Very Large Ore Carrier ‘Stellar Daisy’ Sinks in South Atlantic - Sensationalist Headlines

[img]http://i.imgur.com/eaFToAX.jpg[/img] [quote][B]EARLIER:[/B] SEOUL, April 2 (Reuters) – A South Korean cargo vessel is missing after making its last contact in the South Atlantic about 2,500 kilometers (1,500 miles) from shore and 22 crew members are unaccounted for, South Korea’s foreign ministry and news reports said on Sunday. Two Filipino crew members have been rescued floating in a life raft on Saturday, but other lifeboats and rafts found in the area were empty, South Korea’s Yonhap news agency reported.[/quote] [quote][B]Update (April 2):[/B] A KC-130 aircraft with the Brazilian Air Force has joined the search for survivors from the MV Stellar Daisy, which is believed to have sunk in the Atlantic Ocean about 2,500 kilometers off Uruguay. Twenty-two crew members remain missing.[/quote] [url]http://gcaptain.com/very-large-ore-carrier-stellar-daisy-believed-sunk-in-south-atlantic/[/url] [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stellar_Daisy]Stellar Daisy[/url] is a 321.95 m (1,056 ft 3 in), 266,141 DWT, Very Large Ore Carrier. Goes to show that despite all our technology, big ships can disappear without a trace. Seafaring is still extremely dangerous. 2000 seafarers lose their lives each year.

What could have sunk such a massive ship like that? The only thing the article talks about is debris and oil in some of the water, but that could have easily been leaked after it sunk and "debris" can be anything from pieces of the ship to the crew's personal belongings floating about.

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;52049283]What could have sunk such a massive ship like that? The only thing the article talks about is debris and oil in some of the water, but that could have easily been leaked after it sunk and "debris" can be anything from pieces of the ship to the crew's personal belongings floating about.[/QUOTE] A number of things, but at this point any would be pure speculation. With ships like this, most of it is empty space because the cargo is so heavy. It requires a ton of ballasting and getting water inside is extremely dangerous. [editline]2nd April 2017[/editline] Apparently they had sent a distress signal saying they were taking on water and were listing to the port side. [url]http://splash247.com/vloc-sinks-south-atlantic/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter[/url] [url]http://fairplay.ihs.com/safety-regulation/article/4284311/polaris-vloc-sinks-in-atlantic[/url] Once a dry bulk ship starts taking on water, they can sink like a cup in a bathtub.

Wonder if it was overloaded

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;52049283]What could have sunk such a massive ship like that? The only thing the article talks about is debris and oil in some of the water, but that could have easily been leaked after it sunk and "debris" can be anything from pieces of the ship to the crew's personal belongings floating about.[/QUOTE] [hd]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tN4xROtMjI[/hd] Might as well be this.

man i see the "small" versions of these on the great lakes all the time, I can't believe anyone would take them on the ocean with them being so long and heavy

[QUOTE=Sableye;52049435]man i see the "small" versions of these on the great lakes all the time, I can't believe anyone would take them on the ocean with them being so long and heavy[/QUOTE] [url]http://adventure.howstuffworks.com/cruise-ship2.htm[/url] Same way giant ass aircraft carriers have no problem floating.

[QUOTE=The Rifleman;52049455][url]http://adventure.howstuffworks.com/cruise-ship2.htm[/url] Same way giant ass aircraft carriers have no problem floating.[/QUOTE] its more that these guys are so long and low in the water, on the great lakes thats not too much of a problem but on the open ocean that seems like a bad idea

[QUOTE=The Rifleman;52049455][url]http://adventure.howstuffworks.com/cruise-ship2.htm[/url] Same way giant ass aircraft carriers have no problem floating.[/QUOTE] It's why I'm curious as to if it was overloaded, that to me would be the likeliest cause. Some waves wash over the deck and it starts taking on water. It's why cargo ships tend to have markings on the side which denote how much it should be loaded for different parts of the year in different regions.

[QUOTE=Orkel;52049421][hd]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tN4xROtMjI[/hd] Might as well be this.[/QUOTE] Here's one that sinks at the dock: [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIyHJTqAkCM[/media] Once water gets in, it can go down really fast. [editline]2nd April 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Sableye;52049435]man i see the "small" versions of these on the great lakes all the time, I can't believe anyone would take them on the ocean with them being so long and heavy[/QUOTE] There would be no modern civilization if they didn't. Container ships get all the glory, but bulk ships make up most of the global shipping fleet. If it's metal and came from china, it was once raw ore on a ship like this. If it's a south american fruit, it was probably on a ship like this. (albeit a [I]lot[/I] smaller). [url]https://www.statista.com/statistics/264024/number-of-merchant-ships-worldwide-by-type/[/url] Even then, container ships can suffer the same fate. Getting water inside is almost universally a very bad thing, because it upsets the delicately planned weight distribution and can make a bad situation a dire situation very quickly.

