This show was like every way you're not supposed to portray suicide on television. The suicide itself is treated like some kind of act of revenge, it's gross.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pi478whGCPA
good vid btw
they literally consulted with multiple mental health professionals who told them what not to do, and in almost every case they went ahead and did what they were expressly told not to do. a toddler could have seen how bad this was going to be
Holy shit, a 28.9% increase??? Why the fuck isn't Netflix criminally liable for producing this unethical garbage?
The show basically glorifies the act. Its sickening and Netflix should be ashamed.
Wow a show that has its producers and writers saying fuck all to established mental health information/research even thought they were told not to by said mental health professionals, is responsible for an mass increase suicide rates, who would have guess that would happen.
I remember watching one episode cause everyone around me bitch about it being good (or maybe they were patronizing me) and got pissed off cause it seemed like it was write by people who think what suicide/suicidal-thoughts/depression it.
and because it spreads the wrong kind of message about these topics, so now i had a bunch of people who knew jack shit thinking they knew everything when it comes to mental health.
I can believe this based on my own experience with Prozac Nation. I've never watched 13 reasons why based on my past experience.
But with that being said there is no mention of there being any link to 13 reasons why other then the timeline. The months they mentioned in 2017 actually had a lot of stuff going on - tax bills, suicide bombers, paris agreement, bus being rammed by a train, sex scandles with fox news, refugee/immigration bills being sent through congress and approved, trump taking office (January), etc.
They've also completely left the second season of 13 reasons why out of this article. Sure, it was released in May 2018. But if there were suicides from it that data should have been available by now to the public.
So, I'm not convinced. If they had data linking the deaths directly to 13 reasons why (netflix account history, parent testimony, suicide notes, etc) it would be nice if they put that in there.
Because regardless of how scary the headline is, an association does not demonstrate anything causative. Correlation =/= causation.
There's not even evidence of correlation. Two events happening around the same time doesn't even prove correlation, there has to be more data to make that kind of connection.
Not basically, it completely and unashamedly glorifies the act of suicide as the perfect revenge against all those who wronged you. This increase doesn't surprise me in the slightest.
Doesn't help that the show is fucking terrible in the first place, now it's also caused a rise in suicides.
Maybe the whole increase in suicide rates wasn't fully caused by this,but with the way it presents mental health and how it's aimed towards teens,no doubt this might've caused something to happen in certain teens.
Isn't it like a massive no-no to depict suicide in detail in shows? I remember the first season had an entire episode essentially dedicated to a flashback of her killing herself in extreme detail, from like her buying the razors to a close of her slowly cutting her wrists in the tub. I haven't been suicidal for ages and that scene brought some dark shit up, I couldn't imagine the effect of seeing it as a teen with issues, plus the rest of the show pretty much saying what she did was justified.
I honestly got a kinda smarmy vibe from the show off the bat, it feels like its goal is to be stand-out by delving into dark shit other shows have the common decency not to touch, but hides it with pseudo-psychology "its opening a dialogue!" bullshit
I couldn't watch it for this reason as well. It just brought back to much from the darkest point in my life. I had anxiety any time I attempted to watch it.
There's a statistic that they use on my politics course at uni to make people sceptical of correlations, and that't that the number of drownings in the US correlates with the number of Nicholas Cage films released in that year.
Wasn't there a website that let you mash together bullshit correlations like these on a fun graph?
That example just makes me less skeptical honestly
https://tylervigen.com/spurious-correlations
Theres correlation =/= causation then theres, “The number of deaths by suicide recorded in April 2017 was greater than the number seen in any single month during the five-year period examined by the researchers.”
This show went blockbuster viral with reported copycats and the whole show was accessible to 150 million Netflix subscribers which could mean millions of families and unsupervised highly impressionable children and teenagers. A record 28% in suicide rates in age 10-17 during the month a viral tv show about teen suicide comes Is suspect but unprovable as correlative, true. Of course you’re never going to know every factor in the increase but even if one extra teenager saw this and fed into the ideology of the show (like the copycats) then Netflix is criminally negligent in their glorification of suicide as a means of revenge. There has been ample research showing that when mass media portrays certain behaviors like mass shootings or certain types of murder there are an increase in those behaviors.
Yeah no, large numbers of suicides coinciding with the release of some show still doesn't mean that show caused any of those suicides. That's not how statistics works on any level. No statistic that doesn't come from a well-designed experimental study can demonstrate causation, period. The fact of the matter is that the effects of media are subtle and demonstrating that some particular work of media caused some particular action is pretty much impossible. Psychology is too complicated to say that this show caused anyone to do anything. What we can do is look at a work of media and ask whether its themes are saying something reasonable and accurate, and critique the work if it's saying something problematic. Make Netflix know why its show is problematic, and what they did wrong. But there's no case that could actually be brought against Netflix in court here.
Except there has been literal confirmed copycats who watched the show and left tapes. I don't see what you're not getting.
It's worth noting that even putting up suicide hotline posters in an area is tightly correlated with spikes in suicide rates. Which is the big reason why we don't publish about suicides in papers unless it's a matter of public interest.
So yeah it was basically damned from the start no matter what they did.
There's also been confirmed shootings where the attacker was inspired by the joker in the Batman films and . However, can we say that this means if those films were not released, these people would not have done an equally violent act, just in a different, non-batman-related form? We can't say either way, our understanding of the human brain isn't substantial enough to make that determination. In the same way, there is no way at all to say that an individual suicide would not have happened if they had not seen the show,.because the human brain is tremendously complex and their suicidalism is caused by a very large number of factors. Of course media has effects on people, but the effects of media are subtle. It's impossible to demonstrate beyond a reasonable double that this particular work had this particular effect on this particular person, because we just don't understand enough about the brain to determine that, so you're never going to get anywhere with this in a criminal court.
With respect to the broader picture increases in suicide rates, you cannot infer a causality from one factor coinciding with another. You cannot infer causation from correlation. Take a statistics course. You can theorize about the effects a piece of media might have, based on its contents, but these statistics don't demonstrate those effects, because they're strictly associations, not causative.
Come back with data correlating people who watched the series to an increased suicide rate when compared to those who didn't and then the numbers will begin to mean something.
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