I know many people here like to use Twitter's 'Bootstrap' framework for designing/creating websites and mock-ups.
They've recently moved to a new home rather than their old twitter.github.com/bootstrap (You can still access it using the old link),
[URL]http://getbootstrap.com/[/URL]
Bootstrap 3 is in release candidate stage but it's looking pretty swell.
What are your thoughts/views about Bootstrap and the new Bootstrap?
Bootstrap is good if you're trying to do a tech demo or some shit, and you are not a designer or you don't have time to make a good site for it. But it's overused.
I think I like this new one more, I've always preferred flat over gradients and shit.
See, now that is nice. Although I really don't see myself using it.
[QUOTE=RusselG;41611673]Bootstrap is good if you're trying to do a tech demo or some shit, and you are not a designer or you don't have time to make a good site for it. But it's overused.
I think I like this new one more, I've always preferred flat over gradients and shit.[/QUOTE]
It's overused? What? It would be cool if only 10 people used it?
[QUOTE=garry;41611831]It's overused? What? It would be cool if only 10 people used it?[/QUOTE]
It gets boring and dull when many people use it. So yes, it would be cool if only a few used it.
[QUOTE=garry;41611831]It's overused? What? It would be cool if only 10 people used it?[/QUOTE]
This, I don't get why people always use this argument - the only valid reason I don't like seeing it, is because a lot of people don't change it from the default design, bootstrap can look great with just a little bit of customization, but a lot of people don't bother.
I really like the new design. It gives it more of a framework/incomplete-feel that it should've had at the very start. I'm using it for a project I'm working on and it's great as everything is basically done for me and I can tweak it to my hearts desire, not only that but it has really good naming schema so anyone can jump on your project and immediately be familiar with all the different controls and markup.
[QUOTE=Snakess;41611966]This, I don't get why people always use this argument - the only valid reason I don't like seeing it, is because a lot of people don't change it from the default design, bootstrap can look great with just a little bit of customization, but a lot of people don't bother.[/QUOTE]
I agree. There's loads of good websites online for Bootstrap that allow you to easily design your own colour schemes for Bootstrap (and download others) and other customization tools. [URL="http://www.bootswatch.com"]Bootswatch[/URL] is also a pretty easy way of changing the default theme to something a bit more unique.
Personally i wouldn't use twitter bootstrap for a customers frontend.
My sole reason for this is because our customers needs often requires too
much customization for us to benefit from twitter bootstrap.
I however used it quite often when developing small backend administration systems.
If the project is built outside the framework we normally use twitter bootstrap is the choice
i mostly go for.
I must say I'm very surprised how many features they packed into those minimized 7kb.
So far it looks great!
I like bootstrap, a lot. BS3 just reaffirms its greatness to the dev community
[QUOTE=garry;41611831]It's overused? What? It would be cool if only 10 people used it?[/QUOTE]
It's overused in it's default state. There is so much people can do with it, I just hate seeing it default.
Basically what Snakess said.
Bootstrap is ok but I really can't stand people who just go and launch sites using the default template and styling. A least use it as a framework or something and spice it up a bit like we're [url=http://dev.tf2r.com/]doing[/url].
[QUOTE=EDDY TT;41614579]Bootstrap is ok but I really can't stand people who just go and launch sites using the default template and styling. A least use it as a framework or something and spice it up a bit like we're [url=http://dev.tf2r.com/]doing[/url].[/QUOTE]
Meh. Personally I don't find the site you linked to be all that tastefully designed but different strokes for different folks.
Bootstrap gives an excellent starting point for someone to get content [i]out there[/i] when they would otherwise not be able to effectively create a website and lay it out in a manner that is conducive to conveying an idea.
So because some people use a framework with it's default settings, you can't customise it and make it look completely different? Because that annoys you? I don't see the logic...#
Anyway, excited for the mobile-first changes.
The style is looking more and more like Foundation.
I really like Bootstrap, and I don't care when a lot of starter websites use it. My problem is when they don't follow Bootstrap guidelines or even basic guidelines of HTML and completely butcher the layout, creating problems with fluidity and spacing.
I've never actually used any frameworks like this in any attempts at web development I've made...am I really missing out on anything? I mean, I've never actually completed a personal project to completion, but a few coursework projects I've made would have allowed use of frameworks :v:
it'll save you about 5 whole seconds doing anything
using it is actually a bigger waste of time than writing your own styling if you're a competent web developer/designer
[QUOTE=acpm;41653544]it'll save you about 5 whole seconds doing anything
using it is actually a bigger waste of time than writing your own styling if you're a competent web developer/designer[/QUOTE]
I disagree, proper fluid layouts are tricky to get right. It is made a lot easier with Bootstrap. Hell, now we also have the capacity to dynamically change layouts based upon the viewport size (without self-written media queries) in Bootstrap 3, just like Foundation 3.