[QUOTE=Sableye;52049435]man i see the "small" versions of these on the great lakes all the time, I can't believe anyone would take them on the ocean with them being so long and heavy[/QUOTE] It's crazy night trolling in Erie right out of Cleveland and having those big boys roll out. Just massive sitting not too far away in your little boat.

Shit man [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vST6hVRj2A[/media] I hope atleast some of the crew made it out.

[QUOTE=OvB;52049314]A number of things, but at this point any would be pure speculation. With ships like this, most of it is empty space because the cargo is so heavy. It requires a ton of ballasting and getting water inside is extremely dangerous. [editline]2nd April 2017[/editline] Apparently they had sent a distress signal saying they were taking on water and were listing to the port side. [URL]http://splash247.com/vloc-sinks-south-atlantic/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter[/URL] [URL]http://fairplay.ihs.com/safety-regulation/article/4284311/polaris-vloc-sinks-in-atlantic[/URL] Once a dry bulk ship starts taking on water, they can sink like a cup in a bathtub.[/QUOTE] Dad spent time on boats like this when in the Merchant Navy - he said that if cargo isn't properly secured, in storm or rough seas if they list and the cargo slides, they're fucked. He told me the story of this one ship off Indonesian waters where the list happened so quickly they didn't even have time to radio, it just keeled over and that was it. Even something like a sharp turn and it's curtains. Same story for air cargo,too - look at this, for instance: [video=youtube;lksDISvCmNI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lksDISvCmNI[/video]

[video=youtube;9vST6hVRj2A]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vST6hVRj2A[/video]

They should fill these things with golf balls. Now we're talking unsinkable.

[QUOTE=snookypookums;52051742]Dad spent time on boats like this when in the Merchant Navy - he said that if cargo isn't properly secured, in storm or rough seas if they list and the cargo slides, they're fucked. He told me the story of this one ship off Indonesian waters where the list happened so quickly they didn't even have time to radio, it just keeled over and that was it. Even something like a sharp turn and it's curtains. Same story for air cargo,too - look at this, for instance: [video=youtube;lksDISvCmNI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lksDISvCmNI[/video][/QUOTE] Yeah, cargo handling is very important. In bulk carriers like this they have to watch the angle of repose on the material and make sure it's not going to shift if the ship leans too far in either direction. A shifting cargo will mess everything up. Roro's are notorious for how fast they can sink if the load of cars or whatever else comes lose, or if water gets inside and sloshes around the decks. They basically do the same thing that plane did, except sinking instead of falling. In the book Ninety Percent of Everything, they talk of a story about a livestock transport that was hosing the animal waste off it's deck by ballasting one side further than the other so the ship sits at an angle and all the stuff can wash off. But it hit a wave and became too steep for the animals to stand and they started falling and rolling to the deeper side, and the whole ship capsized in seconds.

[QUOTE=OvB;52053946]Yeah, cargo handling is very important. In bulk carriers like this they have to watch the angle of repose on the material and make sure it's not going to shift if the ship leans too far in either direction. A shifting cargo will mess everything up. Roro's are notorious for how fast they can sink if the load of cars or whatever else comes lose, or if water gets inside and sloshes around the decks. They basically do the same thing that plane did, except sinking instead of falling. In the book Ninety Percent of Everything, they talk of a story about a livestock transport that was hosing the animal waste off it's deck by ballasting one side further than the other so the ship sits at an angle and all the stuff can wash off. But it hit a wave and became too steep for the animals to stand and they started falling and rolling to the deeper side, and the whole ship capsized in seconds.[/QUOTE] Yep, and a sad fact my dad used to tell me was that capsized ships and tankers were more common than you think despite not being reported in the news nearly as much. Unfortunately, due to the fact that the crews of these ships being majority from third world countries, they never receive as much coverage. He's seen some crazy shit during his decade or so at sea - for instance, they once came across a boat near Borneo where every single crew member was beheaded, but the cargo was intact and the ship was adrift. They GTFO off the boat and radio-ed it in while pretty much fleeing, but when the authorities came to the last location they never found the boat. In fact, they claimed they couldn't even see it on their radar, which led most of the crew to believe that it was some sort of extra-judicial killing situation of some sort.

[QUOTE=OvB;52053946]Yeah, cargo handling is very important. In bulk carriers like this they have to watch the angle of repose on the material and make sure it's not going to shift if the ship leans too far in either direction. A shifting cargo will mess everything up. Roro's are notorious for how fast they can sink if the load of cars or whatever else comes lose, or if water gets inside and sloshes around the decks. They basically do the same thing that plane did, except sinking instead of falling. In the book Ninety Percent of Everything, they talk of a story about a livestock transport that was hosing the animal waste off it's deck by ballasting one side further than the other so the ship sits at an angle and all the stuff can wash off. But it hit a wave and became too steep for the animals to stand and they started falling and rolling to the deeper side, and the whole ship capsized in seconds.[/QUOTE] Slightly different, but still an interesting read is the HMS Royal George which in 1782 was lost in a harbor with around 1200 people during a cargo loading. [url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Royal_George_(1756)#Loss[/url]

[QUOTE=UserDirk580;52056316]Slightly different, but still an interesting read is the HMS Royal George which in 1782 was lost in a harbor with around 1200 people during a cargo loading. [url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Royal_George_(1756)#Loss[/url][/QUOTE] This is interesting, because it also a key event in the history of Lloyd's which operates in shipping as Hapag-Lloyds.

