Florida bill seeks to repeal post-Parkland gun control measures - Polidicks

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna956756 A bill filed Monday aims to repeal gun control measures that were passed in response to the school shooting that killed 17 people in Parkland, Florida. State Rep. Mike Hill, a Republican elected in November, filed the bill that would essentially repeal a number of measures passed into law in March 2018 as a part of the Marjory Stoneman Douglas PublicSafety Act signed into law in March. The new bill, HB 175, which would remove a mandatory waiting period to purchase firearms other than handguns and a provision which raised the age to purchase a rifle from 18 to 21. It also would seek to repeal provisions that would allow law enforcement to seize firearms from people who may pose a danger to themselves or others, a measure sometimes referred t o as a "red flag law." Hill told NBC News in a statement that he filed the bill to repeal the regulations in the Marjory Stoneman Douglas Public Safety Act because he took a "solemn oath to support, protect and defend the US Constitution." Parkland shooting survivor David Hogg spoke out against the new bill in a livestream on social media Tuesday evening, encouraging his followers to email Hill. "It's f---ing ridiculous what he's doing," Hogg said. "For the thousands of kids that went up to Tallahassee and worked their asses off to get these laws passed, the least they can do is try not to reverse them their first year back in office."

Cause doing nothing has been working wonders when it comes to stopping school shootings, right? I'm generally pro gun but c'mon, it's clear there's an issue when it's easier for a kid with mental issues to get a gun that it is for him to get some actual help.

Mandatory waiting periods are a great idea and they should be adopted nationwide, including (and especially) for handgun purchases. Mass shootings traumatize communities and catch headlines, but the overwhelming majority of gun deaths in this country are suicides. We know that suicide attempts are usually carried out impulsively with more lethal means resulting in higher rates of completion. Any delay in acquiring the means to carry out an attempt, even one as minor as one or two days, actually makes a huge difference. Waiting periods should be mandatory in all but the most extreme cases, such as imminent danger to one's life. Three days, plus mandatory suicide prevention literature handed out free of charge to the consumer.

Hill told NBC News in a statement that he filed the bill to repeal the regulations in the Marjory Stoneman Douglas Public Safety Act because he took a "solemn oath to support, protect and defend the US Constitution." More like support, protect and defend the interests of the people who line your wallet. Fuck yourself.

a provision which raised the age to purchase a rifle from 18 to 21 Regardless of the rest, these kinds of laws are terrible. We don't need a range of ages to unlock new rights. At 18 you are considered old enough to be an independent adult, be tried for crimes like an adult, and can be drafted into war and demanded to shoot others at your own peril. If we are allowing civilian guns, age restriction should be 18, not 21. The same goes for alcohol, cigarettes, and voting. Establishing a range of ages to obtain new rights just creates social classes that put us behind the sensibility of other nations.

Eh, some things I agree with and others I don’t. 3 day waiting periods do seem to have some effect on suicide prevention, but that doesn’t do much good for people who already own guns. Red flag laws in Florida aren’t quite bad as I thought they’d be, but there doesn’t seem to be any form of an appeals process to mitigate the effects of false claims or abuse. Raising the minimum purchase age from 18 to 21 is just stupid though. AFAIK, there isn’t any evidence suggesting this change would have any effect on gun violence. Also it creates legal double standard where you’re old enough for the government to send you overseas with a machine gun, yet not old enough to drink booze or have your own your own personal firearm at home. They should probably suggest changes to take those situations into account instead of scrapping the entire thing.

None of these laws would have stopped what happened at Parkland. You wanna know what would have? Law Enforcement doing its fucking job in the first place. FBI got warned, and didn't act. The local police got warned, and did jack. The school system knew about this shit and refused to intervene with a counselor/therapist. This is not a system that needs fixing, it's a system where heads need to roll for the failure to uphold laws that are already on the books.

Most of the new laws were stupid such as raising the rifle age to 21 and mandatory waiting periods. How about you prove they work first.

