Hey guys - made an account just now in an attempt to figure this one out!
I made a 1 x 4 base 11 stories high, doors on every square. So thats 3 doors per level 33 doors total so 66 c4 minimum to breech.
Decent deterrent IMO right? Well it worked for a while, no one had any interest in breaching 33 doors to get to my top floor.
On the outside I pillared up with Foundations at angles to my main foundation to prevent anyone from placing foundations near the walls to avoid popping doors on higher levels. this was also successful.
The only place they could possibly get was the roof as my pillars prevented access to any wall. (Even building stairs further away and trying to angle barricades at a 45 deg angle to get close enough to place c4.)
Ok so roof access? Big deal roofs are indestructible - so im like meh... let them stair up and parcore it over to the roof what are they gunna do?
I made one fatal error - They found the ONE place you could stair up. Once on my roof they went to the edge of it and got an angle on a wall and were able to place multiple c4 on the very edge of the wall to eventually take it out. They simply blew out my door on the inside and went into my chests - grabbed a metal door and placed it, locking us out.
The rest is history lol.
My question is - do any of you have any ideas on how to protect against a roof attack? The way i see this now is every single base is irrelevant in Rust ATM because all I need to do is get to the roof and do the same thing. At this point putting thought into building a defended base is pretty much moot, if I can just get to the roof.
I have 2 ideas, 1 of which is very expensive lol but doable. The other has not be tried so im not sure if it will work or not.
Easy fix, expand roof to beyond your actual walls below so that they cant do this?
[QUOTE=PR06AM3R;44066184]Easy fix, expand roof to beyond your actual walls below so that they cant do this?[/QUOTE]
Yup that was my second option up there but its untested - At this point I could do that but I would need 4 pillars to support the ceiling - but i cant have them building stairs so I would have to middle pillar it. Dunno if you can place a ceiling on top of more than 4 pillars and if so.. couldn't the enemy just place ceilings where ever he wanted as long as he had a 4 pillar config somewhere in your pillars?
If there's a pillar in the center you can't place a ceiling
My opinion, the problem is people defending against only one method. Your stash was at the very top of 11 stories, which is great from the bottom, terrible from the top. It's also the most likely place to to put it.
I suggest getting creative. Put your stash 6 floors up, and put a room at the 11th floor with empty boxes. Heck, put a few similar rooms throughout. If they had busted in the roof and found 6 stones, suddenly they got nothing, wasted C4, and have no guesses as to wear it actually is, making them go floor by floor by floor (which is what you wanted anyway). Sure, if it's in the middle it might be 33 C4 from the bottom instead instead of 66 like you had, but overall your actually much more defended.
If you extend the ceiling as suggested on the 11th floor and center pillar to the 10th you leave no area for other ceiling placement.
[B]Nyghtprowler[/B]
You can try to find spot, where you're house will be surrounded by rocks. I just made one on creative server, but misplaced surrounding foundations.
[URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCxIR0viUnU"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCxIR0viUnU[/URL]
You can't reach 6th and upper floors from outside the base. You can place metal foundations outside and stack 15 ramps on each, just to be sure raiders will use same amount of c4 like if they were using stairs.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/hGFfI16.png[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/olKuMOE.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/hBRp4lN.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/9nj5VEd.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/C4oZKc2.jpg[/IMG][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/8G2VmSd.jpg[/IMG]
The most raid deterring base at present is just a 1 story square as large as you can make it, with metal doors between each room and loot divided between the inner most rooms. Since ceilings are indestructible being only 1 story tall means they must go through each layer to get to the middle and there is no way to bypass most of your defenses.
I suggest putting fake chests in every room to prevent them skipping rooms to the sides by peaking. I also suggest not putting everything in the very middle to prevent the idea they should just blow their way to the middle room and get everything. A 5x5x1 base takes no less than 6 c4 to get to the middle room, but by spreading out your loot between rooms it would take 50 C4 to fully loot your house.
While this may seem like a lot of resources used, you save a lot by have no need to surround your base with extra foundations or pillars since they cannot get in from above, so they are welcome to run around your roof. Additionally you can build an unconnected from the inside tower at the middle or corners of your base if you really like being able to go up for a view or like having a beacon fire to help friends find home at night. This tower also provides a possible additional C4 waste as most raiders will assume they could use it to get farther in easier, which is why it should never have inside access to the base.
