It's not like anyone's been screaming at Corbyn for over a year to drop his personal euroskeptic attitude long enough to halt article 50 and at least rethink the Brexit approach like oh planning a single fucking thing ahead of triggering A50. No, I can't see how anyone in Labour could've possibly predicted that they'd be unpopular and suffer election setbacks if they supported going through with May's Brexit.
Let's remember that it has been over two years since May triggered Article 50, the UK has managed to wheedle the EU into giving them an extension, and now the Labour party is going "we should think about fighting Brexit". These dumb cunts deserve every single one of the seat losses the Libdems took off them.
I want to love Corbyn, but I seriously can't see why so many European leftists have such mangled stances on the EU.
Corbyn in particular, at least according to rumors, dislikes being in the EU because he thinks it prevents nationalisation and state aid which are both part of his economic plans.
Whether that is accurate is up for much debate as I understand it.
I got the same impression from Mélenchon. It's extremely myopic of them to check their radicalism at their respective borders imo.
They're the real old-school hardline leftists who never adapted to the changes of the 21st century.
This is the problems with all leftists being either in their 70s or 20s.
Well, I preferring the Greens to be the new 'left-wing/centrist' major party nationally, than them if Labour Party screw themselves up in this voting crises. Especially this is still the same party who historically screwing themselves up, either as their original identity (the Liberal Party) and its post-merger since the 80s. Along their are couple recent seat projections, could saying they aren't have enough constituencies to beat the then-newly possible right-wing "populist" eurosceptic Brexit party, even they're polling higher in one poll says.
I really hope they never get into power, their nuclear and military plans would set the country back actual decades in terms of progress and lead to us relying on foreign aid even more for power and military needs. Corbyn's nuclear and weapons plans are markedly less of a cake and arse party in contrast.
Even you can criticized their other meh to bad (based on person's ideology like yours) policies, unlike you Pro-Liberal [Democrat] folk. They do also other policies (Mainly Pro-European view like the Liberal Democrats, SNP, and Plaid Cymru) has now also benefited from the EU election success too, As a new poll suggested.
Way to be an absolute bellend.
Labour voter, BTW. Not that it fucking matters what I vote, if I think a party's policies are shit, I think they're shit. Don't argue like this, you just look a tit.
I've noticed that you seem to be a Green Party fanboy regardless of whether the context is the US, Canadian, Australian, or UK Greens - very different parties in different political environments.
It's okay to like a party but I'm not sure you know more about each party than the assumptions associated with the name.
Your undying loathing of the Liberal Democrats for no other reason than...well, whatever your reason is, is getting rather annoying. Idealism (be it right or wrong) would see the Greens in any substantial office of power. Realism says they'll continue to be stuck in the political valley they've lurked in for years; a recent poll (that I conveniently have lost the link to, but will edit this if I find it) said a Remainer is more likely to vote Conservatives than they are Green. Greens aren't rocketing into power anytime soon, they're just benefiting from a political period in which Brits are starting to reject a two-party state. People love to look at political shifts without considering the context, with a great example of this being that polls up until recently said Labour would win a General Election; "that means Corbyn is well-liked". Uh, no? Not at all, people just hated the Tories more (though not substantially, might I add).
loyal supporter (lol) only in few countries like Germany's Green's are getting attractive success right now.
It depends if they nearly sharing the same political position (Left-wing to center-left) to liking them.
I just don't like Liberal Democrats, regardless of their occasionally successful political trend e.x. Brexit/EU issue, Along I realized it was a former major party (the Liberal Party, I just mentioned minutes ago) from several decades ago, and currently a third place 'traditional' party that has historically effected their country's history.
have you ever explained why, though?
This is why I now consider it no longer worthy of even debating with you. I'm a Labour supporter, and even then I'm not hardline. You assuming that I'm libdem purely because I dislike the Greens is catastrophically shortsighted and is a great way to make enemies for yourself.
Dude, your pathetic old view has likely become accidentally dated, as after their success has made the official polling group to having them a 5 to 6 increase as the two polls (including one I got from that UK poll tracking page said).
Leftists and liberals have pretty serious differences
me: "dont rely on polls"
Evidence: Lib Dems polled as biggest party for a period under Clegg, ultimately came 3rd within less than a month later.
you: "but greens are polling well, you're so pathetic omg"
Congratulations on proving spectacularly that I would have a more enlightening debate with a rotten apple than with you. Oh, and you still haven't explained your loathing of the Liberal Democrats.
