UK: Tax penalties for diesel cars to be unveiled in Autumn Budget statement - Sensationalist Headlines

[QUOTE]Chancellor plans tax hike on diesels as air quality plans develop and the market continues to move toward petrols and AFVs Diesel cars will be taxed more heavily in a move planned to improve air quality, it will be unveiled in the Autumn budget statement on 22 November. The Financial Times reported that chancellor Philip Hammond will penalise diesel owners in a bid to boost environment secretary Michael Gove’s clean air initiatives, which were announced in July. Hammond will either raise VAT on diesel fuel or create a new taxation on diesel vehicles. [/QUOTE] [url]https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/tax-penalties-diesel-cars-be-unveiled-autumn-budget-statement[/url] Not sure this was political enough for poldicks?

Hahahahahaha, and Big Diesel is [B]still[/B] gonna bitch about how their dying industry needs to be propped up by the government. You wanna roll with capitalism? Then [b]everyone[/b] has to sink or swim, fuckheads. Not "Oh, some sink and some get water wings". Hahahahahhahahahahaha.

Unless you're buying a petrol car for performance, not buying a diesel car is dumb. You're getting double the MPG for practically the same price.

[QUOTE=Dorkslayz;52879064]Unless you're buying a petrol car for performance, not buying a diesel car is dumb. You're getting double the MPG for practically the same price.[/QUOTE] Some of us give a fuck about being environmentally conscious. Personally I don't drive, by choice.

[QUOTE=Dorkslayz;52879064]Unless you're buying a petrol car for performance, not buying a diesel car is dumb. You're getting double the MPG for practically the same price.[/QUOTE] Maybe a few years ago but the efficiency gap between petrol and diesel has been closing in. Take hybrids into consideration and diesel is pointless now. You'd also have to cover a fair few motorway miles to benefit from diesel in the first place. Diesel's time is p much over.

[QUOTE=Dorkslayz;52879064]Unless you're buying a petrol car for performance, not buying a diesel car is dumb. You're getting double the MPG for practically the same price.[/QUOTE] Actually, diesel is only worth it if you're driving a large amount of miles at a time for a commute. Diesel cars cost slightly more than petrol, and usually have higher maintenance costs (again only slightly) but it basically only makes it worth it if you're driving enough to warrant the higher mpg. However, this being said. Like Chris Morris said, the environmental impact of diesels is enough for me to want to get rid of mine asap

Personally, I have to commute 25 miles down the motorway and having a diesel is a better choice for me. I don't have a giant gas guzzler, just a 1.6l Volvo. I feel like the tax should be on the fuel rather than the cars due to some diesels not being giant gas guzzlers.

[QUOTE=Dorkslayz;52879064]Unless you're buying a petrol car for performance, not buying a diesel car is dumb. You're getting double the MPG for practically the same price.[/QUOTE] I get the same mpg with my 1.0 GTDi (petrol) as I did with my 1.6 TDCI (diesel). Except the petrol is way faster, more fun to drive and pumps less NOx into the atmosphere. Oh and I don't have to pay road tax. Win win win.

I agree that Diesels have to go, but crushing consumers with more taxes is a typical lazy Tory solution. Nobody is going to be able to replace their Diesel car with a more efficient petrol or EV if they're too busy scraping together funds to pay for their existing motor. This is also terribly true of companies with fleets. Shit like this, taking punitive measures rather than encouraging and rewarding positive moves like with EV and microgeneration subsidies is just another contributor to our highly negative and descending economy. Fuck the Tories all over again, their collapse can't come soon enough.

[QUOTE=Jon27;52879189]I agree that Diesels have to go, but crushing consumers with more taxes is a typical lazy Tory solution. Nobody is going to be able to replace their Diesel car with a more efficient petrol or EV if they're too busy scraping together funds to pay for their existing motor. This is also terribly true of companies with fleets. Shit like this, taking punitive measures rather than encouraging and rewarding positive moves like with EV and microgeneration subsidies is just another contributor to our highly negative and descending economy. Fuck the Tories all over again, their collapse can't come soon enough.[/QUOTE] We do already have grants for EVs, and the bill going through parliament at the moment requires petrol stations to have EV chargers. It is a difficult question of what should be done about diesel, especially since the government created incentives for people to buy them. A higher tax on diesel fuel will probably be effective in reducing emissions, but will hurt poorer people if leeway isn't given elsewhere. Personally I'm hoping they increase taxes to royally fuck any economic benefits for anyone that buys a diesel going forward. That being said I don't care if you're poor or not but diesels shouldn't be allowed in densely populated areas. An alternative would be to simply ban the sale of new diesel passenger vehicles with immediate effect. If the Tories took action against diesel years ago we wouldn't need such harsh punishments now, but they fucked up and left it far too long.

