in fact discuss it at all.
[/QUOTE]
read the comments on the video, it's pretty great
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;44997699](Old as fuck)[/QUOTE]
I'm not sure you understand how dumb that quote is.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;44997699]Like all of those times I ended up arguing for 10+ pages with people?
All of this rape culture stuff is just getting out of hand. Its so obvious that society demonizes and hates rapists (but we can tolerate it if you're an athlete) but so many people say the opposite.
(Old as fuck)[/QUOTE]
rape culture and all this talk about both rape and how widespread it is compared to what everyone assumes will be "getting out of hand" when rape isn't something that constantly happens to young men and women in a completely developed country. When rape stops being one of the only times you can legally admit to doing it as a defense and get away with it. When girls in India aren't being raped and hung for trying to go to the fucking bathroom.
Sometimes guys are falsely accused. Sometimes accusal of rape can be a powerful weapon. This doesn't diminish the fact that it happens far too often for a civilized society and is often unpunished or in very rare cases rewarded(and I do mean INCREDIBLY rare.)
I get that you're on some anti-feminist mra style crusade half the time you post and I can pretty easily ignore you when it comes to anything else but please stop posting about rape when you have nothing but ignorant or misleading comments. All you do is give people who think rape is a laughing matter a platform.
[editline]4th June 2014[/editline]
also I kind of agree with this video on most things, but at the same time rape culture is an entirely real thing, just grossly overplayed. Especially in America.
[editline]4th June 2014[/editline]
It's worse in more worse off countries or places like Saudi Arabia and the like. There I think rape culture shines as a very real thing. But in America? Especially on college campuses? Definitely nowhere near as much.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;44997699]Like all of those times I ended up arguing for 10+ pages with people?
[/QUOTE]
You proud of that?
[QUOTE=Paige;44998288]rape culture and all this talk about both rape and how widespread it is compared to what everyone assumes will be "getting out of hand" when rape isn't something that constantly happens to young men and women in a completely developed country. When rape stops being one of the only times you can legally admit to doing it as a defense and get away with it. When girls in India aren't being raped and hung for trying to go to the fucking bathroom.
Sometimes guys are falsely accused. Sometimes accusal of rape can be a powerful weapon. This doesn't diminish the fact that it happens far too often for a civilized society and is often unpunished or in very rare cases rewarded(and I do mean INCREDIBLY rare.)
I get that you're on some anti-feminist mra style crusade half the time you post and I can pretty easily ignore you when it comes to anything else but please stop posting about rape when you have nothing but ignorant or misleading comments. All you do is give people who think rape is a laughing matter a platform.
[editline]4th June 2014[/editline]
also I kind of agree with this video on most things, but at the same time rape culture is an entirely real thing, just grossly overplayed. Especially in America.
[editline]4th June 2014[/editline]
It's worse in more worse off countries or places like Saudi Arabia and the like. There I think rape culture shines as a very real thing. But in America? Especially on college campuses? Definitely nowhere near as much.[/QUOTE]
boy you sure do know an awful lot about how much rape and rape accusations occur in various places. what do you base your information on?? source??
[QUOTE=Wingz;44999240]boy you sure do know an awful lot about how much rape and rape accusations occur in various places. what do you base your information on?? source??[/QUOTE]
This might very well win 'shitpost of the thread'.
Has some tough competition, though.
[QUOTE=NOR_92;44999485]This might very well win 'shitpost of the thread'.[/QUOTE]
thanks man
glad i didnt win "best jerk of the thread"
guys holy shit, when they said drinking culture they showed my school. East carolina University is known as a massive drinking school lol. Im transferring to New York soon anyway
[QUOTE=Wingz;44999240]boy you sure do know an awful lot about how much rape and rape accusations occur in various places. what do you base your information on?? source??[/QUOTE]
Nah, the both the examples are pretty well known. He thought that possibly people would know about them since they're in the news so often.
Here's an incident from 2012 about a gang rape in deli that finally pushed India's women over the edge and led to widespread protests: [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Delhi_gang_rape[/url]
And of course here's Saudi Arabia ([url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatif_rape_case[/url] and [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_in_Saudi_Arabia[/url]) where rape victims are often persecuted.
I barely needed to google that.
[QUOTE=doomkiwi;44999766]Nah, the both the examples are pretty well known. He thought that possibly people would know about them since they're in the news so often.
