On This Day, 30 Years Ago, Nothing Happened: Tiananmen Square Anniversary
33 replies, posted
I figured since this is a historic and once-in-a-lifetime day it might be prudent to post some of the headlines and editorials concerning the 30th anniversary of the Tiananmen Square protests, also known as the June Protests, Student Riots, and the Tiananmen Square Massacre.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/31/tiananmen-square-protests-crackdown-intensifies-as-30th-anniversary-nears
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/06/01/tiananmen-square-museum-inhong-kong-teaches-chinese-massacre/
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/31/tiananmen-square-anniversary-what-sparked-the-protests-in-china-in-1989
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-02/tiananmen-square-massacre-30-year-anniversary/11163332
An insight from Xiaoming Li, a former junior officer, who says he never fired a gun during the massacre but has been overcome with guilt about the massacre ever since. His division arrived to the square late, only because the division commander ignored orders from headquarters, by pretending that they had communication equipment failure. That commander was removed from their position months later.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-china-blog-48455582
"Forgettance" really is good term for it.
I just watched the footage which was recently released on youtube then shared on reddit and I wouldnt be lying if I said that it made me shiver, especially the part where the soldiers shot at the bus filled with injured protestors.
Ironic thing is, the soldier who made the announcements on that video was referring to those student protestors as "ruffians" which was also used by both Erdolf's police and himself during the Gezi protests that took place in Istanbul a few years back.
Seems like all the totalitarian regimes are pretty much the same regardless whether they're left or right.
Free Tibet
"Due to the exigent circumstances, we as old soldiers, make the following request: Since the People's Army belongs to the people, it cannot stand against the people, much less kill the people, and must not be permitted to fire on the people and cause bloodshed; to prevent the situation from escalating, the Army must not enter the city."
It's a shame that the pleas of these old officers were unheard.
It's also odd to think that this happened under the guidance of the PRC's most reform-minded paramount leader.
We would also do well to remember the thousands of officers, and in turn their subordinates, who refused to obey such horrible orders. It's hard to determine the situation fully, but it is safe to say that the units involved in the crackdown had varying levels of sympathy for the protesters; there are even reports of standoffs and firefights between these units. Needless to say, it sounds like there was a strong framework for a second civil war, and it does make you wonder how things could have possibly turned out.
https://twitter.com/YaxueCao/status/1134607732718407680
what an odd coincidence
Was the footage this?
https://youtu.be/hA4iKSeijZI
Just watching something I wasn't even around to witness and seeing the oppsition the students faced while still standing up is enough to make me reel.
Someone in the comments thread on that tweet pointed this out:
https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/205174/f6a1e24e-eda7-4606-b2fc-305f16a1fe79/image.png
This is completely unsurprising, if you've been following tech news. A major element of China's endgame appears to be curbing free-speech worldwide by buying off as many social media and entertainment corporations as possible.
Letting them into the WTO was a fucking mistake. We should have never allowed them to become a major player in the world economy, not as long as their own economy continued to be run by the people behind Tiananmen Square.
money solved all social problems, china has put up too much concrete to have another revolution unless there is some cataclysmic problem in china
Are you fucking kidding me Twitter. Nazi's are ok and allowing the Chinese government to censor shit
Although I have extreme doubts of the truthfulness, here, this is Twitter's response:
https://twitter.com/Policy/status/1134825963089465344
https://twitter.com/Policy/status/1134825963836063745
https://twitter.com/Policy/status/1134825964750495744
https://twitter.com/Policy/status/1134825965501276160
I'd rather hope that this is the case, considering the alternatives of global influence.
A Chinese government minister has made a rare public statement about the massacre, defending it as "correct"
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-48489002
Our species as a whole still has many miles to go.
On the China censorship thing, there are many reason it worked so well in China.
For one, they never have an exact criteria of what's to ban and what not. While there are something that are clearly blacklisted like 64 or Tibet, a lot of the more minor things are never really stated until it happens, so people who are vocal about are pretty much constantly in fear.
On the other hand they're usually very lax about these smaller topics, as long as they don't make the headlines they'll mostly ignore it for the most part, and the during these more "sensitive" time they start cracking down all these things, so people generally accept the whole censorship thing as a thing that you only have the "endure" for a period of time rather than something to actively protest/fear/complain about, since it'll "eventually end".
I don't doubt a lot of those in China knew about all these things, they just don't care. With how cynical how things can be these days, a lot of them just ignore what they're seeing and just stay slient as long as the economy is great and they're all making money from it.
The only way China will be stopped is when their economy takes a nose dive, which I don't see it happening anytime soon.
Don't be so sure of that. Economic analysts have been worried about China's economy for quite some time, because its rapid growth has been fueled in large part by bullshit like building entire cities that proceed to sit empty and fall to pieces. Combine with with Xi being a big fanboy of Mao - meaning he hasn't learned jack shit from China's past and is potentially an incompetent blowhard himself - and you have a recipe for disaster. It is entirely possible that Xi could micromanage the economy to death, just as Mao literally micromanaged the Chinese people to death because of his complete ignorance about how farming and shit worked.
Yep and they are also saying that this trade war is having a somewhat significant and negative impact on their economy now
I will continue to blame the West for everything China does. This event should be an occasion for mass condemnation.
...What.
Good lord, man. Not even the super anti-US imperialism anarcho-coms I'm friends with blame Tiananmen Square or the deaths under Mao on the West. Are you a fucking tankie, or are you just shitposting?
Needs to earn his fifty cents somehow.
You really gonna drop a post like that without even explaining your reasoning?
Why should we blame the West?
I should perhaps clarify that I meant that the West is partially to blame for what China is currently doing, not blaming them for Tianamen Square. Evidently I was unclear.
Comments from new accounts I can't distinguish between jokes and real beliefs are increasing on FP recently.
I'll gladly blame the colonial era for the issues that seeded China's current social system but saying that the West is directly culpable for Tiananmen Square is nothing short of spinning bow-tie logic. Care to actually elaborate on your thoughts, or are you gonna sit there in silence after cutting off a nice big curly length of cable like that in an otherwise serious thread?
Its true. I talked with several Chinese people overseas, and they all know about it, but it feels like a 'necessary sacrifice' for prosperity, from what they told me.
Knowing history the only time things will change is either people are so broke that the majority couldn't even feed themselves, or an external force breaking up China. I am not see China to just pop and gone even when their economy blows up, there might be some new people on top, but nothing they do will change with all these propaganda.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jun/04/tiananmen-square-massacre-marked-with-hong-kong-vigil
Hong Kong remembers
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