Star Wars Megathread Episode IV: A New Thread: UNTAGGED SPOILERS? 1 WEEK BAN - Film, Television and Music

[QUOTE=Splarg!;52986215][sp]They didn't need to do any of that entire side mission because Haldo actually had a decent plan to get away, but they simply didn't know, right?[/sp][/QUOTE] [sp]I still don't see how it's a plothole. Like, of course if Holdo had explained the plan fully something different would have happened and Canto Bight wouldn't have. That's not a plothole though, that's the story going in a different direction[/sp]

[QUOTE=RG4ORDR;52986028]This has been so common in Star Wars since forever, I dunno why the hell you're complaining about it. Genndy Wars,The Clone Wars,Rebels, IIRC Revenge of the Sith did it. It's literally something even in the old EU books.[/QUOTE] He yanked a lever hard and then yanked it back in the other direction, that pretty much is all the excuse you need for any maneuver in space

[QUOTE=Rusty100;52986010]yo it makes no sense not to [sp]reassure your crew when it looks like a mutiny might break out because they think you have no plan. [/sp][/QUOTE] [sp]If you tell people your plan is to hide and hope that help will come before First Order notices something is wrong they will mutiny anyway.[/sp]

[QUOTE=Damjen;52986228][sp]If you tell people your plan is to hide and hope that help will come before First Order notices something is wrong they will mutiny anyway.[/sp][/QUOTE] [sp]but i think people will start to notice that plan once you're in the shuttles. you can't just move people without telling them you're moving them. because you have to move them at some point. delaying it just causes panic. like what happened in the movie. holdo sucked[/sp]

[QUOTE=Rusty100;52986236][sp]but i think people will start to notice that plan once you're in the shuttles. you can't just move people without telling them you're moving them. because you have to move them at some point. delaying it just causes panic. like what happened in the movie. holdo sucked[/sp][/QUOTE] [sp]Better to have people panicking in relative safety than in the middle of being shot at. She is still a dumbass for not detaining Poe for his insubordination however. He is a hothead and letting him go lead to decimation of the Resistance.[/sp]

i feel like everyone in this movie acted like a dumbass tbh it was a running theme

Honestly, that whole [sp]Holdo thing[/sp] was the only bit of the plot that broke my suspension of disbelief (aside from Canto Bight, which just felt like padding/an excuse to change up the visuals). [sp]Poe's already proven himself as a Resistance hero, he's like a son to Leia, so clearly he can be trusted with high-sensitivity information. Why Holdo couldn't just take him aside and be like "look, I understand you're upset, but here's what we're gonna do, just keep it to yourself and stop undermining my authority, you dick" I don't know. Just tell him the truth since it'll get him off her back; if he reacts poorly or makes like he's gonna do something stupid, throw him in the brig to cool off until it's time to leave. But instead Laura Dern kept their entire escape plan a secret, because she "didn't want people to think she was just trying to be a hero" or something. Which I kinda get, since it avoids the whole "YOU CAN'T SACRIFICE YOURSELF, I'LL DO IT" discussion that would inevitably take place, but there's literally no reason she couldn't just tell Poe to respect her decision and keep it under wraps. There's character flaws, and then there's character incompetence.[/sp] Aside from Canto Bight, that was the only big ugly mark against this entire movie for me, I really liked everything else.

[Sp]I just think that the thing that annoyed me the most is the fact that NO-ONE said "I have a bad feeling about this", as happened in every other SW movie (barring Rogue One, where it is cut short). Does this mean that the movie isn't canon? [/sp] :v:

[QUOTE=Giulikapo;52986347][Sp]I just think that the thing that annoyed me the most is the fact that NO-ONE said "I have a bad feeling about this", as happened in every other SW movie (barring Rogue One, where it is cut short). Does this mean that the movie isn't canon? [/sp] :v:[/QUOTE] Jesus Christ, you're right. That feels like sacrilege. On a similar note, [sp]I was ready to fling my $6 collectible Porg popcorn tin at the screen when those kids showed at the end, since my gut reaction was that they were St Elsewhere-ing us and making the entire finale some story invented by a bunch of kids playing with Star Wars toys. But then we got that amazing final shot, so it was all cool.[/sp]

