• In major blow to Canada's Trudeau, second minister quits over scandal
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https://www.reuters.com/article/us-canada-politics-snc-lavalin/in-major-blow-to-canadas-trudeau-second-minister-quits-over-scandal-idUSKCN1QL1WQ In a serious blow to Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau, a second member of his Cabinet resigned on Monday, saying she had lost confidence in how the government had dealt with an escalating political scandal.
Trudeau doesn't have the same wits as Stephen Harper when it comes to subverting the morals and ethics of governmental institutions, I don't know why he though he could get away with this.
We are so fucking fucked. Conservatives are gonna win this election, aren't they?
Can someone give me a rundown on this whole situation? I tried looking into it but all I found were a bunch of opinion pieces and no actual summary or explanation of what happened.
SNC-Lavalin (A pretty big company in Quebec) bribed and defrauded Libyan officials for reasons. They were caught, and are under trial for that reason. Trudeau, supposedly prompted by a concern for jobs, pressured the Attorney General to go easy on them, and defer judgement. The Attorney General refused to comply, and was fired soon after. She testified that she was pressured, but that it wasn't neccesarily a criminal offence. Arguments against this arise calling it a Constitutional offence, not just a criminal one. The sanctity of the division of judicial and executive powers must be upheld, so say the dissenters. The opposition party is taking this and rolling with it, and people are calling for Trudeau to step down. Now, one of Trudeau's top people steps down, and it is unclear to me as of yet whether it is because of the scandal. Certainly, each side would have you believe a different thing. So basically: Gray-zone consitutional crisis + Rabid opposition = trouble for Trudeau
Someone else feel free to correct me but AFAIK: Important Canadian corporation had been caught red-handed corrupting officials at home and abroad; A Federal judge had to decide between putting the case through trial or letting the company settle directly with the government; Said judge asked the attorney general for advice and she recommended a trial and not a settlement; Trudeau then allegedly pressured the attorney general to not let the case go to trial; Attorney general resigned from her position and basically denounced Trudeau; IIRC now the federal department in charge of ethics is launching a probe to determine if Trudeau's government is guilty of interfering with the judicial system. I might have some details wrong but that's the gist I think.
Sounds like a lot of grey area and over reaction tbh. I welcome a probe cause I wouldn't want the government doing shady shit but until a probe is done and something is found this sure seems like every thing I assumed it was; a massive over reaction. (Unless I'm vastly underestimating how big this is?)
Mate, a cabinet member announcing their resignation/retirement happens pretty much every Tuesday here. Have you ever wondered where the phrase ‘that time of the month’ comes from? It was coined in Australia to refer to a new Prime Minister being sworn in - which happens practically at least once every month. Point is, Canada will be fine.
Actually, whatever Trudeau's reasons, this is inexcusable. I wasn't aware of the full extent of the situation until Zenreon summarized. Trying to pressure the attorney general was bad enough, but firing her when she refused to comply? That's the same shit Trump does on the regular that we give him shit for, and now this happens. I can't pretend this is excusable just because I happen to like Trudeau. But now that puts me in a difficult situation. I can't afford to vote conservative later this year because they're headed in a bad direction and I sincerely believe they'd be awful for our country's future. The NDP's platform aligns with my views best, but we have only a single vote and a first past the post system, and every leader they've had since the late Jack Layton is lacklustre, meaning they don't have a chance in hell. I'll be forced to vote liberal again, and it's looking like the conservatives might win anyway.
His camp would want to say that he didn't fire her from the AG position because of this reason, but ofcourse they would. That is really the crux of this that makes it go beyond simply just telling the AG what you would like to happen. If he fired her from the AG position for that reason, then he absolutely fucked up and agree with you. If somehow it is true that he fired her for other reasons, then this is a witch-hunt more so than anything else. As much as I hate to say it, I am having trouble believing Trudeau on this one. He may have violated the division of powers and that is truly inexcusable.
https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/165/010a6dbc-da8d-4707-a331-7ddc4605f675/image.png https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/165/27d0880d-8392-4107-a5e8-726039572de5/image.png RIP Most Canadians side with Wilson
Compared to the shit we're dealing with down here, this all seems a bit quaint.
You guys really need to be careful about your sourcing because she did NOT get fired, she resigned. Jody Wilson-Raybould resigned from cabinet following reports suggesting that she was inappropriately pressured to help SNC-Lavalin duck a criminal prosecution.
You need to be careful about the timeline. She DID get fired from the position of AG, and got shuffled to a different part of the cabinet BEFORE she resigned. "A few weeks later, on Jan. 7, 2019, I was informed by the prime minister that I was being shuffled out of the role of minister of justice and attorney general of Canada. For most of these conversations, I made contemporaneous notes, detailed notes in addition to my clear memory, which I am relying on today, among other documentation." Jody Wilson
Thanks, I didn't know that.
Love how everyone is jumping all over this and yet staying silent on the much more pernicious and troubling things going on in the Ontario gov't. That anyone would think that the reasonable decision after seeing the Liberals screw up is to turn to the far more corrupt and malicious conservatives simply baffles me.
I'm worried about this specifically because it gives more ammo to the conservatives. Also, we can be worried about more than one thing at a time.
