• TF2 Random Critical Hits: A Fair and Balanced Discussion
    669 replies, posted
REMINDER REMINDER If you think random crits are okay and should be kept in the game you are either, a child a shitter /tf2g/ poster scrap.tf regular faggot Thank you for reading.
Go back to 4chan. Adults don't need to use insults like faggot to get a point across, they can have a (relatively, as ASIC puts it) civil discussion.
Can you show that what you say about me (and maybe those other 2 people) is accurate? Anyways, to back up what I said about the thread starting off bad: Look at the first page. The second post was circular reasoning. The third post was basically shitflinging. There is also this (and the following discussion): TF2 Random Critical Hits
At this point I'd rather leave you in blissful ignorance. Hopefully that's also how this thread dies. It was a good idea but not a great topic to discuss.
we can't discuss and elaborate a proper discussion about the cons and pros of critical hits if there isn't someone providing pros.
From the perspective of an eternally mediocre player, random crits [i]can[/i] give a nice rush of adrenaline. The feeling of amplifying my rare moments of "good play" with an empowering random crit, abusing the 2 seconds of random crits as a Heavy or Pyro, making my enemies panic and cower, the thrill of surviving a near-death scrape of a random crocket and retreating to fight another day, or the sigh of relief that you were lucky enough to saw that sneaky spy right behind your heavy! It's such a thrill, and it incentivizes me to play more daring and aggressively! Then I remember that some of those crits were unearned and cheap bullshit, since I've usually dealt little to no damage, or have just joined.
^ That's right on the nose. Random crits give a rush of adrenaline to the one person that can get and take advantage of them for a short period of time, but at the expense of... everybody else on the enemy team. Kritzkrieg did the crit mechanic right, you don't get it for luck, you have to test your patience and face a potentially un-counterable adversary (plain uber) to actually get that moment of adrenaline where every shot completely baleets every enemy you see.
They're definitely not good for serious play but statistically both sides are going to get the same volume of crits.
Statistically, the team performing better will get more crits. That's literally been repeated at least 10 times in this thread.
I really hate to argue in defense of a bad system but if an advantage is gained from performing better then it can't really be argued to be unfair from a randomness perspective.
Noh. You are wrongji. Something determined by RNG cannot be averaged out like that, especially since they directly correlate to damage delt recently. What determines the number of random crits are factors like the number of damage-dealing classes hitting their shots, and the amount sustained volume of fire against the enemy. Unusual wearing tryhard (or actually good) teams will get statistically more random crits than gibus ones, which only serves to further bury the argument that crits somehow help level the playing field for new players.
That's exactly what averaging does I'm not saying they level the playing field. They don't, and they aren't good for competitive play. But it is no longer an argument about being "unfair" in sweeping strokes if the better team is the one getting them more often. I don't really get your comment about unusual vs gibus teams, why are you using hat rarity to describe skill?
Yes it can. That, again, has been repeated at least 10 times. ASIC and whoever else have gave the exact same argument word-for-word over the past 3 months and it's been proven wrong constantly. If you hate to argue in defense of random crits, then don't.
I hate to argue for them because they can make oneoff crapshots into instant kills, not because statistically the volume of them is unfair.
i think RC are fine they way they are.
If you hate to argue in defense of random crits. then don't. There's no context or modifiers needed for that statement. It's as simple as "I don't need to argue in favor of them". Nobody is misjudging them here, every argument presented in favor of random crits has been soundly deconstructed and proven wrong. There's no legitimate reason to argue for them anymore except a warped sense of fondness/nostalgia.
I personally just find random crits to be disruptive, but also tend to stunt people from trying to get better at the game by having them want to rely on random crits for their kills. As well as completely screws up class balancing when specific classes will always have more benefits out of random crits then others. When I play casual though, I generally hold back and even handicap myself so that the newer players don't get completely destroyed during matches. Losing matches are the best to learn from, but not when you play against people who can completely destroy you. Defeating any chance of taking in the experence from the situation and learning how to better prepare for it in the future should it happen again. I still try to preform bare in mind, I just don't want to completely crush the people I'm fighting is all. Getting a random crit though almost always does the complete opposite of that. I honestly don't need Valve holding my hands in any situation regardless though when it comes to getting kills as I'm usually far more then capable to handle that myself. I believe the rest has been stated numerous times though... How random crits benefit experienced players more then newer players, which goes against the reason they exist in helping new players out, which often helps lead games into a steam roll. Then how generalist, exp. soldier and demo benefit from a single random crit far more then other classes normally do breaking game balance. To newer players becoming too reliant on random crits to get kills instead of improving themselves to get better without the need of random crits. I see no actual good point to keeping them is all. How people can find them remotely fun, wither getting hit by them or receiving them.
I like random crits when im in a killstreak of 4 happenign within 5 seconds, i use every single shot from my primary, and secondary to lay down enemies on this sweet sick massacre, then without any time to reload i pull out my melee weapon and start atttacking. I lay down 2 people when the 3rd one comes up and BAM, random crit puts him down, and i walk out of there a hero, all withing seconds. Those moments are the most fun i have in TF2, and i would hate to see them go away.
random crits are drugs if you rely on it again and again itll ruin your game and you desperately want more
i dont think one should rely on it, but if it happens it can be a very nice juicy plump cherry on top of the cake. You dont need it to enjoy the cake, but it makes digging into it end with such a gushy tasty ending~
If only that moment of sweet enjoyment didn't come at the expense of the 5 other players who exploded for no reason and overall game fairness. I fail to see how that generates anything but a net negative user experience, which is one of the main factors causing dwindling player counts.
How has it been proven wrong?
there's plenty of counterarguments to your points, its just that you dodge and/or ignore them so it doesnt count as point proven wrong for you
So why do you think I speak like that? Also, this is somewhat ironic to hear rom you. Prove your accusation.
Well flurry you were right, he replied with questions. Again. Does this mean he's banned? Hopefully. Made maybe one day he'll realize that the burden of proof lies on the one making the claim, in this case random crits being anything but awful, and that simply demanding proof of counterclaims without evidence of one's own point is not an argument form nor how logical reasoning works. I also suppose i cant disprove that the flying spaghetti monster was behind random crits to begin with either, so, there you have it- according to asic logic, that's all you need... Spaghetti monster crit conspiracy 2018. Change my mind. *sets up sign and table, waits*
Open your eyes and you'll see them.
They're not unfair on average, but they are definitely unfair in individual skirmish instances. A 1v1 fight that would have come down to skill can instantly go one way or the other if one side slings a crocket.
Why are you guys still arguing with someone who believes that the more skilled team shouldn't always win?
Because being able to elaborate an argument as to why RNG deaths are essentially bad or good is part of a healty discussion.
only 1 player dies from random crit in those moments. I personally know 1 random crit can alter the outcome of an entire game, but 96/100 times, random crits never effect the overall outcome of a casual game.
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