Here's an incident from 2012 about a gang rape in deli that finally pushed India's women over the edge and led to widespread protests: [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Delhi_gang_rape[/url]
And of course here's Saudi Arabia ([url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatif_rape_case[/url] and [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_in_Saudi_Arabia[/url]) where rape victims are often persecuted.
I barely needed to google that.[/QUOTE]
2 rape cases and rape statistics from an underdeveloped and women-hating country
gj man
you showed me
[QUOTE=Wingz;44999837]2 rape cases and rape statistics from an underdeveloped and women-hating country
gj man
you showed me[/QUOTE]
Holy shit, you must be trolling
[QUOTE=NOR_92;45000049]Holy shit, you must be trolling[/QUOTE]
why, is it because of his style of posting?
[QUOTE=Kite_shugo;45000089]why, is it because of his style of posting?[/QUOTE]
Because he's rude and what he's saying doesn't make any sense
Being willfully ignorant of both common knowledge with both world news and recent rape trials here in America in general isn't my issue to solve. Your ignorance falls on your shoulders. It's not like anything I've said requires more than 10 seconds of googling.
[editline]4th June 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=doomkiwi;44999766]-links and the like-[/QUOTE]
Pretty much this. Not hard to find even for someone not actively looking.
When I hear the term "rape culture" it refers to a cultural setting which makes rape likely - it doesn't literally mean every dude is a rapist, but it might mean they are complicit in it.
Rape culture is not saying anything when a dude is walking home with someone too drunk to function, assuming consent is "no means no" instead of "yes means yes", thinking that just because a girl accuses her boyfriend of rape that suddenly that means "they are lying." And its all that fucking shit that swarms around it, like how when we hear about a rape case with a young dude our first thought is to instantly lament that he had "such a bright future ahead of him" and that it was wasted because "some slut" spoke up about the shit he did to her.
[editline]4th June 2014[/editline]
Lets not forget that statistics on rape are difficult to determine because the vast majority of sexual assaults go unreported....
Remember Steubenville?
This girl talks like a robot.
FYI this video is by the American Enterprise Institute, a conservative think tank. I'm not saying that makes it wrong or anything, but it probably contains as much bias (in the opposite direction) as the sort of tumblr feminist video that facepunchers love showering with dumbs.
[QUOTE=Larikang;45001113]FYI this video is by the American Enterprise Institute, a conservative think tank. I'm not saying that makes it wrong or anything, but it probably contains as much bias (in the opposite direction) as the sort of tumblr feminist video that facepuncher's love showering with dumbs.[/QUOTE]
Why worry about possible bias when the video doesn't even go to the minimum of providing sources for any of the statistics or information it says? The fact that such a poorly referenced, 4 minute video is getting so many ratings shows that when it comes to complex subjects like this, people on FP would rather just silently nod to the talking head on their monitor confirming all their personal beliefs rather than be legitimately educated.
On topic though in so far as I can tell the Bureau of Justice Statistics number is completely made up. The 2005 study doesn't have a single entry related to sexual assaults (or any crime statistics) on college campuses. The "1 in 5 women will be raped" comment is inaccurate but that is a strawman built by people and has no real basis in reality; the number was always "1 in 5 women will be sexually assaulted" which is far more general than rape.
To be entirely honest I was willing to go into this video and accept that the idea of "rape culture" might be a [I]bit [/I]hysterical but I can't give any credit to anything so intellectually dishonest as this.
Ive got to agree with raidyr. The video while having some good points felt very... dishonest in general. Accusing one side of more or less making up statistics while expecting their statistics to be taken as fact
[QUOTE=Raidyr;45001349]Why worry about possible bias when the video doesn't even go to the minimum of providing sources for any of the statistics or information it says? The fact that such a poorly referenced, 4 minute video is getting so many ratings shows that when it comes to complex subjects like this, people on FP would rather just silently nod to the talking head on their monitor confirming all their personal beliefs rather than be legitimately educated.
On topic though in so far as I can tell the Bureau of Justice Statistics number is completely made up. The 2005 study doesn't have a single entry related to sexual assaults (or any crime statistics) on college campuses. The "1 in 5 women will be raped" comment is inaccurate but that is a strawman built by people and has no real basis in reality; the number was always "1 in 5 women will be sexually assaulted" which is far more general than rape.
To be entirely honest I was willing to go into this video and accept that the idea of "rape culture" might be a [I]bit [/I]hysterical but I can't give any credit to anything so intellectually dishonest as this.[/QUOTE]
I don't even know what's true anymore. Both sides keep muddying the truth and distorting the "facts" that I find learning anything related to rape fruitless because there's going to be bias.
