[b]Nightmare Church RC3 (Halloween Map!)[/b]
This is a scary church map made for HL2DM made for Deathmatch gameplay.
The map will also work for HL2ep2 and Gmod if you just want to look around. (Build Time 10 months in total)
[img]http://forum.tsgk.com/images/icons/icon2.gif[/img] [b]Map Download Link[/b]
[url]http://gtamike.tsgk.com/my_maps/hl2mp/maps/gm_nightmare_church_rc3.bsp.bz2[/url]
[b]Install[/b]
The map .bsp file goes here after you extract with winrar.
[u]C:\Program Files\Steam\steamapps\Your-Steam-Name-Here\half-life 2 deathmatch\hl2mp\maps[/u]
or
[u]C:\Program Files\Steam\steamapps\Your-Steam-Name-Here\half-life 2 episode two\ep2\maps[/u]
or
[u]C:\Program Files\Steam\steamapps\Your-Steam-Name-Here\garrysmod\garrysmod\maps[/u]
The map is out of BETA Stage and has been heavily updated in all areas.
(Lighting, effects, textures, lots of details, more scary, improved brush work, better optimized and the list goes on)
There's a few things in the map that will try to scare you. >:)
Keep an eye out for secrets/hidden things as I added lots.
Let me know what you think. ;)
_______________________________________________________________________________
[b]KEY AUTHORS[/b]
[code]gtamike_TSGK
Mapper[/code]
_______________________________________________________________________________
[b]CONTRIBUTORS[/b]
[code]stoopdapoop (From interlopers)
Optimizing/Recompiling about 40 models to cheaper prop_static
Laggomundi (gamebanana)
For his inside detailed church roof brush Prefab
Alex Brown (my old friend)
For doing the Church Illustration Art Painting (Front Cover For Map) http://abrownart.deviantart.com[/code]
_______________________________________________________________________________
[b]SPECIAL THANKS[/b]
[code]TopHATTwaffle (Youtube)
For his useful SDK Hammer youtube video tutorials.
3kliksphilip (Youtube)
For his useful SDK Hammer youtube video tutorials.
Thecorp303 (Youtube)
Help on how to pack orange box engine particles in the map .bsp
Borg_TSGK
Private Beta tester (constructive feedback)
http://www.freesound.org
For a few sounds that was added to the map.[/code]
_______________________________________________________________________________
[b]Tools Used[/b]
[code]SDK Hammer
Photoshop
Serif PhotoPlus 9.0
MDL Decompiler Fixed
guistudiomdl_2.2
peazip (powerful .bz2 tool)
MDLTextureInfo_1.0
pakrat-095
packbsp-2.0.5
VIDE
Propper_0.3
MP3QualityModifier
MP3GainGUI
crazybump
Wavosaur.1.0.5.0
VTFedit
hl2 ep2 particle editor
Notepad++[/code]
_______________________________________________________________________________
[b]Ingame Screenshots[/b]
[img]http://gtamike.tsgk.com/dm_ob_nightmare_church_rc1/screen_(6).jpg[/img]
Looks very Unreal-y, some areas need more work and the lighting should be less colourful if you want it to be scary. Right now it looks like a party.
[QUOTE=gtamikes;38275003]When testing the beta in 2011 for Half Life 2 Deathmatch people complaint about not being able to see each other that easily. The lighting and colour change helped fix this small problem. ;)[/QUOTE]
The lighting and colour change also made it not scary ;)
[QUOTE=gtamikes;38275003]When testing the beta in 2011 for Half Life 2 Deathmatch people complaint about not being able to see each other that easily. The lighting and colour change helped fix this small problem. ;)[/QUOTE]
its meant to be scary. you couldve made it fullbright because hey it fixes the problem right. by adding lots of multicoloured lights youve made it look like a ps2 game
Stretched/low res textures, overuse of blood, the graveyard looks like a 60's disco floor, architecture is very square with little in the way of brush details.
I agree that it doesn't look scary but I actually kind of like the retro visual style.
Also I really like this for some reason:
[quote][img]http://gtamike.tsgk.com/dm_ob_nightmare_church_rc1/screen_(11).jpg[/img][/quote]
[QUOTE=gtamikes;38275043]"adjust brightness levels" video options :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]
by that logic you shouldnt have added the multicoloured lights in the first place
[editline]1st November 2012[/editline]
[quote][img]http://gtamike.tsgk.com/dm_ob_nightmare_church_rc1/screen_(11).jpg[/img][/quote][img]http://media.moddb.com/images/mods/1/19/18685/10324689840129442010_screenshots_2012-06-16_00003.jpg[/img]
heh did we use the same font
[editline]1st November 2012[/editline]
oh we didnt
It is apparent you put in alot of effort with the custom textures, bumpmaps for everything, custom foliage models etc.