I've said it since he won leadership of the Liberals, but he was a terrible choice. Marc Garneau should be our Prime Minister right now. Not only did he have actual leadership experience before running for leader of a national party, as Canada's first astronaut he had the fame they wanted too, and he's French so they could get the Quebec vote. Because provincial parties == federal parties, right? Guess that means we should shit all over the BC and Alberta NDP because of the stupid shit Jagmeet Singh says, and attribute all of Kathleen Wynne's past sins to Trudeau too, right?
I'm sorry for this becoming difficult for your voting plan for the next federal election, but this on the Liberal Party and unfortunately (hypocritically naive, single-issue and personality driven) voters who abandoning the NDP - rather instead reforming it on their image - and trying blindly think the federal Liberals is "better" despite this may happen if reality has backfired on them. For the last one while is half true, but like the UK, its parliamentary representative democracy which still make very possible a third party to gain 2-16 seats when climbing up the polls anyway, with some consequence as delayed it by 1-5% backwards for third parties and occasionally the second major party, due of having outdated math.
Conservative parties writ large across the country have destructive and regressive policies as far as I'm concerned. I'm talking about their guiding ideology as well, if you can call it that. These are all the same kind of people embracing the dangerous, bottom of the barrel populism like we've seen with the canadian yellow vest movement. Scheer, Ford, Kenney, they're all far more dangerous to the future of the country by virtue of their economic policies, environmental policies, and clear penchant for corruption. They're leveraging this scandal to gain power, and it's going to be at the expense of everyone. That doesn't excuse what the Liberals have done; I'm mainly stating that they're a terrible alternative if people are dissatisfied with the Liberals. I'm only slightly less upset with the left-wing opposition and the government for being so fucking hapless. For the record, I think Singh was one of the worst possible choices for an NDP leader - Charlie Angus would've been far more capable of taking the NDP where they needed to go - and Notley is a spineless stooge of the oil and gas industry. They should be some kind of reasonable alternative to the dumpster fire that is the constant back-and-forth between the libs and cons, but they've categorically failed in that regard.
What I'm interested in is what the hell the Cons would have done differently had this happened under them
And I wholeheartedly disagree that the Conservatives would be worse for the country. Frankly, the idea that Scheer is using populism to push his campaign when he has the personality and charisma of a used condom is laughable. I find the policies of the Liberals to be far more dangerous than the Conservatives, especially since the #1 complaint people have about the Conservatives' social policies is invalid, which is that they will ban abortions and gay marriage, because they won't. They voted in 2016 to remove the portion of their party policy about the "traditional" view of marriage by a 2/3 margin, and the party since Harper has been firm on not touching abortions, regardless of what some backbenchers say. Scheer has also said he's not going to ban weed putting that boogeyman to rest. Now I don't like everything the Conservatives believe in either, which is why I'm not a party member with them or any of the other parties, but I happen to think they'll be less shit for the country than the Liberals or NDP, especially with the Liberals having attempted to interfere with the justice system here, having questioned its integrity in the Coulten Boushie case and pledged to basically amend jury selection to be deliberately biased against certain types of defendants, having drafted (possibly passed, I'm not sure where it is right now) legislation that makes it basically impossible to defend yourself against a sexual assault claim, having passed drunk-driving legislation that allows the cops to arbitrarily breathalyze you, potentially even take a blood sample without cause, charge you if you refuse, and also charge you up to 2 hours after they allege you may have driven drunk, which creates an issue of reverse onus where you have to prove you weren't driving. On top of this, I hate Trudeau's father, who is the only reason he was elected in the first place. And I will also admit that as a gun owner I am biased against a party that is trying to ban a significant portion of my gun collection for political points based on lies and slander about Canada's gun owners. I'd have voted Liberal if Marc Garneau was their leader instead of Trudeau, like he should have been. I hate the NDP, I think that they have no idea how money works and most of their social policies that I've seen seem to promote further restrictions on things in the name of "being progressive," and their current leader is the definition of a disconnected champagne socialist, not too dissimilar to Trudeau who hasn't earned his place in life and was handed it through a legacy created by his father. Do I like the screeching mouthbreathers in the backbench of the Conservative caucus who keep trying to bring up abortion and gay marriage, only to have it shot down and told to shut up every time they try? No, those morons should go join the Christian Heritage party if they want to push ass-backwards religious bullshit. Do I like the fact that Scheer is in the pocket of the dairy lobby? No, but then again what party isn't, they're the most powerful lobby in the country. Do I like the fact that he has the charisma and personality of a used condom, like I said previously? No. But just like you think they'd be massive shit but the Liberals or NDP would be less shit, I think the Liberals or NDP would be massive shit and the Conservatives would be less shit. And I hope that when Trudeau loses this election and gets hopefully kicked out as party leader, that they choose someone who is actually worth voting for, because none of the last 3 choices have been IMO. Regardless of my opinion I live in Toronto, so realistically my riding's going either NDP or Liberal. The last time my area went Conservative was Mulroney, but he won basically everywhere, though Etobicoke and Scarborough went Conservative for Harper, well, mostly they went Conservative against Ignatieff.
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