Facepunch Politics/Thoughts: Company Privatisation vs Nationalisation
21 replies, posted
I would like to start a debate Company Privatisation vs Nationalisation. What are peoples general thoughts? We have started a new age, where prisons are privatised, something that was once a government body, turning for profit.
Here's some thought provoking questions:
What do you believe should be private or nationalised?
Should prisons be private for-profit or government owned?
Should transport such as the rail train companies be private or nationalised?
Should countries have a national bank or is it better to let the private sector control commerce?
Do you believe a national health service is a good method to provide healthcare to the people or is a private company better?
Prisons and anything related to national security should never be private. The police and prisons should be run by the state.
Health services should be state-run as well. A national bank should also exist, though most of the commerce sector should be run privately.
Stuff like railways can be either.
Three questions should be asked when asked if something should be privatized.
Is it ethical for such an industry to have a profit motive?
Can competition feasibly exist if the industry is privatized?
Do customers have a choice of whether or not to purchase the product or service?
For most things, the answer to all 3 questions is yes. If the answer to any of these is no, then it should be nationalized (if the 3rd only is no, there should be a national option). For prisons, the answers to 1 and 3 are no. For train companies, the answer to 2 is no. For health care, the answer to 3 is no.
I'm not against private banks but they have to be a hell of a lot better regulated then they are now, and should not have the power they do over politics due to having so much money.
The problem is that the US has allowed the private sector enormous political power that it should never have had. The private sector cannot be trusted. It needs to be regulated and put in it's place.
This can include important utilities like electricity since competition isn't an option there and privatizing can have a weakening effect on the infrastructure of the country.
Public transport is important. People living in secluded areas and those with disabilities need transport to contribute to society, but they'll never be profitable enough for private companies to serve them.
No government body related to law enforcement or healthcare should ever be fully privatized. Natural resources such as gas, oil and wood should always, always be nationalized, but the revenues kept in reserve by the government while the focus is kept on improving private businesses and punishing anti-competitive practices.
Privatized rail is complete shit, at least here it is.
I'm for privatisation of things where no perverse incentive exists. So no private prisons, military, police.
Private companies should only operate as worker cooperatives.
https://libcom.org/files/images/blog/IWW.jpg
But then how would I make money from the racism factory my daddy passed on to me. I worked so hard to be born into wealth.
I don't think that sorta thing should be forced - imo companies should be incentivised to do the right thing, potentially with tax breaks or access to zero/low interest credit.
It really depends. You really can’t say that government ownership will always be better, or private ownership will always be better. It depends on considerations such as: how competent the government is, who are the participants in the market, what does the relevant legislation (if any) look like, and what is the nature of the thing to be privatised/nationalised.
The best thing to do is to evaluate every proposal on a case-by-case basis. But a market-based approach should almost always have a higher preference, given the inherent efficiencies (allocative and productive) of the market economy. Governments can be participants in the market too, eg in a hybrid public-private system, but it may sometimes not be necessary.
If we're talking purely hypeothetics and ideals here, I'll go for the radical option and pick neither. Privatisation and nationalisation shouldn't have to be a binary option. Give the control of services and industries to the people who use them directly, e.g. worker control of the means of production (a.k.a socialism). Communal, decentralized services built on voluntary association, scaled up trhough federation. No profit motive, no hierarchical property relations and no state. The result: anarchy.
If we're only talking pragmatically, here in the now, then yeah, keep all services the fuck away from private hands.
So, if someone joins the collective later, are they expected to reimburse the founders for the cost of buying a store, buying equipment, buying into the established brand etc? Because if they aren't, there's no benefit from founding a collective and should always joint an established collective, and if you are then you're not much different from the dirty capitalist.
The state shouldn't be allowed to become bloated, like it is now in most of the world, or it'll start sticking it's nose where it shouldn't.
Depends on your demographics. You want civic-minded, high-trust people in your country, then it's unimportant
If not, private will simply do the job better (if regulated properly) because in nationalized companies everyone just steals shit
Yeah, you really strike me as soon as who loves governments that respect personal autonomy.
Personal Autonomy is a spook.
Okay, user owned stuff is fine too. I'm a big fan of credit unions and the like. I didn't think I'd have to specify those are ok too.
I read somewhere that job guarantee programs can solve the inflation issue while still having full employment.
Nope the private market always is better at everything, USA USA USA!
There's rarely a nuanced discussion about the ethics and goals of an industry to privatize, the proponents have already predetermined that government should not have any role in anything so really the argument is that; Is government actually the worst solution at everything?
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