Possible Rogue Wave?

Always when I read stuff like this I somehow come back to the MS Estonia radio. Estonia sank roughly 30 miles from shore. Imagine being out somewhere 1,500 miles from shore. [Media]https://youtu.be/_7cZTEQJ2VQ[/media]

[QUOTE=snookypookums;52056400]This is interesting, because it also a key event in the history of Lloyd's which operates in shipping as Hapag-Lloyds.[/QUOTE] Lloyd's does everything and have been around since the dawn of time it seems. They basically wrote the book in insurance and contract law back when it was trusting a man you might never see again to take your shit halfway across the world on your behalf. It all started with coffee. I still seem ton find new things that Lloyd's are involved with. [url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lloyd%27s_Coffee_House[/url]

[QUOTE=OvB;52056643]Lloyd's does everything and have been around since the dawn of time it seems. They basically wrote the book in insurance and contract law back when it was trusting a man you might never see again to take your shit halfway across the world on your behalf.[/QUOTE] It's funny you should mention it - Lloyd's actually started as a [I]cafe[/I] and a place where folks could discuss insurance deals. They went from a cafe to being the powerhouse they are today. My dad specifically went to the blue marker during one of his trips to London to take a picture of himself with the sign where their cafe used to be (I believe it's a Sainsbury's now or something). In modern terms, it would be like a bunch of people hanging about in Starbucks discussing business deals and- OH. MY. GOD. :mindblown:

Never really thinking about it, I checked to see in what capacity Lloyd's was involved in Hapag-Lloyd. It seems like shipping companies back then just used Lloyd as a way to denote their business. [Quote]The new shipping company had no association with the British maritime classification society Lloyd's Register; in the mid-19th century, "Lloyd" was used as a term for a shipping company[6] (an earlier user of the term in the same context was the Trieste-based Österreichischer Lloyd).[/quote] [url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norddeutscher_Lloyd[/url] Like I said, you can learn something new about it all the time. If this Lloyd guy wanted to leave a legacy, he did a damn good job getting his name plastered on anything that floats.

[QUOTE=OvB;52056672]Never really thinking about it, I checked to see in what capacity Lloyd's was involved in Hapag-Lloyd. It seems like shipping companies back then just used Lloyd as a way to denote their business. [url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norddeutscher_Lloyd[/url] Like I said, you can learn something new about it all the time. If this Lloyd guy wanted to leave a legacy, he did a damn good job getting his name plastered on anything that floats.[/QUOTE] Yep, not to mention Lloyd's Intelligence Bureau notes used to litter my house when I was a child because it was like an industry trade-paper of sorts. Dad moved from his first even job from Cox and Kings to a firm in the Middle East because he happened to see a job advertisement in Lloyds' newspaper while sailing to Egypt from Mumbai. Still, while not plastering their names everywhere as part of their legacy, I'm somewhat bummed by the fact that (and this is my personal opinion) the origin stories of the companies of today will not nearly be as awesome as the ones over a century ago, where it really was like a wild west kinda situation. Take Proctor and Gamble, for instance: [QUOTE]Candlemaker William Procter born in the United Kingdom and soapmaker James Gamble born in Ireland, emigrated from England and Ireland, respectively. They settled in Cincinnati initially and met when they married sisters, Olivia and Elizabeth Norris. Alexander Norris, their father-in-law, called a meeting in which he persuaded his new sons-in-law to become business partners. On October 31, 1837, as a result of the suggestion, Procter & Gamble was created. In 1858–1859, sales reached $1 million. By that point, about 80 employees worked for Procter & Gamble. During the American Civil War, the company won contracts to supply the Union Army with soap and candles. In addition to the increased profits experienced during the war, the military contracts introduced soldiers from all over the country to Procter & Gamble's products.[/QUOTE]

I got scared as fuck when the ship I was on was leaving the dock sideways due to slightly offset ballast and cargo placement calculations, imagine a ship THAT big in the middle of nowhere... Glad I got out of that bulshit. Fuck dying in a giant metal coffin.

Imagine that you're Captain of the largest warship of your age. Freshly built, you're on your way out of Stockholm harbor in full view of the king, so you can go pick up your cargo and full compliment. and then you tip her over and have her sink on her maiden voyage. you really do have to be super careful to not sink ships