Now the one downside is that to build a base of great single level size takes a very large flat space, which doesn't exist in an highly hidden place. So I suggest living outside the area of spawns such as the wastelands, hacker valley or even farther north of everust. This does make stone and food far off, but if you have a small group you can stockpile food and some wood, then move there to create your base and people can get more wood from trees, which spawn over the entire map which is FAR(about 8 times larger than the entire around around the road) larger then the area with spawns.
Yeah I have thought of a flat base as well, but like you said you need hacker or some place flat like that.
My first option up top was to do what Kneon suggested :) I figured force them through 6 floors from the top or 6 floors from the bottom.
Problem is if they got to the roof you could C4 the first wall on the top and jump in. Then the floor they are standing on is the new roof. Repeat that 5 times checking each floor for the loot room.
In a wood house you are talking minimum 10 c4 to get to the middle floor ignoring doors.
Metal would be more difficult now your talking 7-8 c4 per floor. Then simply 2 c4 for each door on that floor.
The only way is decoy boxes on all floors with that method to make them go through everything wasting tons of c4.
Im starting to like the flat base Idea personally. I's just so damn tedious to play in - constantly going from room to room to room for each loot box ACK!
[QUOTE=gaspara112;44066534]The most raid deterring base at present is just a 1 story square as large as you can make it, with metal doors between each room and loot divided between the inner most rooms. Since ceilings are indestructible being only 1 story tall means they must go through each layer to get to the middle and there is no way to bypass most of your defenses.
I suggest putting fake chests in every room to prevent them skipping rooms to the sides by peaking. I also suggest not putting everything in the very middle to prevent the idea they should just blow their way to the middle room and get everything. A 5x5x1 base takes no less than 6 c4 to get to the middle room, but by spreading out your loot between rooms it would take 50 C4 to fully loot your house.
While this may seem like a lot of resources used, you save a lot by have no need to surround your base with extra foundations or pillars since they cannot get in from above, so they are welcome to run around your roof. Additionally you can build an unconnected from the inside tower at the middle or corners of your base if you really like being able to go up for a view or like having a beacon fire to help friends find home at night. This tower also provides a possible additional C4 waste as most raiders will assume they could use it to get farther in easier, which is why it should never have inside access to the base.
Now the one downside is that to build a base of great single level size takes a very large flat space, which doesn't exist in an highly hidden place. So I suggest living outside the area of spawns such as the wastelands, hacker valley or even farther north of everust. This does make stone and food far off, but if you have a small group you can stockpile food and some wood, then move there to create your base and people can get more wood from trees, which spawn over the entire map which is FAR(about 8 times larger than the entire around around the road) larger then the area with spawns.[/QUOTE]
On one server, I did this AND combined it with my other suggestion. So I did a 1-floor sprawl like this, then added a 2nd-floor with the exact same deal, except no loot, just dummy box rooms. You give yourself even more protection, as they most likely will start on the 2nd floor and burn everything there for nothing. When they are done there, they get to start from scratch on the 1st floor sprawl.
Yeah I think that is the plan :P
Just sucks last night I crafted 10k frags worth of Low Qual laid out the base design and built all my parts. HAD them in my inventory and was waiting for nightfall...
SHOTS FIRED!!!!!!!! WTF?! Put all parts in inventory and geared up!
They popped the wall, night fell and they were in there taking ALL my groups gear literally seconds prior to leaving the base for good to go build metal.
Oddly enough it was the admin and his friends.... Perfect timing or? :P
No biggie we have all tech researched in the game so its just a matter of looting a couple days worth of mats.
Honestly at that point does it even matter if you use wood or metal? I mean 99% of the base would be doors, so at that point its 2-3 c4 regardless.
*I guess from a maintenance / decay standpoint metal would be easier to maintain.
I would just like to say, that I am the cause of this post haha. On a side note, There are plenty of ways to defend against it. :) Think outside the box my friend
Oh me being admin of my server didn't have anything to do with it :) And I run around with anyone on the server who wants to group, I am not paired or "friends" with certain people. I have added just about everyone who comes on the server and will happily run around in parties with anyone, its what I have fun doing in the game.
hahah Yes he is!
To your post YouDie, with my base - there was no way to defend that roof properly. You could basically walk out any distance in the yard far enough away and build stairs up higher than the base, hop to a pillar add to the height of it right next to the house.
Suicide, build your original stairs higher, jump to the new pillar height next to base and then to the roof.
You could spike the roof - but you could destroy those as well.
Im not seeing how to defend that roof yet lol.
