Tesla remotely extends range of vehicles for free in Florida to help owners escape Hurricane Irma - Sensationalist Headlines

[QUOTE]Millions of people are currently affected by the evacuation of Florida as Hurricane Irma starts reaching the state and creates some difficult traffic situation when escaping north. There are reports of traffic jams and gas stations running out gas. There are a lot Tesla owners in Florida and they are also escaping north using the Supercharger network. Now Tesla has even facilitated travels for some of them as the automaker remotely unlocked the full battery pack capacity of Model S/X 60/60D vehicles with 75 kWh battery packs. That’s due to Tesla using an unforeseen feature of their over-the-air software update system. Tesla used to offer the option to buy a Model S or Model X with a 75 kWh battery pack software-locked at a capacity of 60 kWh. The option would result in a less expensive vehicle with a shorter range, but the option to pay to remotely enable the longer range at a later stage. Some of those owners reported this morning having more range than usual in their vehicles. A Tesla Model S 60 owner in Florida reached out to us with almost 40 more miles than in his usual full charge and a new ’75’ badge in his car software. While he didn’t ask for it nor knew why it changed, Tesla had temporarily unlocked the remaining 15 kWh of the car’s software-limited battery pack option to facilitate the owner’s evacuation. We reached to Tesla and a representative confirmed that the company has put in place the emergency measure to temporarily extend the range of the vehicles of Tesla owners in the path of Hurricane Irma.[/QUOTE] [url]https://electrek.co/2017/09/09/tesla-extends-range-vehicles-for-free-in-florida-escape-hurricane-irma/[/url] sure this is a good thing right now, but artificially limiting the range? tbh that's a bit scummy

[QUOTE=343N;52666054][url]https://electrek.co/2017/09/09/tesla-extends-range-vehicles-for-free-in-florida-escape-hurricane-irma/[/url] sure this is a good thing right now, but artificially limiting the range? tbh that's a bit scummy[/QUOTE] i mean running your tesla dry would probably not do wonders for the vehicle over time, i dont know a lot about its kinda like how phones 'die' before theyre really dead, right?

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;52666067]i mean running your tesla dry would probably not do wonders for the vehicle over time, i dont know a lot about its kinda like how phones 'die' before theyre really dead, right?[/QUOTE] but this is about the 60kwH cars having 75kwH batteries and normally you can 'upgrade' to 75kwH for a few thousand dollars and all they do is remove the artificial limit, but here they've done it now in case of emergency.

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;52666067]i mean running your tesla dry would probably not do wonders for the vehicle over time, i dont know a lot about its kinda like how phones 'die' before theyre really dead, right?[/QUOTE] Typically not allowing LMO cells to fully charge/discharge regularly can shorten their lifespan. Electric car batteries arent LMO cells afaik

[QUOTE=343N;52666071]but this is about the 60kwH cars having 75kwH batteries and normally you can 'upgrade' to 75kwH for a few thousand dollars and all they do is remove the artificial limit, but here they've done it now in case of emergency.[/QUOTE] I would not be surprised if that extra capacity is unlocked as the battery degrades from it's charge cycles. The capacity is there and they might as well code it in seeing as it is already monitoring it.

[QUOTE=343N;52666071]but this is about the 60kwH cars having 75kwH batteries and normally you can 'upgrade' to 75kwH for a few thousand dollars and all they do is remove the artificial limit, but here they've done it now in case of emergency.[/QUOTE] It allows for market segmentation that allows people who couldn't afford a Tesla, get a Tesla. If they didn't do this, their lowest end model would just be a 75KWh model that some people wouldn't be able to purchase. [QUOTE=shad0w440;52666072]Typically not allowing lithium cells to fully charge/discharge regularly can shorten their lifespan. Electric car batteries arent lithium cells afaik[/QUOTE] Define "lithium cell". Tesla has been using extremely typical 18650 cells from Panasonic (NCA cells, lithium nickel cobalt aluminum oxide), though they're moving towards their own cells with their own size and chemistry. The Nissan Leaf has (at least previously) been using a more safer chemistry (lithium-manganese-oxide cathode with nickel oxide, it gets complicated), that you can literally take a propane burner to, without shitting your pants. [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jz37WycW-7E[/media] The Tesla battery packs are still fine though, they overengineered the safety features until there was nothing left to do.

