Immigrants setting fire to 60 cars at frölunda torg in Sweden - General

https://youtu.be/fx1OyEK3PNE Livestream of it: Zagros Hama 🐸🐊 was LIVE

It doesn't look like anything to us. Just looks like some youth is having fun. Move along, nothing to see here *puts my head into the sand*

Yeah it's sad how people and politicians are still trying to keep things like this silent or write it of as pranks. I'm from one of Swedens worst cities and when I moved to Västerås/Stockholm to study I saw that it's now the same pretty much everywhere. Got my hopes up for this election though.

You sure they're (if not you're) not making shit up when uploading this? I can't tell from the graininess that they're immigrants.

From the news thread regarding this: https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/206613/ecd1db67-c049-4144-92cd-7cffb044c631/image.png Dutch journalist posted this on Twitter, says he sourced it from a Swedish reporter. Link to the tweet: https://twitter.com/wierdduk/status/1029291058432290816/photo/1 Posted by Ikka here: Youth gang torch cars in Gothenburg, Trollhättan and other citie..

let them in 😍😍😍

How can you tell they're immigrants?

There's zero indication or confirmation that this was carried out by immigrants. These kinds of attacks, just like the grenade attacks, are always carried out against objects or unattended locations as signals from one criminal gang to another. It's turf-war without the use of firearms. This is well-documented and nothing new - and to note, it's still less violant than the gang-violence of most other countries.

We are acknowledging them and preparing for new attacks.

What I find extra cute is that when you read the comments you have a whole bunch of AFS-supporters (Alternativ För Sverige/Alternative For Sweden), which is essentially a band of full-blown alt-right super-conservatives who, genuinely, believe that a party with 1500 members and less than half a year of existence has even a shot in the dark at ending up in parliament with less than a month left until the election - and that even if they do, against all odds, get the required ~4% of the total vote necessary to acquire seats, that they would even remotely be allowed a modicum of deciding power - much less so to "turn Sweden Swedish" again, like this lovely specimen likes to think. https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/110384/713fbc64-f902-450a-98da-f832e9a08075/image.png What's funny is that the members themselves don't like to say they're racist, but uh... yeah. "Aryan Pride". Mkay, no, no racism here.

They are acknowledging it.

He wants them to be immigrants to justify his racism.

No one really knows who did it this time, immigrants? This co-ordinated? I don't think so. rumors are extremist leftists or right wing. Criminal gangs? Why would they do that, it would only hinder their drug trade as more cops are around now.

Because non-migrants wouldn't do such a thing in their own country, it's clearly only the immigrants who would behave in such a manner because they can, it's not THEIR country after all so why should they care.

Why are half the posts here people asking for proof that they're immigrants and the other half people assuming its immigrants (and then stating that the government allows immigrants to commit crimes because????)?

another darling example of why removing rules was a garbage idea - drive by racist shitposting and then they scurry back under the floorboards as soon as any questions get posed.

@Svidde Prove to us this was immigrants. How can you even fucking tell from that footage?

I am just hoping it's all just a honeypot operation. Saint Postal will come in and sit his ass down on all the assholes when the judgement time comes.

>They followed the death of an elderly man who threatened police - vehicles were set alight in poor immigrant neighbourhoods, also by masked youths. The 2013 riots sparked a debate about immigration in some circles, and unemployment and the widening gap between rich and poor in others. Sweden is firmly in election season ahead of September's polls, and immigration remains a key issue. Mr Lofven's government party, the Social Democrats, is facing the worst poll numbers in its history, to the benefit of anti-immigration party the Sweden Democrats. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-45181321 Even the BBC are making the assumption, if it's an assumption.

Facepunch has gone down the shitter really fucking fast.

As much as assumptions shouldn't be made, I'd also argue that Facepunch has a bad habit of parroting the general governments narrative of sweeping the issue under the rug with ears covered.

Which part of this do you think "makes the assumption" that immigrants were burning these cars? This article only alludes to the effects on local politics that such incidents have (people blaming immigrants). Cars being burned in low-income "immigrant neighborhoods" by organized crime doesn't equate with immigrants embracing anarchy. Who do you think the victims are, if not immigrants, by this reasoning?

I haven't seen many racists on the forum.

Woah most of you guys really are brainwashed and also very arrogant. I know they are immigrants because I actually know people who were there and because this is not something white Swedish people do. Not because they are white but because culture and socio economics. As noted earlier this is nothing new either, I have seen things like it on a smaller scale first hand many times before. Came out to a car drenched in gasoline half a year ago when I was finished working at bäckby. Luckily and old woman had scared the teenagers away but that really made me think. I've been robbed 2 times by large gangs of immigrants, 0 times by Swedes. Also to the person saying they aren't hurting people and it's worse in other countries, what the fuck? It's not some valid way of protesting, they are burning peoples cars, scaring and scarring people for life, they are hurting the younger people they indoctrinate to join them. Just because it's worse in other places we shouldn't stick our heads in the sand? It's not racism to acknowledge the existence of this and who the perpetrators are, it is absolutely necessary to stop it. You people who scream racism at everything, call the immigrants who come out against it uncle tom's etc. are what's wrong with today's society. You have no real life experience of stuff like this because if you did there would be no way you could doubt what I'm saying. There is absolutely a culture both in Sweden and other countries that hurt both swedish people and immigrants.