Study by the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, November 2014: https://www.pnas.org/content/114/46/12162 Waiting period laws that delay the purchase of firearms by a few days reduce gun homicides by roughly 17%. Our results imply that the 17 states (including the District of Columbia) with waiting periods avoid roughly 750 gun homicides per year as a result of this policy. Expanding the waiting period policy to all other US states would prevent an additional 910 gun homicides per year without imposing any restrictions on who can own a gun. We find that waiting periods led to large and statistically significant reductions in gun violence (Table 2) during the Brady interim period. Specifically, the results of column 3 of Table 2 show that waiting periods implemented during the Brady interim years resulted in a 17% reduction in gun homicides. This is equivalent to roughly 39 fewer homicides per year for the average state. There was also a 6% reduction in gun suicides (i.e., 17 fewer suicides per year for the average state). Both results are robust across models with and without controls for state-level economic and demographic changes. Notably, exploiting the Brady Act as a natural experiment produces similar estimates as the longer sample period from 1970 to 2014. Tables 1 and 2 also show that waiting periods have no significant effect on non-gun homicides, suggesting that people subject to waiting period laws do not substitute other means of committing homicide. This is consistent with other research (9) finding no increase in non-gun homicides in response to policies restricting access to firearms. Suicide methods vary widely by gender. Statistically, women are more likely to pursue less-lethal methods–such as overdose or superficial cutting–whereas men tend to choose more immediate and lethal means–jumping, crashing a vehicle, or a self-inflicted gunshot wound. Individuals who are most intent on carrying out a suicide attempt are also the least likely to disclose it or seek help. The same is true for those with homicidal ideation, often a transitory phase preceding a suicide attempt. Yes, people actually do go out and purchase guns specifically for these reasons. And no, no one expects preventative measures like waiting periods to succeed 100% of the time - they expect a reasonable, rational, evidence-based policy that saves many lives. Tell that to the patient who came onto our unit after narrowly surviving a self-inflicted gunshot wound to the head. I'm sure he'll find it immensely reassuring.

The gun didn't cause him to shoot himself. Without the gun, he likely would have turned to hanging, as the majority of suicide victims in Canada have since 1992. Waiting periods may help stop crimes of passion for a first-time buyer, but if someone already owns a gun they're absolutely fucking useless. In Canada there's a 28-day waiting period for your license, and then you can go buy as many guns as you want with no further mandatory waiting period because once you already have a gun making you wait to get another one does nothing but inconvenience gun collectors.

The only way to stop a bad mentally unhealthy person with a gun, is with a good mentally unhealthy person with a gun!

while you're not wrong about being old enough to serve, there are important biological reasons why we don't let people buy alcohol at 18 and we absolutely should limit cigarettes to 21 as well because we know its much easier to get addicted at even 18 than 21

Wow, you actually think handguns over other firearms make it easier to kill yourself. You are a tool.

Simply owning a gun is actually a major risk factor when it comes to suicide. You are statistically more likely to kill yourself if you're a gun owner compared to non gun owners. A gun may not directly cause you to shoot yourself, but it allows someone to commit suicide far more impulsively, as a gun is without a doubt the quickest, simplest, and most reliably lethal method you can use. Other methods require a greater time to set up, or are easier to survive.

Kinda sounds like this argument can be used to move the entire age of majority back to 21 too then

ya but we sort of need bodies in the military and its also unfair to draft them without letting them represent themselves. cigarettes being 18 is only due to the very powerful tobacco lobby and no real equivalent of the prohabitionists

They aren't to blame but it's a hell of a lot easier to point a handgun at yourself than a rifle.

Floridia has some of the worst mental-health facilities in the country. You know you can't get involuntarily commited down there? I mean yay that sounds fantastic because I mean those places are basically asylums or something with straightjackets* right? But then you have people like Nick here who show severe mental health signs, pulled a gun on his mother** and then you're setting up an accident waiting to happen. Gun control is sadly way cheaper then improved mental health facilities. Way easier to push onto voters too. *They're not, or at least the ones in my state. I've been in one. **I believe I'm thinking of the right guy.

When you're trying to commit suicide you're going through every reason why you shouldn't repeatedly before you do. These range from profound such as "my dog wouldn't understand why I'm gone" to "I'd inconvenience the guy I take the carpool with" and even stupid shit like "I have a steak in the fridge I should cook". Any barrier to suicide makes a difference.

A gun is a gun. It's going to cause potentially lethal harm no matter how big the gun is. You should know this if you've ever learned anything about gun safety ever. Handguns are a lot cheaper, have much more common ammunition generally, are much more concealable, and are easier to carry around than a full length shotgun or rifle. There's a reason the vast majority of firearm deaths are due to handguns. Yes, handguns can be defeated by modern body armor, and some of the smaller cartridges such as .22 and .32 ACP aren't that powerful and have been known to not fully stop attackers before, but none of that matters when you put the gun up to your temple after you've had enough of life. It's simply by their nature of much easier access and use that they are in fact, easier to kill yourself with. Don't get me wrong, you can use any firearm to kill someone, including yourself, but because of the way that guns are set up in this country right now, it's easier to kill yourself with a handgun. Stop rejecting all criticisms of guns just because they are criticisms of guns, it makes you look like the one who's a tool.

Actually that's not what I said but since you brought it up: http://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/ob422ma70bmescf/handguns.png The choice of weapons in firearm suicides. (National Institute of Health, 1988)

I'd imagine when it comes to heat of the moment decisions, putting a pistol to your head is far more likely to end with you pulling the trigger compared to placing the butt of a rifle on the ground, inserting the barrel into your mouth, and stepping on the trigger with your toe.

I might be convinced to support waiting times, as long as it only applies to first time buyers. It would change nothing for people who already have guns other than inconveniencing them for the sake of inconvenience.