Fucking ridiculous that they are software gimping these things in the first place. It's nice that he's uncorking them here, but let's be real: It shouldn't even be necessary, and these things should have access to every last milliwatt-hour the batteries can supply from the word go.

[QUOTE=TestECull;52666121]Fucking ridiculous that they are software gimping these things in the first place. It's nice that he's uncorking them here, but let's be real: It shouldn't even be necessary, and these things should have access to every last milliwatt-hour the batteries can supply from the word go.[/QUOTE] It is cheaper to make the cars all the same and then sell two different models with a software limitation to get more customers.

[QUOTE=jordguitar;52666129]It is cheaper to make the cars all the same and then sell two different models with a software limitation to get more customers.[/QUOTE] Literally means the higher models have higher prices / margins then they should

[QUOTE=thrawn2787;52666149]Literally means the higher models have higher prices / margins then they should[/QUOTE] Welcome to capitalism. As it is now no one has the authority to control the prices companies charge, especially if the price hike does, in the real world, still give you an actual advantage.

[QUOTE=thrawn2787;52666149]Literally means the higher models have higher prices / margins then they should[/QUOTE] Keep in mind that Tesla aren't making a profit yet. I don't really see the issue with them increasing their margins since it's not like they are just sitting on mountains of money.

I think we should still pat tesla on the back for this, despite the original shitty practice, they did it despite the inevitable bad press it would bring, bringing light to this fact most people didn't even know about

[QUOTE=TestECull;52666121]Fucking ridiculous that they are software gimping these things in the first place. It's nice that he's uncorking them here, but let's be real: It shouldn't even be necessary, and these things should have access to every last milliwatt-hour the batteries can supply from the word go.[/QUOTE] Why is software limits so stupid? What about Cable TV? What about steam? Just because you could have access to something for “free” doesnt mean that it should be. Tesla is a company and one of the goals of a company is to earn money. It would be more expensive for Tesla to produce even more battery models at the same time, which would cause price to rise. If the cars lifetime was 1 year, then yes, you could argue that the cells were wasted. But when we’re talking 10 years, then there’s a very large chance that the car would be upgraded later in its lifetime.

1. at the time the 60kwh pack was introduced, very few people actually bought them 2. the cost of making 60kwh packs was not worth the limited amount of people buying them 3. however the 75kwh packs were selling just fine now either you raise the price of entry to model 3, or you offer 60kwh cars with 75kwh pack.

[QUOTE=343N;52666054][url]https://electrek.co/2017/09/09/tesla-extends-range-vehicles-for-free-in-florida-escape-hurricane-irma/[/url] sure this is a good thing right now, but artificially limiting the range? tbh that's a bit scummy[/QUOTE] Draining a rechargeable battery completely is extremely bad for the battery. That's why there's usually a limiter that makes sure there's like 10% battery power left even though the indicator says it's empty. Sounds like me like Tesla just disabled the limiter for a while. My brother was designing electrics for a new electric car for a while, and they considered adding an emergency switch that allowed the driver to disable the limiter themselves, but they then realized every driver would do that at the drop of a hat because they had no idea how actually disastrous it would be for the battery's lifespan. They then considered making it a 'three strikes' system that would require the owner to bring their car to a garage after they used the switch three times, but they then realized this would only piss people off. Eventually they decided to just not tell anyone about the limiter at all.