The lighting is a big messy though and the lighting combined with the cliche stuff like red eyes, blood, jail cells, lightning, sparks, fires, pumpkins, blood writing on wall, church, grave yard etc makes it seem comic. Like one of those rides you go on in the fair ground.
The Custom stuff you got can be put to alot better use. Tone down the lighting, desaturate it slighty so it does look so disc/art movie.
Add more details to places, I see you have "trimmed" the walls cutting them into sections but add beams to the basement ceiling, cables from the lights etc
The brushwork isn't the best, nor is the lighting, but some some reason, it has a really nice charm and style to it. Good job.
Also, what is with that green tree in the front?
Nice...now the author is disagreeing with criticism...maybe you should take this shit on board, rather than just throwing it out with just a rating.
[QUOTE=TCB;38274761]Looks very Unreal-y, some areas need more work and the lighting should be less colourful if you want it to be scary. Right now it looks like a party.[/QUOTE]
Yeap, reminded me of a halloween party
[QUOTE=IronPhoenix;38279054]Nice...now the author is disagreeing with criticism...maybe you should take this shit on board, rather than just throwing it out with just a rating.[/QUOTE]
RE: Fill free to post these "Stretched/low res textures" then as that would be useful to me.
RE: "Graveyard looks like a 60's disco floor" So 60's disco floor is just green light? hmm if you say so.
[QUOTE=Grenade Man;38275276]TBH it doesn't look scary at all.[/QUOTE]
Load up the map and see if anything jumps out at you.
[QUOTE=Stiffy360;38278726]Also, what is with that green tree in the front?[/QUOTE]
Load up the map and see for yourself? There's many interactions and details not to be missed ;)
jump scares arent scary, its about atmosphere, which you are lacking
You have green, red and yellow in the graveyard...all very bright primary colours.
You have removed your ingame screens, meaning i can't point you at all your low res or stretched textures...how helpful.
also your sarcastic responses are making you seem like a cunt
[editline]2nd November 2012[/editline]
automerge why
[editline]2nd November 2012[/editline]
funny how he kept the screenshot with the worst brushwork and textures
Wrote my last post in a bit of a hurry...but compare this image:
[img]http://www.internetmonk.com/wp-content/uploads/church20exterior.jpg[/img]
with your church. Notice the lip on the roof of the one in the image, the butresses, the detailing on the ends and tops. Now look at your church...it looks flat, and square and dull.
[QUOTE=IronPhoenix;38289526]You have green, red and yellow in the graveyard...all very bright primary colours.
You have removed your ingame screens, meaning i can't point you at all your low res or stretched textures...how helpful.[/QUOTE]
F5 to take screenshots.
[QUOTE=IronPhoenix;38289955]
with your church. Notice the lip on the roof of the one in the image, the butresses, the detailing on the ends and tops. Now look at your church...it looks flat, and square and dull.[/QUOTE]
Well you do know you can use the secret ivy ladder to get on the roof right? It would be a true nightmare to get on the roof of the church you posted don't you think?
[QUOTE=gtamikes;38289974]F5 to take screenshots.[/QUOTE]
There already was a screen shot. Why should he download your map to show you something you already know?
[QUOTE=gtamikes;38289974]F5 to take screenshots.
Well you do know you can use the secret ivy ladder to get on the roof right? It would be a true nightmare to get on the roof of the church you posted don't you think?[/QUOTE]
You had screenshots of the map. You took them down. 90% of the time, that is how i rate maps.
Also, its f12 to take screenshots.
And if theives with ladders can get onto the roof of churches to nick the lead, a mapper should be able to find a cunning plot device to allow the player to get up there. Blaming your inadiquate mapping skill on player conveniance is a dumb thing to do.
You will find that we are much nicer to those who can take advice on board.
GUYS GUYS I FOUND THE PROBLEM.
[quote=Mr can't take advice]3kliksphilip (Youtube)
For his useful SDK Hammer youtube video tutorials.[/quote]
[QUOTE=gtamikes;38289974]F5 to take screenshots.
