Finnish gender clinics will no longer treat non-binary patients - Sensationalist Headlines

The article is in finnish so you can try to google translate it but I'll try my best to translate a few bits as best as I can. (Trasek is a finnish trans organisation) http://trasek.fi/2018/08/17/muunsukupuolisten-hoitolinjauksista/ Trasek received information that in fall 2017 that at the Helsinki gender clinic there were problems to get referrals to hormone/surgery treatments if you were non-binary (F64.8 diagnosis). In august 2018 the head doctor at Tampere university hospital's gender clinic changed, and Tampere went with the same decision as Helsinki. That means that currently anyone openly non-binary and given the F64.8 diagnosis will no longer be receiving gender affirming treatments

I mean. This is just about the only legit concern in the public discourse in northern europe. Those suicide statistics and general pattern of behavior ranging from bipolar to anxiety isn't from nothing. It's a step towards preventing people from realizing that the Gender dysphoria was a result of all these other things piling on. I mean. My big question mark here isn't whether people are for real experiencing it or not, but whether they can at all get to research the condition objectively and ask critical questions without people getting bent out of shape. The fact of the matter is that there are people who go through the medical treatment (often self-diagnosed and ordinated as well) and at times all the way to surgery before realizing that councelling would have helped them realize they were suffering from a bunch of other disorders and they're not happy about this result. Procedure should definitely be that you lock down the proper diagnosis, properly get it talked through and processed before you go into the final stages. Everything about the process is reversible, except for the surgery. People commit suicide after transitioning for a reason! It might not be that transitioning was the wrong choice, it might just be all the other red flag mental disorders that gets ignored because it "stiffles discourse" and "harms a persecuted minority". TL;DR: yeah. Hopefully it isn't political bullshit. Hopefully it really is about turning "can't be sure" into more definites. There's still a long-ass way to go in this field of psychology, Anyone who just plants a flag and starts asserting that asking questions to further understanding is harmful are toxic fuckers. I mean, it's not the fucking alt-right being snide and trolling! It''s a medical institution in the Nordics for fuck sake!

I admire your optimism.

makes sense since non-binary isn't a thing

Last bit on the article says this: Demands in a nutshell: Treatment has to be unique, be based on the individual's needs and treatment decisions need to be transparent and happen in collaboration with the treated individual Diagnosis and treatment should not focus on what a/the gender is, but instead on what treatment the patient needs. The desire for corrective treatment has to be seen as a part of self-determination and strengthening one's self-identity, not as a psychopathological disorder. The sufficiency of resources has to be ensured so that patients will not suffer from administrative causes (queues/long wait times) Open communication from the line of treatment to the interest groups and other relevant groups. My interpretation of this: The country only has two gender clinics (one in Helsinki, one in Tampere), and the number of people seeking treatment has been multiplied by 17 times at the clinics (since when, it doesn't say) which has lead to the clinics not having enough staff, time and other resources to treat all patients equally/sufficiently. The aim of this is to cut down on "wasting time" on people who don't actually need things like hormone treatment/SRS, so that the people who actually feel immense dysphoria will get the treatment they need. All in all; I see this as a step in the right direction. It's unlikely that the number of trans people popping up will decline, so Finland might need to set up more clinics which would also open the possibility to treat non-binary people without keeping them on aeon long wait times.

I would think they need more help than no help

Yeah, obviously if people claim that they're nonbinary and are seeking out hormone therapy they're just doing it for attention. Absolutely not a single person would seek out hormone therapy if they didn't actually need it.

How do you know that for sure?

The real crime here. Fucking appalling.

You'd be wrong.

Aside from staffing issues they probably only really need one or two more in central and northern Finland given the small population and good public transit. Could be wrong tho since im not a finn

I'd be right

Well I'll definitely take your word for it considering all your knowledge and expertise

I'm totally confused due to lack of information from the translation. So first of all, a gender clinic does what? Provides psychiatric services? Hormone therapy? Gender reassignment surgery? Secondly, they're going to refuse service to anyone identifying as "non-binary"? Why? Liability reasons?

Great point, hadn't thought about it that way. Quick, someone write this stuff down for the textbooks!

I like how you're a smartass to me while trying to be funny since you disagree with my post, but aren't to the guy who said "You'd be wrong". Try harder to be funny next time and you might make people laugh

do you have anything that actually proves you right at all

this is not any more clever than

yes, yes, and yes

Are you anywhere near actually making an argument for your 'point'

well it won't provide surgery per se, but may help with referrals to a SRS surgeon

He doesn't need to be, he's responsive to a non-point with as much as it deserves

what is so hard about "rate dumb and move on" when somebody comes into a thread like this with something inciteful and with zero actual argument? They aren't interested in seriously debating you so neither should you be.

how is what i said a non point

Because that's not what I want to do?

Well thanks for just being a baseless jerk about it and just telling me that I'm a sham. I don't want to call myself a woman. It feels silly. It doesn't fit. But I hate all the "man" things, too. I want to pursue getting HRT, I feel like the effects are desirable. I don't feel like a "man." So, am I just an delusional shithead for it, then, or what? Why is it so important to you to assert it's not a thing?

Hey, thanks for posting! I think a lot of people are more willing to change their mind on this stuff when they're directly confronted with the type of person they're talking about.

It's a much smaller country, it's only appalling if they're over capacity.

At least you can call yourself a human, right?

Makes no sense, really. Or with what evidence and authority do you speak for all of human biology or sociology? There existed plenty of hints that it isn't as clear cut as some would believe. Disenfranchising those that are already majorly ostracised my large parts of life isn't exactly helping. It is that attitude that doesn't cost you much to change but that circumstance can make or break someone already close to the edge. Be it out of laziness, ignorance or pure malice, this is detrimental to those that want or need help. Some more tolerance isn't to much to ask. Most people that parrot this garbage that I have seen either or religious nuts, unsure/questioning some part of their own sexuality or just hate everyone that doesn't fit their definition of "normal" Some are more comfortable in their own bodies then others, just let fellow humans be humans and try not being such a dick about it.