https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/survivor-madden-shooting-sues-ea-1138870
If he wins, this is going to hurt eSports in general due to companies being afraid to endorse events.
I'm 90% sure the case is just going to be thrown out by the judge.
I never thought I would ever say this but.
EA is not the comany to blame in regards to this gaming atrocity.
Stupid and a waste of time and effort.
I hope it is thrown out ASAP
This depends, if EA was sponsoring the event, they should of paid for security.
What's the logic behind this, if Pepsi sponsor a football team they don't get put in charge of stadium security.
Mitich is suing on the grounds of negligence on the parts of EA, the bar and the related Chicago Pizza & Sports Grille, as well as the management companies of the Jacksonville Landing area of downtown Jacksonville.
Wow, what a shitty thing to do. What are bars supposed to do have armed guards and metal detectors everywhere?
Yea thats not how that works at all. Tim Hortons isn't responsible for security at NHL events.
Theres a difference between sponsoring and hosting. Even then, the bar isn't at fault or liable for this shooting at all.
Its a blatant cash grab
Clearly we need to arm all bartenders with their own guns.
Is there any precedent for someone successfully suing a venue for inadequate security after it gets shot up? I'm sure this isn't the first attempt.
Im pretty sure you cant be legally required to go out of your way to make a location active shooter proof.
I meant hosting, my bad. Usually game companies are pretty involved in these tournaments.
Just someone trying to make a buck out of a tragedy, this is gonna get chucked out of court pretty fast.
Before immediately jumping on this you don't have to go far to see that EA hosted or at least had a large part in this event, they had employees on site monitoring the tournament and collecting scores as it was some kind of qualifier.
The suit boils down to a number of issues - The tournament was hosted in a known dangerous area (Even though isn't strictly related to the shooting anyway), there was absolutely nothing in the way of security for the event in order to provide a safe venue for players and anyone could just come and go from the event as they pleased, the event was way overcrowded and was in violation of a number of safety codes.
That and he's seeking $15,000 in damages so it's not like he's trying to 'cash grab' millions off a big corp, because he was shot at an event where he feels that more could have been done to make it safer.
Not to the point where theyre obligated to provide security for a 25 person tournie lol.
The responsibility wouldn't lie with EA, it would lie with the bar. Even then, its not the bars responsibility to guarantee safety of its patrons from criminals. Theyre liable if someone slips and gets hurt, or if theres a fire and its non-adherence to fire codes gets people hurt or killed. But theyre not responsible for the actions of an individual unaffiliated with them.
For comparison, victims of the Aurora Colorado movie theater shooing sued the theater chain and lost, and ended up owing the theater money to cover legal costs. The determination was based on the fact that there was no way they could have forseen such an event happening. The same thing would happen here.
Were I to get shot in a mugging inside a walmart, would I be able to win a lawsuit against them since their store had inadequate security measures? Of course not.
A hosted event in a venue for a specific purpose is pretty different from a cinema or walmart.
It's also both EA's and the bar's responsibility to make sure that premises and the event in general is safe and up to scratch with standards before they host it.
It isn't that hard to foresee that in a competitive event where people can easily get heated there might be some kind of altercation break out...
How could a theater chain do anything more than a downtown Florida gaming bar could do?
Its pretty cut and dry. A mass shooting extends beyond the responsibilities of EA or the bar. The guy didn't just whip out an AR from his backpack, he left the tournie then returned. Bag checks by unarmed security wouldn't have done jack shit and its not like the bar oversold tickets beyond their capacity per firecode.
Theres not really any negligence on the bar or EAs part, theres nothing more they could have reasonably done to prevent something like this. Its not an insane expectation that a bunch of Esport spergs wouldn't get outrageously violent because they lost at a video game. Why would a video game event be any more violent than a typical night at the bar?
The bottom line here is that neither the bar nor EA holds any liability for the shooting. The lawsuit can allege anything it wants but its going to get tossed out or hes going to lose the case.
Mitich is suing on the grounds of negligence on the parts of EA, the bar and the related Chicago Pizza & Sports Grille
He's not suing them for the fact that there was a shooting, he's suing them because they provided shit security riddled with holes.
this is so obviously a lawyer preying on a victim of a crime, pushing them to sue because they know they're going to get paid regardless
Aurora massacre survivors sued. How did some end up owing the th..