I think the biggest problem in internet rape arguments is that there's always a minority of people that butt in with stupid questions like "what's worse, rape or murder?" or "what about the FALSELY ACCUSED?" or some shit like that. The only time people bring up shit like that is if a) they're super uniformed and have no idea how to even begin to post in threads like this b) they're trying to stir up shit by making others jump through hoops to try to find some chink in their defense.
Like, yeah, I'm going to be stumped if you bring up some hyperbolized situation that brands me as a fucking immoral jackass unless I conform to your argument. That happened to me in some thread a few weeks ago, some poster whose name I already forgot was going like "why come people get upset when rape is mentioned but not murder???? do you think murder is GOOD?"
Then there's that bit with the male victims. Just because I don't mention both male and female victims of rape all at once doesn't mean that I'm dismissing them. It's possible to think both of those types of rape are equally horrendous, which they are, without having to do some stupid mental juggling in order to equally represent the two.
I'm about to leave for work so my mental train of thought kind of died here, I'll add more later.
[editline]4th June 2014[/editline]
But short version so I can remember what the fuck I'm talking about for when i get back:
bringing up hypothetical anecdotal bullshit = uninformed, or trying to start shit
getting upset because somebody doesn't bring up male rape while talking about female rape = uninformed, trying to start shit.
unfortunately most of the stuff i've brought up is from people trying to start shit like rangergxi.
[editline]4th June 2014[/editline]
Oh, another thing I've got beef with? Citing random tumblr blogs as proof that "these SJWs are crazy!" I don't care if the tumblr people are REAL or whatever, because they aren't part of this debate so their points aren't relevant if the only reason you're bringing them up is for shock value.
How about you argue with me? I'm right here, I can articulate my opinions right here, right at you.
Same goes for posting videos from TAA, TF, and that one internet guy who has like an hour's worth of video making fun of tumblr users. Sure, whatever, they suck, they're crazy, they hate men, but going out of your goddamn way to find the worst of the worst isn't really helping your side of the argument, because you could have easily put that effort into finding better users on the site, or writing your own post.
Like, most of the posting I've done in these kind of threads has been deflecting those kind of "arguments." As much as I'd love to grab screenshots from /r9k/ and r/mensrights, I refrain from doing that because I think it cheapens MY words, as cheesy as that sounds. I shouldn't have to speak for everybody who labels themselves a feminist, much like you don't have to speak for crazy MRA fucks like you-know-who in the news. A
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;45001611]
Like, most of the posting I've done in these kind of threads has been deflecting those kind of "arguments." As much as I'd love to grab screenshots from /r9k/ and r/mensrights, I refrain from doing that because I think it cheapens MY words, as cheesy as that sounds. I shouldn't have to speak for everybody who labels themselves a feminist, much like you don't have to speak for crazy MRA fucks like you-know-who in the news. A[/QUOTE]
Strawmanning occurs in virtually every argument on FP but it's taken to ridiculous levels of absurdity and, more frustrating, acceptance when it comes to threads about feminism.
No other topic I've seen on these boards can be utterly derailed by just pointing at the extremely small, incredibly irrelevant fringe elements of any group.
Imagine it in gun debate threads, arguably the most common and heated arguments you find on FP. "Yeah there was this crazy dude with guns that called Obama a nigger and ranted about FEMA camps so your entire ideology about private firearms ownership, personal rights, self-defense, and the second amendment are null and void". That post would be a box castle in 3 minutes. Yet when it comes to feminists (and, lets be real here, egalitarians in general) it's a perfectly acceptable logical leap to perform.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;45001611]
How about you argue with me? I'm right here, I can articulate my opinions right here, right at you.
[/QUOTE]
You haven't replied to a single argument applied against you in recent threads that I've witnessed.
Just saying.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;45002513]You haven't replied to a single argument applied against you in recent threads that I've witnessed.
Just saying.[/QUOTE]
tbh, half the time it's ranger and the usual shitlords who just don't listen no matter how many academic references you throw at them, no matter how well you word your shit, etc. Half the trouble makers in these threads are purposefully obtuse and skirt around the actual debate all the time, why waste time even trying with them?
[editline]edited[/editline]
Speak of the devils. I can only assume we've performed some kind of arcane ritual than attracted them again. This isn't the usual "hit and run" rating.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.
