Migrant children and families now face indefinite detention by US - Polidicks

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jun/30/migrant-children-and-families-now-face-indefinite-detention-by-us As VOX correctly puts it (but who I can't use as a primary source because they are Left rather than Center-left): According to Friday’s court filing, the administration acknowledges that it can’t separate families anymore (after Judge Sabraw’s ruling from Tuesday night). That means, the administration says, that it has to be allowed to detain families for as long as it takes to complete their cases. Empirically, that isn’t true: there are options beyond detention and separation. The Trump administration has the option to release families together — what Trump and his officials deride as “catch-and-release” — or to use “alternatives to detention” to monitor migrants and make sure they show up to court But DOJ maintains that it doesn’t need to use those alternatives if it doesn’t want to, because the law always gives the government the power to choose to keep any adult in immigration detention (and even sometimes requires them to do so). And in the case of parents caught crossing the US-Mexico border between ports of entry, it is choosing detention. It's here - we are now holding people indefinitely in concentration camps in flagrant violation of their Constitutional rights where they are forced in to labor to eat or have toilet paper, where children are being chemically restrained before being shipped off to 'wherever' with no expectation they'll be returned, where many of these facilities are being run by a company which has been convicted of human trafficking, in overcrowded facilities or tent camps with insufficient staff and supplies. The next step is closing the borders and declaring immigration of any sort illegal.

Empirically, that isn’t true: there are options beyond detention and separation. The Trump administration has the option to release families together — what Trump and his officials deride as “catch-and-release” — or to use “alternatives to detention” to monitor migrants and make sure they show up to court See, there's a tiny problem with this logic. It assumes that this garbage fire of an administration has even a shred of empathy or a functioning brain.

Holy fuck. This is so insane, does anyone in the current administration realize the gravity of this situation? Literally concentration camps. Pretty soon they're going to run out of housing, then what?

Then they use the political prop they've carefully built.

invite all the immigrants to take a nice hot shower...

Why kick brown people out when you can kep them and make them suffer. The constitution is nothing more than toilet paper for the current administration it seems.

Hang on I want to be the first one to not get a dumb off Boilrig. I hate immigrants and hope they all get thrown into a big volcano.

@Boilrig Care to elaborate and offer your thoughts on the matter?

He has none. People like him just come in and carpet bomb threads with dumbs and babies without contributing. Unless it’s Brexit. He’s more than happy to talk about the ‘wonderful’ idea that is Brexit. That said, we’re becoming closer and closer to the day of Japanese internment camps and, given the gibbon in chief’s crippling racism, concentration camps.

I'd like to believe this but I'm fairly sure most second amendment friends are explicitly supporting this administration

Well I can say over here we just detain them in a normal prison until its sorted, and since theres some backlog, its usually a couple months, I believe we can hold asylum/refugees for 6 months in a prison, with a 28 day extension after that. While I'm not a fan of indefinite holding, my country holds no land border, thus illegal entry is rare and asylum seekers usually hand themselves over at the airport. I can easily see my government changing the law to hold someone close to indefinite if it became an everyday issue.

So what are your thoughts on this American subject?

I'm fine with indefinite holding while processed if caught crossing illegally, purely as a discouragement to others and to encourage others to hand themselves in through the actual legal process that people have been using for years. You should in no way be rewarded for queue jumping, especially if the situation in Mexico doesn't appear to warrant crossing illegally.

You just said yourself that illegals are rare and asylum seekers are handed over at the airport; neither of those happen here. What we’ve got is, apparently, frequent and any asylum seekers are just imprisoned anyway and sent to Trump’s Illegal Fun House™ Nothing is getting sorted out, and no one in the administration cares, and if they do, want to go harder against immigrants instead. Shit’s fucked here, and indefinite detainment is just going to fuck up our economy even more, just look at our disgrace for a privatized prison system.