Well you do know you can use the secret ivy ladder to get on the roof right? It would be a true nightmare to get on the roof of the church you posted don't you think?[/QUOTE]
do you not understand the concept of criticism.
Map downloading now...
You wanted feedback, well, i've worked in the games industry as a tester for 5 years...so, full on games tester feedback incoming.
First off, the player doesn't start with an HEV suit, making the weapons and powerups useless.
Sound is interesting, but it's looped. So what starts as an interesting choice of ambient sound becomes annoying. A lot of the "scares" are cheap jumps with no reason. The zombies banging on the gate for example don't die and keep ressing back to life.
[img]http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/594733741675447151/9F92327B32C4517A45C7131B4C0099D1CC8A4015/[/img]
Whilst not a bug, it certainly isn't scary. After i killed them a few times i wandered off. Also notice that the gate doesn't look real, it looks stretched and slightly pixelated. There are some projected images in initially unexplored places, and a zombie that jumps out at you, then turns into a cowering hologram.
[img]http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/594733741675480456/0C0A9A34582127839098A4C9189C2B59A311EA69/[/img]
I don't think you have built cubemaps, the textures have a glistening effect on them that suggests that the light isn't bouncing properly.
[img]http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/594733741675402635/A3D3A5C37E5814840169E14589D603EE3ED601A2/[/img]
Whilst on lighting, there are a stupid amount of different colours of lights, and very odd placements. The stained glass window for example projects onto the outside of the building, not the inside.
[img]http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/594733741675451218/03EB1578EB8FD3F69507936929F854DE98E35751/[/img]
Inside the church, we see several different colours of lights, but there is no theme that connects everything, so it looks a mess.
[img]http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/594733741675419664/968E28F6B8D871E3AD5D45655342239AD959A88B/[/img]
In this room, after playing with a dispensor that didn't do anything i got this message. Considering i was at over 60fps, why should i need it.
[img]http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/594733741675485471/E36630B86622C3993D0D127E1B1E529BABF14B19/[/img]
Found a model in a t-pose...obviously ripped from fear or downloaded, it has no animations, so it is locked in a t-pose.
This map has it all, rivers of blood, skulls, decapitated heads, random teleports, weird sounds, cheap scares. And that is the problem. There is no unification, no single theme.
[img]http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/594733741675489203/8EEC39C81ECFA3661BB18FE9238E976F1BF27AFB/[/img]
Overuse of blood looks tacky, why did you have skulls swimming in the pond, and not skelatal fish? After a while, you expect that there will be blood around every turn, or a projected smily face. Nothing has a reason, nothing has a theme. Why are the zombies there, why is the blood dragging that way.
This was a perfect example of a surprise in a mod:
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tVGnffcPTE[/media]
It fit the theme, and was well executed. Unlike most of your map.
Jump scares does not equal horror. Many maps make this mistake, what your looking for is atmosphere, and atmosphere ( in my opinion of course) is made up of 2 things, [B]light[/B] and sound. A random stalker appearing in front of you is not scary at all, it's just fucking annoying. In fact, the best horror maps never have any sort of ghost or jump scare, you instill psychological fear through a good choice of ambient sounds and [B]lighting[/B]. A map like this is like a TF2 map but without the TF2 textures.
gtamikes, this map is not scary. Really. It's truly, truly not.
Also, tone down the multicolored lighting and the brightness of the lights. Try using MUCH dimmer lights + fog to emphasize player silhouettes instead - allows you to keep players visible while toning down the bright lighting AND it adds atmosphere.
You rely on horror clichés and your only scare tactic is jump scares. Not good.
I don't want to hijack the thread, but for the sake of demonstration I'd like to show you a playthrough of the first prototype map of my Eawan project. It's not too pretty but it works:
[video=youtube;8GIudCLBd9g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GIudCLBd9g[/video]
This prototype map has no true ending, however the player's goal is to piece together a backstory by searching the map for clues. The setting is a surreal maze in an insane asylum, where a being prowls about and can instantly kill the player.
While darkness is not truly necessary for a horror map, it does often help, as the fear of the unknown is the greatest fear mankind has. This fear, by the way, is also used by making the monster invisible. Only by carefully navigating and listening closely to its vocalizations can the player evade it.
The fear of the unknown. The map is quiet, morbidly so, and it creates a feeling of immense loneliness and dread, knowing that the only other living thing in this maze is a malevolent thing of the mind. Note how the monster rages onwards even in the player's absence - the distant sound of breaking bottles, for instance, causes great dread in a player, for he is once again reminded of the creature hunting for him.