I dunno if this an appropriate comparison but it reminds me of Bernie being more protectionist.
"Technically" I did as historical reasons why I'm not a fan of them. But even they have okay policies, including their version of the European Union issue, they could be a bit same as the Conservative Party.
As of the two recent and the same weird polls I already suggested they are a bit direct rising, after the two major traditional parties fallen out.
'Historical reasons' sounds like you disliked something before having a reason to, and now you've scraped at a barrel to try and find a justification, but you do you. Moreover, Brexit has proven that one-policies stick REALLY WELL. Brexit Party has no manifesto, nothing beyond "We'll leave" and look how they did. For better or worse, manifestos are being abandoned. Lib Dems, or any party for that matter, can have a wishy-washy manifesto and & other policies but will still do well as long as they have the Remain vote. Greens lack the Remain vote & the push for environmentalism hasn't been as energetic and lucrative at the polls as we may all have wished. People are voting Lib Dems on Brexit. That's it. Most don't care about the rest of the liberal rhetoric.
2.
My point: Polls aren't always reliable.
You: But I'm going off the most recent poll.
Ok. Still haven't rebutted my point. Polls aren't always reliable; stop thinking they will be a direct reflection of forecoming elections, especially a general election. People vote differently on the day and people vote differently for different elections. Also, some people don't admit who they REALLY vote for. Shy Tories are a well-known thing at this point. Polls CAN be indicative, but reliance on them as the basis of a prediction is likely to fall apart the second another poll contradicts the one you're relying on.
If that so, than why they gained more 4 (7 overall) seats (They have 3 after the 2014 election) for your countries' likely final EU election then? These voters who voted those four Green MEP candidates, seems they looked at their own version of the EU issue while they have better reasons to be 'Never' Liberal Democrats vote due of having a better voting system there, than in the UK horrible voting system.
You forgot that the Scottish voters voted the Scottish Nationalist Party than the Liberal Democrats as their Pro-EU party and in the Brexit Referendum, remaining influenced, genius.
Newsflash: You're not as smart as you think you are, I'm afraid. Comprehension would make your arguments slightly closer to 'gotcha!' than they actually are.
1. Yeah, I stand by this; it has been discussed on BBC News (probabl Sky News too) in-depth that we can't assume all Green votes came on the basis of Remain. They interviewed people on the street and what came back was that a lot of new Green voters did it on the basis of the environment 'which had been forgotten about during Brexit', to quote a specific old lady. But that doesn't serve your narrative so you'll just neglect to mention that. Facepunchers themselves, if I recall, voted Green for the same reason whilst having Brexit as a sort of second thought.
2. Nice quote snatching to try and undermine the argument. Didn't work, but nice attempt. Scottish Independence has started polling well again, and Nicola Sturgeon has run on the platform of a second IndyRef for a while now. There's also a rejection of Labour & Tories. Scotland has a lot on its plate.
You throw around unsubtle insults because you think each of your points is some revolutionary argument, when in reality you've done a rather pitiful job of showing yourself to not be worth an argument more serious than 'what colour is the sky?'
3. No, not accidentally. And it's not a Lib Dem thing; it's a country thing, bar Scotland (though still a dominant part of their voting decision). I was rather surprised some people on Facepunch had a myriad of voting issues, because a lot of people are driven solely by Brexit, including people I know in person. For once, I don't have a HUGE problem with that. Brexit is a massive thing, bigger than you give it credit. It is being called the biggest political crisis since WW2. I think people can be allowed, RIGHT OR WRONG (you missed those key words, didn't you?), to vote supremely on 'hey, do you want to throw unpredictability into the next generation of British economics?' I also have no idea what 'political junkies' tries to imply.
I sympathise with the Green cause, I really do, but it came at a terrible time. I hope they do well because I'd like to see a bigger push on environmentalism, but their leaders at the moment don't impress me and I personally believe they're too used to being a small party that can throw anything out in desperation to get votes. Lib Dems do that too, but it's been more lucrative for them than the Greens.
Stop putting faith in +3 seats = MASS SUCCESS IN THE FUTURE. If that happens, what a nice surprise. If it doesn't, oh look, nobody is surprised.
I still think we're ultimately, and sadly, going to be trapped in a two-party state, though I'm not sure when exactly the Tories will bounce back (or Labour for that matter).
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