[QUOTE=TestECull;52666121]Fucking ridiculous that they are software gimping these things in the first place. It's nice that he's uncorking them here, but let's be real: It shouldn't even be necessary, and these things should have access to every last milliwatt-hour the batteries can supply from the word go.[/QUOTE] It's a weird but necessary thing that is beneficial to the end user as well. Basically, instead of running two production lines for two different batteries at different prices, you run 1 production line and then you artificially limit it in some cars and sell it for cheaper. The end result is that you spend less money making the batteries, and you're actually able to sell them for cheaper than you otherwise would. [editline]10th September 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=V12US;52666433]Draining a rechargeable battery completely is extremely bad for the battery. That's why there's usually a limiter that makes sure there's like 10% battery power left even though the indicator says it's empty. Sounds like me like Tesla just disabled the limiter for a while.[/QUOTE] This is not what they're doing.

[QUOTE=LordCrypto;52666410]1. at the time the 60kwh pack was introduced, very few people actually bought them 2. the cost of making 60kwh packs was not worth the limited amount of people buying them 3. however the 75kwh packs were selling just fine now either you raise the price of entry to model 3, or you offer 60kwh cars with 75kwh pack.[/QUOTE] This is literally day one DLC that is directly on the disc. You are holding it in your hand, the system is loading it, but the developer was scummy as fuck and disabled access to it to get more money from you.

If the car was a cheap econobox I could understand having the artificial limitations, but the model S is fucking $100k

[QUOTE=FordLord;52666860]This is literally day one DLC that is directly on the disc. You are holding it in your hand, the system is loading it, but the developer was scummy as fuck and disabled access to it to get more money from you.[/QUOTE] Not really an accurate comparison since it's a physical product. They could of put in physical 60 kWh packs as they used to do, but that requires a separate production line. It would result in slower charging, higher cost, shorter lifespan, and worse acceleration for those that bought the 60 kWh version. Autopilot's convenience features also aren't enabled unless you pay money for it, but the hardware is included. They could have yet another production line for that and not include the hardware, and thus not giving anyone the safety features either.

[QUOTE=FordLord;52666860]This is literally day one DLC that is directly on the disc. You are holding it in your hand, the system is loading it, but the developer was scummy as fuck and disabled access to it to get more money from you.[/QUOTE] It's literally the opposite. You could originally buy a 60kWh, with a 60kWh battery. Then you can buy a 60kWh, with a 75kWh battery limited to 60kWh, [i]for the same price as the original[/i]. You're getting a BETTER car, as you now have the option to upgrade and you get faster charging and longer battery life, for the same price as the original.

I don't know about you but I really don't like the idea of paying for a car to not be allowed to use all of the features inside the car I paid for. I understand saving cost from production but it's such a scummy tactic at least I know what I'm buying from other companies.

[QUOTE=ultradude25;52666935]It's literally the opposite. You could originally buy a 60kWh, with a 60kWh battery. Then you can buy a 60kWh, with a 75kWh battery limited to 60kWh, [i]for the same price as the original[/i]. You're getting a BETTER car, as you now have the option to upgrade and you get faster charging and longer battery life, for the same price as the original.[/QUOTE] but why not just give the 75kwH if there is no difference in cost for Tesla? (I can't think of any anyway) and yeah, they're a business, they gotta make $$$, but man, artificial limitations just feel dodgy. and can you say you're getting a better car if your car is the exact same until you upgrade to unlock the artificial limitation? sure, the fact that you CAN upgrade makes it better, but at that point it's like, why artificially limit it if it doesn't cost anything to unlock it? (other than because they're a business and want money)

[QUOTE=redBadger;52667127]I don't know about you but I really don't like the idea of paying for a car to not be allowed to use all of the features inside the car I paid for. I understand saving cost from production but it's such a scummy tactic at least I know what I'm buying from other companies.[/QUOTE] If you've ever owned an Intel i5 CPU then I have bad news. Plenty of companies do this.

[QUOTE=343N;52667159]but why not just give the 75kwH if there is no difference in cost for Tesla? (I can't think of any anyway) and yeah, they're a business, they gotta make $$$, but man, artificial limitations just feel dodgy. and can you say you're getting a better car if your car is the exact same until you upgrade to unlock the artificial limitation? sure, the fact that you CAN upgrade makes it better, but at that point it's like, why artificially limit it if it doesn't cost anything to unlock it? (other than because they're a business and want money)[/QUOTE] The car industry is extremely capital intensive. Tesla can't really afford to lower their margins that much. If they was making mad amounts of money then I would agree that they should do that. A software limited 60 kWh is still better in every way than an actual 60 kWh battery though, even if you don't pay for the upgrade.