If you intend to make a scary map, even if it's designed for deathmatch, keep such points in mind. Don't rely on jump scare tactics. They only shock for a moment. Use sound, play with the player's expectations. Build atmosphere that will leave the player trembling in fear for the entire playthrough... or DM match.
I am tempted to make an Eawan-themed Deathmatch map just to prove that a DM map can be truly, truly frightening.
[I]also, detail your damn church you silly little cracker[/I]
Yeah, this map is like a Cliche and lighting is more like day than night.
Those hl2 zombies and cheap jumpscares doesn't work.
Enviroment is the main key to make places scary.
Often abandoned places in the night (or even day) are really scary.
Jumps scares only work when: 1) player doesn't have any idea what is going to happen, 2) player is already afraid (walking in abandoned place in dark)
Some subtle ghost things are scary too.
Dear Esther is really good example of being scary.
PS. When i made night versions of mountainvillage and forestvillage, i was often too scared to leave the city to the dark nightly forest, even i knew that there's nothing to be afraid of :v:
[editline]3rd November 2012[/editline]
Also, don't be so mad about this, you're a decent mapper, you just failed with genre.
[QUOTE=Kahgarak;38292581]gtamikes, this map is not scary. Really. It's truly, truly not.
Also, tone down the multicolored lighting and the brightness of the lights. Try using MUCH dimmer lights + fog to emphasize player silhouettes instead - allows you to keep players visible while toning down the bright lighting AND it adds atmosphere.
You rely on horror clichés and your only scare tactic is jump scares. Not good.
I don't want to hijack the thread, but for the sake of demonstration I'd like to show you a playthrough of the first prototype map of my Eawan project. It's not too pretty but it works:
[video=youtube;8GIudCLBd9g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GIudCLBd9g[/video]
This prototype map has no true ending, however the player's goal is to piece together a backstory by searching the map for clues. The setting is a surreal maze in an insane asylum, where a being prowls about and can instantly kill the player.
While darkness is not truly necessary for a horror map, it does often help, as the fear of the unknown is the greatest fear mankind has. This fear, by the way, is also used by making the monster invisible. Only by carefully navigating and listening closely to its vocalizations can the player evade it.
The fear of the unknown. The map is quiet, morbidly so, and it creates a feeling of immense loneliness and dread, knowing that the only other living thing in this maze is a malevolent thing of the mind. Note how the monster rages onwards even in the player's absence - the distant sound of breaking bottles, for instance, causes great dread in a player, for he is once again reminded of the creature hunting for him.
If you intend to make a scary map, even if it's designed for deathmatch, keep such points in mind. Don't rely on jump scare tactics. They only shock for a moment. Use sound, play with the player's expectations. Build atmosphere that will leave the player trembling in fear for the entire playthrough... or DM match.
I am tempted to make an Eawan-themed Deathmatch map just to prove that a DM map can be truly, truly frightening.
[I]also, detail your damn church you silly little cracker[/I][/QUOTE]
I agree with your principles, but not with your example or how you would create atmosphere.
Frankly you completely undermine your desire to show off how scary a map can be by talking through the whole thing instead of just letting us experience it and providing a little background information.
Second, the story of the map falls exactly into the same cliches the OP's map follows. Except his was more shallow. Spooky haunted church and graveyard ooooooohhhhh scary.
But yours isn't much better. 'Some deranged person who committed some horrible crime and is now haunted by their past/guilt/whatever' Not to mention that it takes place in a particularly bland system of tunnels, deemed an 'asylum' where the player is followed by spooky noises.
To create an effective horror map, you need both the atmosphere and some substance behind the element of horror. Scary noises and breaking bottles alone don't inspire fear in me. They don't inspire anything, really except maybe curiosity.
Not to mention there were no real identifying characteristics that identified the character as who you said she was. Especially for someone who is experiencing her first feelings of of emotion (which is kind of odd considering her crime)
Anyways, I would like to continue this later, but i have to go because of shittyass NYSEG.
In my opinion, Kahgarak, your map isn't scary. I mean I'm sure some are scared by it just being pitch black with sounds and stuff, but whenever a game does that I think "its on" and charge around fearlessly. I know you're not trying to show off but the map you used as an example for the OP to improve upon has a lot to improve itself, it seems like just boringly walking around dodging a sound that can instakill you, there's no atmosphere to it. If you had added more lights, I'm sure it'd be much creepier, because being pitch black just makes it a bother.
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