I've scrapped that idea as a viable build :) Come on! lol what could you have done if that was your base to prevent what happened last night :P
You can fall from 6 stories and live. So what I'm saying is you could build up to 6 stories higher than my roof and far enough out and still monster jump that and land on the roof alive.
haha :) well your base would of been fine if you had that one spot with some pillars. Because it's alot harder to built up and jump from pillar to pillar with the right distance
[QUOTE='[DAWGS]YouDie;44066884']haha :) well your base would of been fine if you had that one spot with some pillars. Because it's alot harder to built up and jump from pillar to pillar with the right distance[/QUOTE]
Like I said - go 5-6 pillars higher you can literally gap that distance no problem.
It all falls into the placement of said Pillars my friend, and with a building that high, it leaves little room for error on the jump. Because if you miss, you are dead.
Yeah but just station a buddy down low to catch your shit if it goes south :P You run the risk of getting shot though i suppose.
If it was an offline raid - you could do it all day though.... not that us being online helped much lol.
Its a flat 5 x 5 or bigger from now on IMO :P Each room has one storage box with lots them being empty. I feel its the safest bet.
:)
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To protect the roof need to put celling around. But in this case it is desirable to add another layer foundation (around), because the nearest pillar will not be the full height and it can jump.
There are plenty of places within the rocks where you can max out the number of foundations that can be planted.. then it's simply a task of building a 7 story high base.
They can't stair up when there are literally zero room for foundations.
The last patch made it so wood takes 2xC4 no matter which way its place or where you place the C4. So I could assume metal is now 3. Either way the only thing you need to do is build your roof out further and piller up to the roof. You leave 1 gap at the top as you can't put pillars on the middle or side up to the roof but it doesn't matter as they can't build up anyhow, or build anything in that section.
A foundation can take 9 pillars, you can to fill your foundations with 9 pillars and do it all the way up. This leaves no way to put barricades, ramps, walls, large storage, or anything else they can use to build up. So you 9 pillar all the way up to your extended roof and your safe.
a 5x5 house 3-5 stories, with a 2 row foundation on the outside, my tip here as well is make a staircase to the roof, place spiked barrikades along the roof line all around, knock away the staircases upwards as you place pillars on the spots they were built on along the way. also having a staircase from 2nd floor to 5th, then down to nr 4/3 means they will get very confused, using regular barricades blocking the view from the outside also helps, and make sure to place boxes in EVERY room causing them to waste tons and tons of more materials to raid you then you would ever risk loosing.
This usually is enough to scare away even the most geared raiders as it is mostly a huge waste of c4's/grenades and make sure to never have more then 2-4 items per room.
Edit : of course pillars around on the empty foundations with barricades as well. and MAKE SURE TO HAVE THE PILLARS HIGHER THEN THE HOUSE !!!!!!!!!!!
Make your base super high with all kinds of doors, and put your stuff on the first floor. Everybody will think your stuff is up top, when its really down low.
For the roof. Since its a 1X4, make the top 2 floors ramps.
Ramps stack ... and they form an 'eaves' at the top. So that you can't put the c4 on the wall below.
I put my 4 pillars down and 3 walls, then place the ramps down at all four angles. For each angle, put at least 1-2 stacked ramps - then load up on the sides with the walls (7-8 ramps stacked). Once the ramps are in place, lay your last wall and then you can place a ceiling on top of that. Then move to the next cube. It's pretty bad assed.
If you haven't done it, its hard to imagine, but ideally, put most of the stacked ramps on the walls that raiders would have access to, although you have 4 angles, I usually lay 1 on each angle, then lay 7-8 on the 2 angles that have the walls. That way its a chore to c4 or pickaxe the ramps down.
Can they drop to the ramp ledge and pick axe it for 20 minutes? yes, then fall to their death. then they still have 15 more ramps to go through. The amount of c4 to get through all those ramps is insane -- try it on creative.
Once your ceiling is on -- line it with as many spike strips as you can fit on the roof (they will not decay) --- then just suicide or jump off the roof.
[QUOTE=SteelPanther;44067908]Make your base super high with all kinds of doors, and put your stuff on the first floor. Everybody will think your stuff is up top, when its really down low.[/QUOTE]
In the middle levels is better. Most folks that have raided me and my friends who were still learning this stuff, had hid it on the bottom or top floor. Neither is safe. Random middle level is safer, since most dolts try and raid you from the bottom or top. Nothing should be stored on those levels that isn't going to be missed.
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