[QUOTE=Giulikapo;52986347][Sp]I just think that the thing that annoyed me the most is the fact that NO-ONE said "I have a bad feeling about this", as happened in every other SW movie (barring Rogue One, where it is cut short). Does this mean that the movie isn't canon? [/sp] :v:[/QUOTE] had to google that but turns out Rian actually did include it [media]https://twitter.com/rianjohnson/status/941235366853529600[/media] [url]http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/rian-johnson-last-jedi-star-wars-easter-egg_us_5a343517e4b01d429cc8bd59[/url] [quote][sp]In an interview Friday, HuffPost asked Johnson if the line came from BB-8′s anxious beeps when the droid and Poe Dameron (Oscar Isaac) are flying into battle against the First Order near the start of the movie. The director confirmed: Yes, that was it. “Yes!” he said with a laugh. “Good catch!” Lucasfilm and Disney In 2016, “The Force Awakens” sound supervisor Matthew Wood broke down BB-8′s language and sounds for HuffPost, explaining that the droid’s beeps and boops start out as spoken words behind the scenes. That obviously made for a convenient way to hide the line. [/sp][/quote] sneaky

[QUOTE=Fort83;52985822][sp] Only for her to show up in the 9th movie, once again giving her character no context or reason for her to even be in the movie, and die just as quickly as she appeared.[/sp][/QUOTE] Phasma seemed like such a cool concept and being played by Gwendoline Christie it seemed like she would of been an awesome character like Fett in Ep 5, before we saw TFA. Its criminal how misused Phasma was. I think it was just a PR move to get a thrones actor to generate more hype now that I look at it.

Jokes sucked. Finn and Poe are children's Characters. [sp]Hux gets fooled by a your mother joke/you're on hold joke 5 Star Destroyers vs 1 x wing vs 1 capital ship/cruiser takes days of siege? Snoke? Who wanted to hear about Snoke's story? NOPE. RIAN JOHNSON, DESTROYING EXPECTATIONS LUL.[/sp] hey remember when Maz said "Thats a story for another time" when they discussed Luke's saber and how it got there? Yea nope, not covering that. I wanted to like this, I really did. I think, in a way, it did a lot of things right, but also fell horribly flat on the comedy timing and overall direction of the film. It's still better than TFA in my book. EDIT: I agree wholeheartedly that the Luke/Rey/Kylo side of the film was GREAT. The "resistance" half was JarJar/Slapstick level. It really felt like a childrens TV show like Rebels (which is more serious than the Resistance first act IMO).

[QUOTE=Saxon;52986390]Phasma seemed like such a cool concept and being played by Gwendoline Christie it seemed like she would of been an awesome character like Fett in Ep 5, before we saw TFA. Its criminal how misused Phasma was. I think it was just a PR move to get a thrones actor to generate more hype now that I look at it.[/QUOTE] Phasma never seemed particularly cool to me so I can't say that her lack of relevance bothered me. I did appreciate that TLJ justified [sp]her shiny special snowflake armour with how it makes blaster bolts bounce off.[/sp] I didn't really follow Phasma's promotional material and don't care about her actor so all she had to stand on was an armour design that I didn't like. I wish the First Order had more personality as a faction than "hux is an overconfident jackass" and "empire remnants who put all of their money into trying to have the biggest sticks". The most distinct flair they ever got was Hux's address in TFA. I'm hoping that Hux will have changed as a character by the third movie and not just double down on "no but with THIS superweapon/big ship we're totally invincible and they can't possibly stop us".

[QUOTE=Reds;52986408] I did appreciate that TLJ justified [sp]her shiny special snowflake armour with how it makes blaster bolts bounce off.[/sp][/QUOTE] yea that was pretty cool but mostly all that did was make me wonder why all, or at least more of the storm troopers aren't wearing that shit too lol and for Phasma in general [sp]of all the people that ended up surprise-dying, that was the one character I predicted would die in this movie since I figured they'd have to at least kill off one villain now before setting up the finale. But I also thought it'd come with her having a lot more characterization so it'd at least mean something. Instead I spent most of the movie just wondering where the fuck she even was. When she finally did show up it was near the end of the movie so I just figured that meant she'd survive, but NOPE instead they just quickly killed her off anyways. Yeaaaa way to really make use of that character[/sp]

[QUOTE=postal;52986415]yea that was pretty cool but mostly all that did was make me wonder why all, or at least more of the storm troopers aren't wearing that shit too lol[/QUOTE] [sp]Just wait for side-material that says that it costs a billion credits and only works on small arms fire or something I guess.[/sp] Phasma makes me wish that we saw more officer stormtroopers to compare or contrast her against. Do all captains get unique armour like how the clone commanders had unique bits of armour and colours, or is she the only one like that?