[QUOTE=andersonmat;41653773]I disagree, proper fluid layouts are tricky to get right. It is made a lot easier with Bootstrap. Hell, now we also have the capacity to dynamically change layouts based upon the viewport size (without self-written media queries) in Bootstrap 3, just like Foundation 3.[/QUOTE]
This is one of the reasons I was considering start to learn a framework, responsive design isn't really my strong point, I could probably learn it quite quickly, but I'm having a hard time finding solid resources for it :v:
[QUOTE=acpm;41653544]it'll save you about 5 whole seconds doing anything
using it is actually a bigger waste of time than writing your own styling if you're a competent web developer/designer[/QUOTE]
so far as I've seen, responsive designs are fucking complicated compared to just using bootstrap and retheming it from there.
[QUOTE=acpm;41653544]it'll save you about 5 whole seconds doing anything
using it is actually a bigger waste of time than writing your own styling if you're a competent web developer/designer[/QUOTE]
Uuuhh.. no...
[QUOTE=acpm;41653544]it'll save you about 5 whole seconds doing anything
using it is actually a bigger waste of time than writing your own styling if you're a competent web developer/designer[/QUOTE]
I agree with this from the perspective that, with frameworks like this, my experience has been if you want/need to do something that isn't the "bootstrap way" the framework becomes a royal pain in the ass to work with.
I started a project with foundation recently and ended up having to rip foundation out because it was not responding the way I wanted it to on lower resolutions.
I think you can get way better results by doing the whole responsive thing specifically for your site instead of trying to let a framework do it.
[editline]31st July 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=AndrewPH;41656574]so far as I've seen, responsive designs are fucking complicated compared to just using bootstrap and retheming it from there.[/QUOTE]
Responsive design is not nearly as difficult as people seem to think it is.
Simply using Bootstrap / Foundation for its responsive grid capabilities and then doing the rest yourself goes a long way. It's pretty much all I use it for.
Fluid layouts are a royal pain in the ass, you'd think simply setting 33.333% would work, but no, fuck you it doesn't. Want to add padding? Yeah, have fun.
[QUOTE=andersonmat;41665241]Simply using Bootstrap / Foundation for its responsive grid capabilities and then doing the rest yourself goes a long way. It's pretty much all I use it for.
Fluid layouts are a royal pain in the ass, you'd think simply setting 33.333% would work, but no, fuck you it doesn't. Want to add padding? Yeah, have fun.[/QUOTE]
The grid systems are my least favorite part of these frameworks. As soon as you want to do something that falls off the grid you end up fighting the tool that is supposed to be making your job easier. I also think that if you're doing responsive design properly you shouldn't just be throwing everything in a 12 column grid and letting the framework handle your responsiveness for you, because the way that your website should be responding up/down is incredibly dependent on your design.
[QUOTE=KmartSqrl;41665353]Because the way that your website should be responding up/down is incredibly dependent on your design.[/QUOTE]
I do agree, but then again most people who do end up going for frameworks like these do not need incredibly in-depth responsiveness and simply just need to make it "readable" on mobile devices.
[QUOTE=KmartSqrl;41664928]I agree with this from the perspective that, with frameworks like this, my experience has been if you want/need to do something that isn't the "bootstrap way" the framework becomes a royal pain in the ass to work with.
I started a project with foundation recently and ended up having to rip foundation out because it was not responding the way I wanted it to on lower resolutions.
I think you can get way better results by doing the whole responsive thing specifically for your site instead of trying to let a framework do it.
[editline]31st July 2013[/editline]
Responsive design is not nearly as difficult as people seem to think it is.[/QUOTE]
I've mostly avoided frameworks for that reason, if I want something they don't explicitly work with it might be more of a pain than just coding it from scratch.
While I'm at it, has anyone got any good resources for responsive design (up to date ones at that :v:)? It's one of my major areas of weakness in HTML.
[QUOTE=acpm;41653544]it'll save you about 5 whole seconds doing anything
using it is actually a bigger waste of time than writing your own styling if you're a competent web developer/designer[/QUOTE]
Which is why a bunch of start-ups use it right?
Because its a waste of time?
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