The settlement conference, corroborated by The Times with four parties present at the conference, was hastily convened after a separate set of survivors suffered defeat in state court, where a jury decided that Cinemark could not have foreseen the events of that night in 2012, when James Holmes killed 12 people and injured 70 others in a 10-minute rampage at a screening of "The Dark Knight Rises."
Expecting every event and every place you go to to have armed security capable of stopping a mass shooter is a fucking ridiculous expectation, because thats the only thing that could have stopped this. Bag checks by a dood with a maglight and a walkie talkie wouldn't have saved anyone.
They don't want a security detail everywhere, they just want them at venues that have tons of people in a single area. Like a good example is a convention, concert, or theme park. Its a densely packed area, and has a competitve event going on. Comparing it to a movie theater, or worse a bar, is nonsense.
It really didn't have tons of people though. This was a video game tournament inside of a bar in the back room of a pizza joint.
You think a movie theater with 150+ people in it for the midnight release of a movie isn't densely packed? Its worse than a convention or theme pack because the people inside have absolutely no where to run. Tbh seems like youre making an arbitrary distinction because I've got a similar cause with an unfavorable outcome.
You mentioned concert; do you think the concert in Vegas where the mass shooter opened from the top of a resort hotel is liable for the deaths? Is the hotel liable for the deaths? Neither had adequate security enough to stop the mass shooter. Should they not be liable as well for their inability to predict machine gun fire raining on them?
Like this is your world where guns are just everywhere, if you don't want to take safety precautions to dense events, then you should be raising hell with increasing requirements and responsibility of gun ownership. People are evidently scared to go to big events now because anyone can have a gun. You could go back and forth blaming the media, but the truth is, mass shootings are happening more often than ever (and that's excluding gangs and other crime based shootings) and the need for security to protect people is also rising. Doing neither is getting people killed, and its disgusting seeing people more worried about carrying their guns into such events than people dying.
Also, the issue with the Vegas shooting was the security allowing him to hoard an armory in his hotel, not the concert security. If anyone is at fault (bar the shooter), it would be the hotel for having lax security.
If I enter a supermarket, and some random looney decides to fuck with me, do I sue the supermarket for not having the security to protect me from a random unforseen and unfortunate incident?
I don't think people expect to go into a eSports event and get shot by a sore loser y'know, but thats just my 2 cents...
Maybe if it's impossible to predict how a event or place can be secure from mass shootings maybe something should be done about the guns.
Mass shootings are statistical anomalies that barely happen. Youre more likely to get struck by lightening twice in a row than to die in a mass shooting. Dont let hysterics trick you into thinking theyre everyday occurrences. I'd rather they didnt happen at all but you shouldnt be scared to go outside lol.
Do you have any citations on the publoc at large being scared of attending big events, that mass shootings are on the rise, and that the need for security is on the rise? Those are some bold claims.
The Vegas shooter brought in his firearms in normal suitcases over the course of a few days. Should Las Vegas hotels have all luggage be searched or go through metal detectors? Should they monitor every individual who they think is bringing in abnormal amounts of luggage? What should the hotel have done since they are responsible?
Me personally, I dont like to remove responsibility from the shooter and throw it on the owner of an establishment because he didnt have Rambo on staff to stop the attack. Might as well sue the perpetrators parents because theyre just as responsible as anyone else here.
Or maybe focus on why broken individuals become broken.
I donno bout you man, but I dont feel like turning this into a gun debate. Drop that shit.
>Mass shootings are statistical anomalies that barely happen
Objectively false, back this with fucking numbers.
If gun control is unpopular but entirely within our means and predicting attacks before they happen is borderline impossible , I just think we should go for the former.
https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R44126.pdf
Acc to the government, they are becoming increasingly more common than ever with more averaged causalities than ever:
With data provided by criminologist Grant Duwe, CRS also compiled a 44-year (1970-2013) dataset of firearms-related mass murders that could arguably be characterized as “mass publicshootings.” These data show that there were on average:
one (1.1) incident per year during the 1970s (5.5 victims murdered, 2.0 woundedper incident),
nearly three (2.7) incidents per year during the 1980s (6.1 victims murdered, 5.3wounded per incident),
four (4.0) incidents per year during the 1990s (5.6 victims murdered, 5.5wounded per incident),
four (4.1) incidents per year during the 2000s (6.4 victims murdered, 4.0wounded per incident), and
four (4.5) incidents per year from 2010 through 2013 (7.4 victims murdered, 6.3wounded per incident).