Was anyone else secretly hoping [sp]rey would turn to the dark side? I mean I didn't think it would happen, but i think it would've been genuinely interesting if they went that route and the last movie they were trying to get her back[/sp]

It's not easy being the middle child. Aesthetically, this movie has some moments that are the best in the series. Like [sp]the red salt planet and the warp-drive chop of death.[/sp] BUT THEN you have moments like [sp]puppet Yoda and *flying space grandma*[/sp] The writing felt like a bunch of bobs and bits. Some of them hit really nice, but a lot of them pass by too quickly, leaving you wondering what the hell is going on. It felt like a bumpy ride. For a die-hard fan, it might be fun to delve into all these new goodies. But for a filthy casual like me, who isn't going to spend the time going over every new plot device, it felt like it was trying too much. It just felt unrefined. If I had to describe this movie a singular, colourful adjective, it'd be: jutting. That being said, I do appreciate the bold choice in direction for the series. It's the perfect antithesis of what TFA was. Personally, I'd rather have something new and unfocused than something old and safe. So for what it's worth, it was money well spent.

Where are all the Imperial veterans among The First Order? Everyone in TFO is young even though the faction is supposed to have been founded by Imperial remnants. Was the old guard forced to retire when the babies indoctrinated from birth became adults? Finn should be written completely differently. Dunno why they made him a TFO deserter if they didn't want to actually use him to flesh out TFO. He should be more like a Spartan.

[QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;52985259]The original Star Wars films aren't meccas of good writing and amazing character development. They're pretty basic movies that brought good science-fantasy to the table in the form of a trilogy. You cant really complain that the new movies don't have fantastic writing when the originals didn't. And [sp]Yoda wasn't there as some fan-servicey 5 second appearance to drive nostalgia. He actually had a purpose being there and drove the plot [/sp] Its like we're at the point where bringing back old characters is considered "fan service" even if they're plot relevant.[/QUOTE] In the form of a Deus Ex Machina. [editline]18th December 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=SGTSpartans;52986393]Jokes sucked. Finn and Poe are children's Characters. [sp]Hux gets fooled by a your mother joke/you're on hold joke 5 Star Destroyers vs 1 x wing vs 1 capital ship/cruiser takes days of siege? Snoke? Who wanted to hear about Snoke's story? NOPE. RIAN JOHNSON, DESTROYING EXPECTATIONS LUL.[/sp] hey remember when Maz said "Thats a story for another time" when they discussed Luke's saber and how it got there? Yea nope, not covering that. I wanted to like this, I really did. I think, in a way, it did a lot of things right, but also fell horribly flat on the comedy timing and overall direction of the film. It's still better than TFA in my book. EDIT: I agree wholeheartedly that the Luke/Rey/Kylo side of the film was GREAT. The "resistance" half was JarJar/Slapstick level. It really felt like a childrens TV show like Rebels (which is more serious than the Resistance first act IMO).[/QUOTE] The [sp]chase[/sp] and fuel stuff was really really dumb. [editline]18th December 2017[/editline] Also the whole [sp]fly to another planet[/sp] thing was so out of place.

