Hypnosis and holy water: Russian 'cures' for gay people - Sensationalist Headlines

[QUOTE]Controversial "treatments" by psychotherapists and preachers are being offered to gay people in Russia. BBC Russian heard accounts of so-called cures, after it emerged that gay men were being persecuted in Chechnya, a mainly Muslim republic in southern Russia. [B]Hypnosis and self-help [/B] Psychotherapist Yan Goland, from the city of Nizhny Novgorod, says he has "cured" 78 gay and eight transsexual people using a method developed in the Soviet Union by his teacher, Nikolai Ivanov. He told the BBC that the "treatment" lasted between eight and 18 months, and longer for transsexuals. "When a patient comes to me, I show them similar cases: how they were and how they are now. The patient is filled with hope that we can help, and understands they need to be treated," he said. In the first stage, he aims to "extinguish" the individual's same-sex attraction. The hypnotherapy sessions can last up to eight hours. He also uses a mixture of psychoanalysis and identity therapy as a way of influencing a person's dreams. The second stage is meant to forge an attraction to the opposite sex. He prompts his male patients to sexually objectify the women around them. "I tell them: 'when you leave the session, walk down the street and take a look at all the young woman you see, take an interest in their figures and select the best.'" Step three, Mr Goland says, involves sex with members of the opposite sex. [B]Religion [/B] Various religious organisations are offering "treatments" for homosexuals. Some refused to go into details. But Pastor Yevgeny Peresvetov did speak. He heads the Protestant organisation "Vosstanovleniye" (meaning "rehabilitation" or "resurrection"). It promises to help gay people "reject" their sexuality. The organisation's YouTube channel has accounts of two men who have "liberated themselves from sin" by "ridding themselves of homosexuality". [B]Children forced into 'treatment' [/B] Some Russian families turn to religious institutions to "cure" children who have come out. Maria, 27, was taken to church against her will by her family to "treat" her homosexuality when she was only 13. She had holy water poured over her while others read out prayers. "I couldn't hear anything; I was bawling my eyes out. They kept on reading out prayers and forced me to go to church, where I was told that my attraction to other women came from Satan," she told the BBC. "They covered me in holy water and forced me to drink it. [B]Sometimes they hit me with rods.[/B] I feel like they broke my mind." [/QUOTE] [url]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-39777612[/url]

[QUOTE][B]Sometimes they hit me with rods.[/B][/QUOTE] How the fuck would anyone, even if they're insane and irrationally hate homosexuals on the basis of religion, think that beating a [B][I]13[/I][/B] year old would help them in ANY way, shape, or form?

[QUOTE=spoder55;52185163]How the fuck would anyone, even if they're insane and irrationally hate homosexuals on the basis of religion, think that beating a [B][I]13[/I][/B] year old would help them in ANY way, shape, or form?[/QUOTE] They might be Klingon

The fact people all around the world still think homosexuality is a disease is just awful.

[QUOTE=BlackMageMari;52185290]The fact people all around the world still think homosexuality is a disease is just awful.[/QUOTE] That's because homosexuality is something that has been widely stigmatized in numerous(most) cultures and belief systems for centuries, it will be years if not centuries before that stigma goes away, if it ever does.

remember if you love jesus enough, you're probably gay and need to go to a camp for that. [editline]4th May 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=BlackMageMari;52185290]The fact people all around the world still think homosexuality is a disease is just awful.[/QUOTE] its worse when you look into where this belief originated from, which partly was european missionaries installing a christian moral system

I worked with a guy whose brother was gay (the guy told me that his brother was obviously gay and that he had known for years) he said that his brother came into their living room and blurted out to his mum and dad that he was gay whilst they were watching a soap on tv, he said his Dad didn't look up from the tv but replied "don't be so stupid, get yourself off to the doctors. I was flabbergasted that someone in this day and age could think like this but we laughed a lot at this story.

[QUOTE=spoder55;52185163]How the fuck would anyone, even if they're insane and irrationally hate homosexuals on the basis of religion, think that beating a [B][I]13[/I][/B] year old would help them in ANY way, shape, or form?[/QUOTE] Actually, IIRC, getting hit by a rod is just a generic part of a prayer. IIRC, I got smashed by one pretty good when my grandmother brought me to an Eastern European Church on a prayer day. [editline]4th May 2017[/editline] To be honest, considering how much homeopathy is widespread in Russia, the fact that people jump onto the bullshit wagon if doubly scary - not just for the person affected, but the fact that there are so many people gullible enough to go for it/force others into it.

Russia sounds more and more like a tremendous irredeemable shithole.

this hits too close to home for me sadly this shit is not just contained in russia, albeit maybe not in such a quantity

[QUOTE=Sprockethead;52186534]Russia sounds more and more like a tremendous irredeemable shithole.[/QUOTE] it's not like this kind of treatment and thought process [URL=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality:_Disease_or_Way_of_Life%3F] was uncommon in the United States either.[/URL] We've just managed to move on after many a civil rights movement, although this was made much easier because of our democratic roots and having strong leaders give it the momentum it needed to keep going. I can only hope that Russia's next generation picks up the steam and condemns homophobia as much as we do now.