[QUOTE=Dorkslayz;52879064]Unless you're buying a petrol car for performance, not buying a diesel car is dumb. You're getting double the MPG for practically the same price.[/QUOTE] Unless you drive a 4x4 or a truck the sound alone is reason enough to not drive a diesel

Didnt the UK really push for diesels in the past? Seems kinda shit that they would push for people to buy something then start punishing them for having bought it.

[QUOTE=Cmx;52879238]Didnt the UK really push for diesels in the past? Seems kinda shit that they would push for people to buy something then start punishing them for having bought it.[/QUOTE] Yeah, in 2001 Gordon Brown introduced tax breaks for diesel cars, in an effort to reduce CO2 emissions. He admitted they got it wrong though iirc, and I don't think that mistake should stop us from trying to fix it ASAP at the cost of peoples lives. [editline]11th November 2017[/editline] The way car tax still works, even under the latest reforms the Tories did this year it still has incentives for diesel cars. It's based on nothing more than grams of CO2 per KM. Personally I think they should've taken the opportunity to add a NOx tax to it.

I do think any new diesel could justifiably have a tax put on it. But as I said, punitive measures aimed at existing Diesel owners is just a typical Tory trap, which instead of improving the situation makes it worse, not dissimilar to increasing the costs and difficulties associated with renting, to encourage buying. This given that a previous government subsidised diesels. We shouldn't be punished for Westminster having a change of heart yet again. Full disclosure, I'm not hugely biased. I have a 1.8i-VTEC 2012 Civic so I don't have personal interest in Diesel. I have the misfortune of driving a 1.3 MJTD Fiat diesel for work and I think it's awful. Give me an electric van any day.

If this ever comes to Portugal for example, it needs to come with a change in prices to fuels. Right now, the cheapest is 1.145 €/L, but personally, I wouldn't pump that into my car unless I was planning to get rid of it sometime in the very near future, as theres hundreds of horror stories about it. The most expensive? 1.454 €/L, but why do I go for the most expensive diesel? It's a lot better for the engine. It makes less noise, it gives slightly better mileage I think, slighty more power aswell, and most of all, it smokes way less than any other I've tried. My car was smoking a bit, and this almost completely stopped it. Petrol though? The cheapest, that you wouldn't want in your vehicle is 1.364€/L. If you go for something better, 1.559, and the cream of the crop starts at 1.7€/L. Couple that with petrol cars having awful mpgs never really comparable to diesels and you don't even think about getti g something better than a daily to get by.

[QUOTE=Rocâ„¢;52879327]If this ever comes to Portugal for example, it needs to come with a change in prices to fuels. Right now, the cheapest is 1.145 €/L, but personally, I wouldn't pump that into my car unless I was planning to get rid of it sometime in the very near future, as theres hundreds of horror stories about it. The most expensive? 1.454 €/L, but why do I go for the most expensive diesel? It's a lot better for the engine. It makes less noise, it gives slightly better mileage I think, slighty more power aswell, and most of all, it smokes way less than any other I've tried. My car was smoking a bit, and this almost completely stopped it. Petrol though? The cheapest, that you wouldn't want in your vehicle is 1.364€/L. If you go for something better, 1.559, and the cream of the crop starts at 1.7€/L. Couple that with petrol cars having awful mpgs never really comparable to diesels and you don't even think about getti g something better than a daily to get by.[/QUOTE] EU law specifies minimum octane ratings for the sale of petrol. The only difference between brands should be the additives.

[QUOTE=Morgen;52879347]EU law specifies minimum octane ratings for the sale of petrol. The only difference between brands should be the additives.[/QUOTE] Minimums don't stop more expensive "premium" fuels increasing it.