These decade-long averages suggest that the prevalence, if not the deadliness, of “mass publicshootings” increased in the 1970s and 1980s, and continued to increase, but not as steeply, duringthe 1990s, 2000s, and first four years of the 2010s.
You see people in this very forum say they are scared for their lives in school/events. Gallup says 4 in 10 are scared of being a victim of a mass shooting:
https://news.gallup.com/poll/220634/four-americans-fear-victim-mass-shooting.aspx
Granted they themselves said it was taken right after the vegas shooting and that could be altering the numbers than a lul of violence. But considering the amount of shootings is going up, its a logical fear to see how we are heading down a very dark path.
Literally keep an eye on a random dude bringing in a new suitcase every day into his room. Even if he wasn't going to shoot, it looks suspicious for one guest to leave and come back with more luggage by themselves through multiple days. Surveillance shows he was carting literal cart loads of luggage into the room by himself and nothing coming out.
As for EA, metal detector like any con or event? You're trying to compare a very specific event to every day locations. People in this thread have said events should have security and never meant every day locations. Mass shooters like striking targets that are well televised or packed full of people, It's idiotic to compare a grocery store or bar to a live streamed event with a dense crowd.
So what do you want to do? Blame the kid and just shrug it off till another shooting happens? They are going up whether you believe it or not. Crossing your arms and refusing to allow more security or increased gun restrictions is terrible when the number keeps increasing.
We know why he was broken, because he had a mental illness that was inflamed by his parents constant arguing. The kid should have been barred from purchasing firearms completely, but because he slid right under the threshold, it was allowed.
K
four (4.5) incidents per year from 2010 through 2013 (7.4 victims murdered, 6.3wounded per incident).
4.5 incidents a year in a country of 350ish million. Its not at all a common thing pal. They are anomalous events that are extremely rare in the overall scope of gun violence. 7.4 people killed in comparison to the 30,000 killed on a yearly basis is very small. Again, dont buy into the hysterics.
I stand corrected, thanks.
Like you said, thats a post-mass shooting poll, after one of the worst in US history. I cant find a more recent poll but it will have to do.
Even if 40% of people are scared of mass shootings, concert outings and sporting event ticket sales haven't diminished despite being the most susceptible to attacks.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/306065/concert-ticket-sales-revenue-in-north-america/
Can't find a link for the most recent superbowl but the Vikings Stadium in MN sold out this past season.
Thousands of people go through a vegas hotel on a daily basis, how are front desk clerks supposed to keep an eye out for guys making multiple suitcase trips over the course of days on top of doing their job? Hotel security is more concerned with finding card cheats than looking for guys with more than one suitcase. Even then, its a pretty tough thing to spot dood. The guy did it over several days, not several hours. Different clothes, potentially different staff, potentially different security personnel. Theyre not running a NSA level surveillance program on every guest, how were they supposed to spot that? Police, the FBI, or the ATF found nothing strange about the guy despite him buying insane amounts of weaponry over a relatively small period of time, but a hotel is supposed to watch out for how many suitcases someone is bringing in?
You realize metal detectors weigh a fuck load and cant just be ported around right? A lot of airports have a tough time with renovations because they have to reinforce the floor to hold the equipment up.
Even then, the guy left and returned with his gun. A metal detector doesnt stop everything made of metal from passing through. He could have just walked through and pushed pass, or shot, any security guards. Should EA provide armed security for all events?
Look, we're talking about whether EA, the bar, or the pizza place is liable or not. I say theyre not, I had no intent of discussing gun control or the things we can do to prevent guys like this from causing tragedies like this. I'm not going to parrot the same thing I've always said. Youll have to find someone else to talk to for that. I dont know about you, but I dont want to turn every thread with the slight stink of guns on into into a 20 page shitfest of reality denial and willful ignorance
I dont really care in either direction if every event of any kind starts bolstering themselves with armed guards and automated turrets. Makes no difference to me. My point here is that they're not liable for damages if they dont do that. I think them not setting up measures to prevent a mass shooting is reasonable since the likelihood of it happening is immeasurably low. You cant expect event holders to plan for every potential random deadly event.
Nah
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