[QUOTE=aznz888;52186686]it's not like this kind of treatment and thought process [URL=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality:_Disease_or_Way_of_Life%3F] was uncommon in the United States either.[/URL] We've just managed to move on after many a civil rights movement, although this was made much easier because of our democratic roots and having strong leaders give it the momentum it needed to keep going. I can only hope that Russia's next generation picks up the steam and condemns homophobia as much as we do now.[/QUOTE] Russia's next generation is going to have to deal with the fallout of Putin's eventual death, which could be a time for social change, but is more likely to be one of confusion and anger.

I dread thinking about what will happen in Russia after Putin dies, I honestly see civil war being a possibility with Putin's underdogs fighting for control of the government along with his (surviving) opponents as well as regions trying to break away from Russia like Chechnya while also potentially destabilizing Russia's neighbors

This is what people talk about when they refer to "toxic masculinity." Such an incredible dedication to arbitrary gender roles that anything outside of a very limited "norm" of behavior is punished, both socially and institutionally. If you aren't a vodka-chugging wife-beating tracksuit-wearing squatting manly man with a beautiful woman under your arm, you're a worthless man. You like men? You're a worthless man. Anything outside of a very specific role is bad, and that point of view is absolutely toxic and punishes people for literally being themselves. The U.S. suffered from this to an extreme degree throughout the early 20th century. Men living unfulfilling lives because they didn't fulfill some arbitrary social role of having a nice house with a pretty wife and a white picket fence and a good kid and a shiny car with a manicured lawn. So they devolve into alcoholism and beat their wives, or hide/deny their sexuality and turn bitter and angry, and it turns into unnecessary violence because everyone holds each other accountable for a specific role that not everyone will fit into. Just let people suck some dicks if they want to, society won't fucking collapse if a few people want to live their lives a different way. It's disgusting.

[QUOTE=.Isak.;52189229]This is what people talk about when they refer to "toxic masculinity." Such an incredible dedication to arbitrary gender roles that anything outside of a very limited "norm" of behavior is punished, both socially and institutionally. If you aren't a vodka-chugging wife-beating tracksuit-wearing squatting manly man with a beautiful woman under your arm, you're a worthless man. You like men? You're a worthless man. Anything outside of a very specific role is bad, and that point of view is absolutely toxic and punishes people for literally being themselves. The U.S. suffered from this to an extreme degree throughout the early 20th century. Men living unfulfilling lives because they didn't fulfill some arbitrary social role of having a nice house with a pretty wife and a white picket fence and a good kid and a shiny car with a manicured lawn. So they devolve into alcoholism and beat their wives, or hide/deny their sexuality and turn bitter and angry, and it turns into unnecessary violence because everyone holds each other accountable for a specific role that not everyone will fit into. Just let people suck some dicks if they want to, society won't fucking collapse if a few people want to live their lives a different way. It's disgusting.[/QUOTE] I'm sure there are just as many women buying into this, who are active proponents of the subservience of the woman for the good of the 'traditional values' or whatever the fuck. Though i do think you'd be right to think that this is a sort of knee-jerk reaction against something that allegedly threatens masculinity. I think many of these men must be either hating themselves for a couple homosexual fantasies that they have, or are so afraid of turning out gay that they basically want the state to threaten everyone with death should they choose to not repress themselves in case they are gay.

[QUOTE=spoder55;52185163]How the fuck would anyone, even if they're insane and irrationally hate homosexuals on the basis of religion, think that beating a [B][I]13[/I][/B] year old would help them in ANY way, shape, or form?[/QUOTE] You'd be surprised how many parents still beat their kids.

[QUOTE=Rudevinny;52189126]Autocracies aren't exactly known for their long-term stability, so Russia might go down the shitter. Not sure how deep will they fall, though. Some might see a Russian civil war as an opportunity to pacify the nation for good but it becomes scarier the moment you remember they have nuclear weapons.[/QUOTE] It depends entirely on whether or not Putin can be replaced quickly enough. In the unlikely scenario that someone does effectively take over then they'll probably be able to at the very least delay Russia's downfall. But once Russia does fall, I don't think they'll be getting back up for a very long time.

[QUOTE=Aredbomb;52191847]It depends entirely on whether or not Putin can be replaced quickly enough. In the unlikely scenario that someone does effectively take over then they'll probably be able to at the very least delay Russia's downfall. But once Russia does fall, I don't think they'll be getting back up for a very long time.[/QUOTE] I can see large parts of Russia potentially being occupied by foreign nations if/when it falls apart or as I said in my previous post breaking away and becoming independent nations like what happened to Yugoslavia when communism fell. Also makes me wonder what will happen to the nations that have important military and economic ties with Russia like Belarus and Mongolia. I can see the regime in Belarus falling apart quickly without Russia being there to prop it up and prevent the West from intervening in it's affairs while Mongolia would likely just turn to China and who knows what will happen to the other members of the CIS/CSTO although I can see a some of them turning to China.

[QUOTE=Bbarnes005;52188219]I dread thinking about what will happen in Russia after Putin dies, I honestly see civil war being a possibility with Putin's underdogs fighting for control of the government along with his (surviving) opponents as well as regions trying to break away from Russia like Chechnya while also potentially destabilizing Russia's neighbors[/QUOTE] More like a number of them will disappear or get arrested while only one remains in office.