Not all of these people seeking asylum in the US are coming from Mexico. Honduras is having an insane gang violence problem, with teenage boys threatened to join gangs or die, often causing them to flee the country to escape the gang's reach. El Salvador's having some big issues that're causing people to flee. And then on the topic of Mexico itself the cartels are murderous and control entire swaths of territory. Consider the recent story of a town's entire police force being arrested after a local political candidate challenging the incumbent was murdered. These people are seeking asylum. Asylum seeking is a protected status and if you claim asylum there are certain rights you are supposed to have, according to US law in accordance with ratified international law, such as the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. You must be in the US or at an entry point to claim asylum, and even if you enter the country illegally if you claim asylum your rights as a claimant are supposed to be protected. America has thrown these laws out the window because Trump doesn't want to give due process to groups of people he and his base hate. It's not a reward to be treated with the human rights guarantees America has for years respected but has now decided to ignore because of an increasingly fascist president listening to quisling anti-immigration hardliner Stephen Miller.

While I agree, illegally crossing the border states the intent of that asylum seeker, especially if the asylum seeker is caught weeks after being in the US and not handing themselves in to immigration authorities as fast as possible as stated in UN documentation, due to that intent, as well as the situation at the border of being what is referred to by the UN as 'mixed migration' means indefinite holding is the best option for those who did illegally cross. The international law may protect these people, but now, and as my own countries example, countries are setting their own rules with detaining these people and unless their asylum/refugee/whatever case is not actually being processed which would be a violation of said laws, then it should be up to member countries to decide their hold length.

I think it is painfully, painfully obvious that this is not working. What's your plan B? People are still flooding in and the federal government does not have the infrastructure or finances to just keep building bigger and bigger prisons for entire families to live in forever.

Trump is forcing the situation to require a wall, and a wall they shall need.

Why are we getting all these brown people from fascist regimes we actively and covertly helped support? 🤔 People act like "we stopped enslaving people over a century ago" and such, so everything is solved, but no, we've been fucking garbage the entire time since. We're still being garbage. Blows my fucking mind that people defend this shit as "why is this my problem?" When america still is practicing pseudo colonialism.

Galaxy brain: fuck up South American countries with installed dictators then indefnitely detain the refugees and migrants

Youre an moron if you still think a wall will stop them at this point. Majority of illegals come by plane and stay past their visitation.

But we fought communism!!! Historical context just doesn't matter to people anymore. And if they aren't actively oppressing people, oppression doesn't exist.

We need a big, logistical nightmare of a wall like we need another 4 years of this fat fucking idiot of a president at the helm. The wall is just his big ugly campaign promise used to sucker and rally the racist supporters while the rest of his sleazy showman ways enamoured his other supporters. He's just trying to get it up so they don't turn around and maul him for it. And if you think this magical wall is going to stop illegal entry into the country, then you might have been gullible enough to vote for him had you the chance.

An issue with all countries that can probably be fixed by funding. I'm more concerned about the next crisis, the next GFC that causes the already unstable south america to collapse and cause what I believe will be the biggest movement of economic migration the world has ever seen, big enough that it would be considered hostile in numbers and an valid threat to the US to the point of gunning them down on the border after repeated warnings to stop. I see the wall for that situation, not the current one.

"economic migration" have you even seen what's going on down there lately? Also holy fucking shit.

Uh, no. I just value the rule of law and the ability for a country to determine the status of the people who cross its border, either legally or illegally. It means the situation will eventually develop to the point where the US will consider everyone south of the border to not hold a valid asylum claim.

Yeah determinism for countries is great. That's why the west (US mostlY) has been systemically denying that to people around the world in the name of....freedom or something.

in boilrig's world, law only applies to humans, not the teeming masses of brown invaders coming to infest our country

Doesn't mean they suddenly have a right to enter the country. No, that is where I see it going, that is why I'd prefer a wall before such an event does happen because there is no way the US will ever let such a number of people across.

Fundamental disagreement here then. I don't believe our country gets to abuse the world for economic gain and then try to have it's cake when the actions originating from abhorrent profiteering result in large groups of humans suffering.