Just watched it. I'm not the biggest Star Wars fan though I've seen most of the movies. I thought some stuff was just really dumb. [sp]So Leia is a force user and she can survive in the vacuum of space? Okay, I guess. Casino planet and roguish thief character didn't really work for me. How did he know the resistance's plan of escaping? They didn't tell him that. Did I miss that? The Holdo character I think wasn't done well enough. I was watching the film going "Uh, no she's absolutely right Poe, you just went against orders for a Pyrrhic victory against a dreadnought and lost your entire bomber division in an already-diminished and weakened army. You need to sit down." So I felt like the movie was trying to make me hate her but she was 100% in the right the entire time. In fact, the entire second half of the movie on the resistance side was entirely his fault. He almost prevented the rebels from escaping with his mutiny. He subverted chain of command and sent two troops out on a mission that accomplished absolutely nothing, and even worse caused the loss of dozens, if not hundreds of rebellion lives when their codebreaker flipped on them and sold the entire resistance out. This caused the surviving resistance to be utterly cornered and almost killed for good, if not for Kylo Ren's own incompetence and Luke and Rey's intervention. And Poe is painted as a hero by the end. His immense failure and disregard of chain of command on two separate occasions resulted in the loss of hundreds of lives and he accomplished nothing in return. Like, I know that the theme of the movie is regret, failure, and moving on, but damn this Poe guy is an idiot and it's frustrating that even after he kills so many people Leia and Holdo are like "He's a whippersnapper, we love that guy."[/sp] This is all I can remember off the top of my head, I didn't really make it a point to analyze everything, though I noticed other incongruities that I later forgot about. But stuff like that aside, I found myself still enjoying the movie. Probably because of the spectacle, because some sequences were really well shot and the action felt weighty and brutal, and probably because I still enjoyed watching the characters interact for the most part despite higher-level stupidity in the script. It was a totally watchable movie in my book. Nothing amazing or mind-blowing, but definitely not prequel levels of boring. PS, [sp]Phasma was almost cool for about 3 minutes. Then they killed off the character with the most potential in the entire series. I don't even care about Snoke, to be honest I was getting tired of the wise old evil man constantly controlling shit from behind the scenes in every one of these movies. Seeing a conflicted, confused, and impulsive Kylo Ren as a main villain is more interesting to me.[/sp]

On Phasma's armor: [sp]The reason she can withstand blaster fire is because her armor is made from the last metal salvaged from Palpatine's personal ship. It's a rare hull-grade material, probably very heavy, which is fine for her given her physique, but wouldn't be suited for your average trooper. (Even if there was enough of the material to go around, which there isn't)[/sp]

[QUOTE=Rusty100;52985733]also [sp]why did they just HAPPEN to be right next to an old planet with an abandoned base after their first hyperspeed? their only hope of survival hinged on it and it was just... there. and even if tfo aren't tracking your little ships... they're within visible range. you could just see them out the window if anybody was looking out. and if you either blew up their ship, or boarded it once the fields went down, you'd see that there was either no corpses or nobody inside, and you'd be like 'i guess they escaped, they can't have gone far, they're probably on that planet, right fucking there.' even if you blew it up and didn't check out the wreckage, anyone competant would have checked out the adjacent planet on the off chance anyone escaped. like good plan guys. idk why people are defending this bad writing. every piece of plot tension was just shifting the goal posts we have to escape oh it didnt work we have to get the master code breaker to get onto the capitol ship actually this guy will do we have to escape in small ships that they cant track oh actually they can the big ship has to pretend to escape oh actually it doesnt oh finn got captured anyway we have to buy time to wait for reinforcements actually we dont we have to destroy the cannon oh actually we dont i have to mutiny actually no i dont the whole plot was such a mess. nothing EVER followed through, it's lazy. instead of resolving any plot points, it's just like 'oops didn't work, moving on!' for the entire film, like no character ever thought anything through. there were very little payoffs and everything felt pointless. the constant subversion of expectations just left the movie hollow and pointless, devoid of any good character decisions, and logic[/sp][/QUOTE] [sp]I'd need to rewatch but I think that was sort of the plan the entire time? They lightsped away presumably to that planet to rebase and fuel up because they had limited fuel even before the jump and they didn't expect to be intercepted again, but they realized they were being tracked so they had to improvise. They make it a point to let you know they're secretly evacuating all of the tertiary ships to the mothership before they reveal what the actual plan is, so I think their new plan was to make it look like they were dying off and then slip away at the last minute to the planet that they had already picked out to wait out the incursion and call for support because they were already out of options at that point anyway. I agree with you in that it's lazy writing in that I sort of had to piece this explanation together myself and it's not explained, and why isn't the commanding officer reading everybody into this plan when tensions are high, but I could buy the plan itself as a reasonable thing that might be attempted when your back is that against the wall.[/sp]

I just saw the movie and it was nice finally getting to see a Star Wars movie in a theater, I've only been to the theater two other times in my life (one time paid by school for a movie I can't remember, and another by a friend to see Deadpool) so I don't really have much theater experience I guess. I really enjoyed it and it seemed like the audience that was there liked it too. The people I was seeing it with also enjoyed it. I guess you could say this is anecdotal, but I don't see why that score is so low.