[QUOTE=ultradude25;52666935]It's literally the opposite. You could originally buy a 60kWh, with a 60kWh battery. Then you can buy a 60kWh, with a 75kWh battery limited to 60kWh, [i]for the same price as the original[/i]. You're getting a BETTER car, as you now have the option to upgrade and you get faster charging and longer battery life, for the same price as the original.[/QUOTE] I understand why Telsa does it but you can't blame people for not being on board with it. Your getting a car that could be better with just a simple download in its operating system is not the same as getting a worse car that couldnt be upgraded at all. It echos day 1 DLC thats already in the game but you have to pay to "unlock" it. Thats just how alot of people are seeing it. Would be even worse sinces its THOUSANDS of dollars for a software update. Not saying Telsa is in the wrong, just saying how most people would look at it and feel like they are pretty ripped off. I personally want a custom telsa when they finally become affordable but I'd a bit annoyed annoying I wont have the full car battery if I don't pay 3 grand for a software update. It isnt really an battery issue, its must different then smartphone batteries alot of people in this thread is confusing it with, if that was a case then why not make the freature optional AND free? It is clearly a business tactic. Which I dont blame Telsa when you have actual state governments banning your car for no reason(totally not corruption or lobbying related /s). They have to make as much profit as they can.

[QUOTE=redBadger;52667127]... not be allowed to use all of the features inside the car I paid for.[/QUOTE] Here's an idea regarding that: how do you know that doesn't already happen? How can you actually prove conventional ICE's aren't purposely gimped? How can you accurately tell if a vehicles mileage hasn't been neutered? That's a trick question because you can't, if such a thing existed it would be in the very design of a vehicle, nigh impossible to tell after it leaves the factory. [QUOTE=Morgen;52667172]A software limited 60 kWh is still better in every way than an actual 60 kWh battery though, even if you don't pay for the upgrade.[/QUOTE] Regardless of how much better it may be, people get [B]incredibly[/B] salty if you give them something they can't use; exponentially so if any amount of money is involved. Whatever reasons for such a thing happening is behind closed doors and we can only guess, but all the end user hears is "You already have it but you're not allowed to use it", and if that's how they see it no amount of explaining will change that.

[QUOTE=Scot;52667164]If you've ever owned an Intel i5 CPU then I have bad news. Plenty of companies do this.[/QUOTE] CPUs are so delecate and expensive to make that they don't really know what they have untill they test it to see how well it works and give it a designation accordingly. It's not an artifucal cap placed on the CPUs to gimp them, it's a result of an imperfect manufacturing process yeilding imperfect chips. Lots can go wrong when your working on the subatomic level that can't be easily fixed once it's been botched.

[QUOTE=shad0w440;52667272]CPUs are so delecate and expensive to make that they don't really know what they have untill they test it to see how well it works and give it a designation accordingly. It's not an artifucal cap placed on the CPUs to gimp them, it's a result of an imperfect manufacturing process yeilding imperfect chips. Lots can go wrong when your working on the subatomic level that can't be easily fixed once it's been botched.[/QUOTE] I'm talking about hyper-threading.

If I spent £300 on a new graphics card, and received a card that only operated at 80% efficiency, which could then be "unlocked" to 100% efficiency via a £100 software update, I'd be pretty pissed. I'm guessing this 60kWh limit can be lifted by someone with suitable tech knowledge who can hack their car's software?

[QUOTE=thomasfn;52667296]If I spent £300 on a new graphics card, and received a card that only operated at 80% efficiency, which could then be "unlocked" to 100% efficiency via a £100 software update, I'd be pretty pissed.[/QUOTE] This actually happens. [URL]https://www.techpowerup.com/223913/amd-retail-radeon-rx-480-4gb-to-8gb-memory-unlock-mod-works-we-benchmarked[/URL]