Can you prove that immigrants cause more crimes than other Swedes of the same socioeconomic class or are you just gonna keep pulling anecdotes out of your ass? Also lmao calling us brainwashed and then saying we're the arrogant ones. Look in the mirror first, pal.

I've posted a video of something that happened the other day and almost every single one of you immediately jumps to the conclusion that I'm racist or bigoted and pat each other on the back, that's arrogance. There is plenty of studies on that and it's easy for you to find if you are interested. Sadly we stopped keeping track about 10 or so years ago because it was "racist" but if you go further back you can look att statistiska central byrån or brottsförebyggande rådet and find that immigrants are heavily overrepresented. This is not something controversial and it' holds true all over the world. But that they are overrepresented is not what's interesting, the reason to why they are is. This is something that criminologists in Sweden recently started to study and so far they have come to the conclusion that about 70% of the reason that they are overrepresented is because of socioeconomic status. I think (because of personal experience, there are no studies I know of) majority of the other 30% is because of the toxic subculture that's developing in todays youth. Either way there is one easy way to stop this surge of crime and it's already working. More resources to police and promote communication between police and people. This is of course not enough to stop it completely but it's the solution with the quickest effect and if you look at brottsförebyggande rådet the crime has gone down the last 6 months since we started to help the police more. The gangs are already having a harder time. We must also focus on how to quell the disparities in socioeconomic status, something that all politicians everywhere are already doing but they have different ideas on how to go about it. It's a complex problem that will likely take decades to do something about. One thing that will help that the Sweden democrats have put forward is to stop taking in asylum seekers until the situation has improved and give more money to UNHCR which would be beneficial because a larger percent of the population would integrate and we would help more people with the same money. They are not against all immigration as someone said, they still want people to come and work etc.

yeah so this article doesn't say it's immigrants that did it in fact, the only time immigrant pops up is when it's talking about riots in 2013, and in that case also doesn't say that an immigrant did it, just that it was in "poor immigrant neighborhoods". If anything, it'd be more likely a white nationalist did it.

Does your uncle also work at Nintendo?

I never said it did, I'm saying the BBC are making the assumption, not the article itself. >There is no clear motive for the widespread destruction, but the arson echoes the damage done during riots in Stockholm over several nights in May 2013. >They followed the death of an elderly man who threatened police - vehicles were set alight in poor immigrant neighbourhoods, also by masked youths. >The 2013 riots sparked a debate about immigration in some circles, and unemployment and the widening gap between rich and poor in others. >Sweden is firmly in election season ahead of September's polls, and immigration remains a key issue. >Mr Lofven's government party, the Social Democrats, is facing the worst poll numbers in its history, to the benefit of anti-immigration party the Sweden Democrats. You don't start crowbaring these things into your article if you aren't already making assumptions.

We had a thread maybe a year or two back about this (https://www.government.se/articles/2017/02/facts-about-migration-and-crime-in-sweden/), and here's what the government says: People from foreign backgrounds are suspected of crimes more often than people from a Swedish background. According to the most recent study, people from foreign backgrounds are 2.5 times more likely to be suspected of crimes than people born in Sweden to Swedish-born parents. In a later study, researchers at Stockholm University showed that the main difference in terms of criminal activity between immigrants and others in the population was due to differences in the socioeconomic conditions in which they grew up in Sweden. This means factors such as parents' incomes, and the social circumstances in the area in which an individual grew up. Note that it's "main difference" and not the whole difference. The government isn't saying they're not over represented when normalising for socioeconomic status. This is, as far as I can tell, based on this survey from 2005 (doesn't seem like there's anything newer on crime and ethnicity): https://www.bra.se/download/18.cba82f7130f475a2f1800012697/1371914727881/2005_17_brottslighet_bland_personer_fodda_sverige_och_utlandet.pdf Table 10 is what you wanna look at: https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/185359/c1838f82-0b90-4b17-9ced-18159e7261d5/image.png A caveat is that this seems to be based on suspects, and not convictions, which could bias the results (though the report doesn't mention this as far as I can tell) - either way, it's pretty obvious that while standardising for gender, age, education and income reduces the risk, all migrant groups are still over represented in these statistics. There's also the question whether standardisation even matters - is immigration an issue because they're more criminal regardless of standardisation, or because you're creating a class that has a hard time integrating, which leads to lower socioeconomic status; the end result is the same, more crime. In this case (determining whether it's likely that this was done by immigrants or children of immigrants), there's actually a good reason to not normalise - if 90% (obviously completely wrong number, it's just to illustrate) of crime is committed by a certain group, you don't really care about whether that group is over represented because of socioeconomic status or whatever; there's still a 90% likelihood that the crime was committed by a person from that group. What you actually wanna look at with regards to assumptions about who committed these crimes is A) How many immigrants live in the affected areas compared to ethnic Swedes, and B) how the age distribution is among these ethnic groups (e.g., if all the immigrants in the area are 75+ it probably wasn't them). Don't take this as me saying we should throw out all immigrants and we should never take refugees in, but immigrants do commit a much larger share of crime (this is seen in Denmark as well), and seemingly this difference doesn't disappear completely when you account for socioeconomic status. Whether that's actually an issue is a different matter (men commit a lot more crime than women regardless of ethnicity, for example - doesn't mean we shouldn't allow men into the country).