i'd say some of the highs in the film were in the production quality, and some of the moments - i really liked the [sp]bit with yoda and luke by the burning tree, felt very old star wars and quaint[/sp] but fuck me there was so much crap in there as well [sp]just the entire sequence for finn and rose after the hyperdrive crash, everything during that scene was dire and awful[/sp] i'd rate it between the prequels and rogue one

The full movie theater let out a collective moan of annoyance when [sp]Leia became a Disney princess with superpowers, surviving space freeze, floating and door busting Superhuman strength[/sp]

[QUOTE=Killuah;52986707]The full movie theater let out a collective moan of annoyance when [sp]Leia became a Disney princess with superpowers, surviving space freeze, floating and door busting Superhuman strength[/sp][/QUOTE] Sounds like a pretty immature theatre.

[QUOTE=BanthaFodder;52986360]Jesus Christ, you're right. That feels like sacrilege. On a similar note, [sp]I was ready to fling my $6 collectible Porg popcorn tin at the screen when those kids showed at the end, since my gut reaction was that they were St Elsewhere-ing us and making the entire finale some story invented by a bunch of kids playing with Star Wars toys. But then we got that amazing final shot, so it was all cool.[/sp][/QUOTE] I don't recall anything amazing happening at that scene so i must have missed it, what happened after/at that part?

[QUOTE=ShadowSocks8;52986578]On Phasma's armor: [sp]The reason she can withstand blaster fire is because her armor is made from the last metal salvaged from Palpatine's personal ship. It's a rare hull-grade material, probably very heavy, which is fine for her given her physique, but wouldn't be suited for your average trooper. (Even if there was enough of the material to go around, which there isn't)[/sp][/QUOTE] that's eu levels [sp]of silly wank[/sp] seriously, is it that hard to say it's made of a [sp]very rare and hard to aquire blaster reflecting material that can only really be acquired in small quantities and the quantities that have already been mined and refined are used on ships and not people because that would be a massive waste, except for, in this case, Phasma, who managed to aquire enough for a set of armour but not enough to outfit an entire army (because again, waste) instead of IT WAS PALPATINES OWN STARSHIP GRADE PLATING FROM HIS OWN PERSONAL SHIP, like that just seems silly, I mean, seriously, does everything have to connect in such a silly nonsensical way[/sp]

[QUOTE=Killuah;52986707]The full movie theater let out a collective moan of annoyance when [sp]Leia became a Disney princess with superpowers, surviving space freeze, floating and door busting Superhuman strength[/sp][/QUOTE] Must have been a very different kind of audience from the one we went in with. A lot of the women at my showing came in Princess Leia themed outfits and a lot of people, even quite a few blokes, wore Princess Leia Tshirts. And[sp] Everyone seemed overjoyed during that scene, and quite a few people got tearful during Carrie Fisher's Special mention in the credits. I thought The space scene looked pretty silly visually but I don't have a problem with the concept. "It's space magic I don't gotta explain shit."[/sp] On the subject of costumes we also had two dudes dressed in pretty decent Revenge Of The Sith Anakin and Obi Wan outfits sat across from us.

[QUOTE=jonu67;52986938]that's eu levels [sp]of silly wank[/sp] seriously, is it that hard to say it's made of a [sp]very rare and hard to aquire blaster reflecting material that can only really be acquired in small quantities and the quantities that have already been mined and refined are used on ships and not people because that would be a massive waste, except for, in this case, Phasma, who managed to aquire enough for a set of armour but not enough to outfit an entire army (because again, waste) instead of IT WAS PALPATINES OWN STARSHIP GRADE PLATING FROM HIS OWN PERSONAL SHIP, like that just seems silly, I mean, seriously, does everything have to connect in such a silly nonsensical way[/sp][/QUOTE] [sp]It's the same material the Royal Starship was made out of in TMP[/sp] [QUOTE=Giulikapo;52986347][Sp]I just think that the thing that annoyed me the most is the fact that NO-ONE said "I have a bad feeling about this", as happened in every other SW movie (barring Rogue One, where it is cut short). Does this mean that the movie isn't canon? [/Sp] [/QUOTE] [sp]BB-8 says it. I'm serious[/sp]