[QUOTE=SataniX;52879746]Minimums don't stop more expensive "premium" fuels increasing it.[/QUOTE] While that's true, using non-premium fuel isn't going to ruin your engine unless you're in a super car or something. [editline]11th November 2017[/editline] I also expect that Portugal having cheaper diesel than petrol is down to the refineries in Portugal? I think Portugal only has a couple, and they output far more diesel than gasoline so diesel is naturally cheaper.

Will this affect people who bought Diesel cars in the past? I regularly make 270 mile roundtrips to visit family, and I bought a Diesel purely based on the fact they're great for long distance driving. I am worried I'll know be shafted with taxes for a car I bought before I knew all these issues.

[QUOTE=loopoo;52879917]Will this affect people who bought Diesel cars in the past? I regularly make 270 mile roundtrips to visit family, and I bought a Diesel purely based on the fact they're great for long distance driving. I am worried I'll know be shafted with taxes for a car I bought before I knew all these issues.[/QUOTE] Will have to wait for 22nd to know what they are going to do exactly. One of the options being considered is increasing the VAT on diesel fuel so it's possible you will see a substantial price increase.

Funny that the government were persuading us to use diesel cars years ago and now they are going to tax us even more for using bloody diesel. :v:

[QUOTE=Steam-Pixie;52880131]Funny that the government were persuading us to use diesel cars years ago and now they are going to tax us even more for using bloody diesel. :v:[/QUOTE] Not the same Government though. As far as the Cabinet now is concerned, the people are at fault for the mistakes of Blair and Brown. This is what happens when you see your constituents as 'Them' and your party as 'Us'.

[QUOTE=Morgen;52879759]While that's true, using non-premium fuel isn't going to ruin your engine unless you're in a super car or something. [editline]11th November 2017[/editline] I also expect that Portugal having cheaper diesel than petrol is down to the refineries in Portugal? I think Portugal only has a couple, and they output far more diesel than gasoline so diesel is naturally cheaper.[/QUOTE] Oh it is, theres loads of horror stories about how the cheaper fuels wrecked some parts. Even my A3 works better with the good stuff. I actually don't know why diesel is much cheaper though. Never really went out to figure why, but it pretty much makes it a one sided competition against petrol seeing how you get nearly the same performance with higher mpgs and lower prices.

[QUOTE=Dorkslayz;52879064]Unless you're buying a petrol car for performance, not buying a diesel car is dumb. You're getting double the MPG for practically the same price.[/QUOTE] With diesel being $2.50 a gallon and gasoline being $2.05 a gallon, I'd have to drive a diesel vehicle getting somewhere around 50 or 60 to a gallon in order to break even compared to continuing to feed the gas burner I have now. Excluding the payment on the car itself, that is, factoring in just operating costs, maintenance costs, et-al. [I]Such a car is not available on any dealer lot within a reasonable distance from my house.[/I] There are two reasons to buy diesel. 1: You need fucktons of torque at basically idle. 2: You need a vehicle that can be left idling for hours on end and won't drain the fuel tank significantly or foul anything up. For most people, a gasoline fuelled car will do the job just fine, and burn cleaner to boot.

[QUOTE=TestECull;52880589]With diesel being $2.50 a gallon and gasoline being $2.05 a gallon, I'd have to drive a diesel vehicle getting somewhere around 50 or 60 to a gallon in order to break even compared to continuing to feed the gas burner I have now. Excluding the payment on the car itself, that is, factoring in just operating costs, maintenance costs, et-al. [I]Such a car is not available on any dealer lot within a reasonable distance from my house.[/I] There are two reasons to buy diesel. 1: You need fucktons of torque at basically idle. 2: You need a vehicle that can be left idling for hours on end and won't drain the fuel tank significantly or foul anything up. For most people, a gasoline fuelled car will do the job just fine, and burn cleaner to boot.[/QUOTE] I guess his point only really works for European countries like Portugal, where petrol is 0.20€ cents more than diesel, and that does make one hell of a difference, depending on what you can buy, as only the more modern and rather expensive engines can save as much fuel as a diesel. So, its either a super cheap petrol car with a 1.2L engine that drinks a lot of overpriced fuel, or a diesel that sips carefuly from a jug that almost gave you a liter per euro. Not only that, you still have some pretty comfortable and neat choices, which you end up being able to afford because diesel is cheap.