Killing Floor V11 - Upgrade to make your 9mm stronger than a 12G shotgun
999 replies, posted
IMO Support is absolutely fine, he just needs some weapon variety. HZ12 needs some sort of alt-fire function and Nailgun needs a very slight damage buff. I like the balance they're striking between mag-based and shell-based guns, the cross-perk shotguns are really fun (just need some sort of Shotgun GS weapon to have enough variety) and welding can only become more useful now that objectives are being re-introduced.
Gunslinger is also okay, he just does way too much damage with line-em-up. There can be an argument made that the perk is skill-indexed by being generally good with aiming, but the fact that you can turn on crosshairs in Kf2 and akimbo pistols all have the same alt-fire switching to an insanely accurate right-pistol-sights option invalidates it somewhat. Needs at least one pistol that encourages using only one instead of always going akimbo, but otherwise has enough weapon variety and perk variety IMO.
Since we're discussing perks:
Medic needs an HMTech weapon for literally every other perk. HMTech bow/crossbow, HMtech melee (maybe a giant syringe like Quake TF Medic that heals teammates on contact?), and bring the Bloat-thrower back with a syringe alt-fire. Also its skills tree needs a complete redux IMO.
Commando is... okay. It's really the only perk that genearelly is balanced, but is bland because it's so simplistic, but they've given it so many weapons and cross-perk weapons that that isn't even a problem anymore. I've been happy since they added the LMG.
IMO Sharpie just needs a classic bow and arrow and maybe another one or two weapons and it'll be golden.
Demo is fine, has a similar problem to Commando where there's really only variety in terms of what weapons are available, and I think the HMTech 501 being Commando cross-perk was a bummer, but even then, it's not like the perk is hurting for new weapons, what with the M23GL being added back, just needs the LAW. Also, again, redux the skills. Nobody's stupid enough to take any of the R skills, except maybe Mad Bomber for the auto perk weapons. Maybe add back the Seal Squeal Harpoon bomber and the perk will be good for a year or so.
Firebug really just needs Microwave to get some form of buff or some re-tooling, it was completely invalidated by the upgrade system. Why bother with the Microwave Gun when you can just use Heat Wave on an upgraded Flamethrower? Maybe very slightly tweak the R skills so they're more appealing, or make them actually viably useful by finally making events notify players the trader before the wave, instead of as the wave starts.
SWAT is doing a lot better but obviously the Tommy needs some serious tweaks, both presentation- and gameplay-wise, but it was a highly-requested weapon with a niche and SWAT is always fun because SMGs are always satisfying to use. IMO make the Tommy crossperk with Survivalist so it doesn't have to be handicapped due to Hollow Point. Otherwise, maybe add back any SMGs that have been missing from KF1? And, once again, the perk should be good for a long while.
Lol Survivalist. Either rework the skill tree entirely or just get rid of it and take the community suggested ideas of perks like Scientist. Survivalist was a rush job that was DOA. Literally the only reason to play the perk is to use the Freezethrower (which could easily be a great Scientist weapon, cough cough).
Am I in the minority that I think all the classes need serious re-works? The perk tree leaves much to be desired and most of the time the perk choice will be an obvious good vs bad selection or just feel underwhelming (extra ammo perks are pretty boring most of the time, save for maybe's supports backpack boost along side extra ammo).
can't tell if people are disagreeing with your sentiment or disagreeing about the minority part
But I feel your sentiment is spot on
The skill tree seemed like a natural evolution to the perk levelling system, but the core gameplay loop is so simple, the core mechanics outside of new melee are so simple, enemy variety is so simple (the only damage variation besides contact is Husk's fire, poison from Bloat, Albino crawler, and Hans, bullets from Hans and Patriarch, and Siren's direct health damage), etc that skills just don't work. They work in games where there's a lot of enemy variety and ways to approach combat, different goals, different ways to reach those goals. Perks in KF are dead simple: each one has a specialty for a certain weapon type, and a certain goal in a team composition.
There's just too much going against KF2 for skill trees to really work, and to be fair, after the ~3 years of iterating, the skill trees aren't awful, they're a lot better than they were at launch, but outside of really simplistic and easy-to-balance differences like "mag size vs. reload speed", there isn't much that can be done. It's also hard to really pinpoint what goals TWI are setting with their skill trees outside of Medic (healer vs. combat), Zerk (classic juggernaut vs. Martial Artist), and Firebug (ground flame vs. direct flame).
The majority of other skill trees can basically be summed up as "do you want to be more effective, or do you want to have weird gimmicks?". GS can be over-all more effective and have higher DPS thanks to rack 'em up, expert reloading, et c, or you can play a weird perk where shooting limbs does bonus damage, you can shoot through zeds without reduction, and you can aim down your sights more effectively. Demo is "be more effective especially against sirens" and "do way more damage", or "have bigger explosions, knock zeds around even more, have bigger magazines, and just be a general nuisance to your team without actually benefitting them in any way". Support's 2 skill trees aren't bad (as I previously said), but they're more just changing how Shotguns as weapons work, there's no distinct two playstyles beyond mag-based vs. shell-based reloads.
It just doesn't work and makes the concept of levelling up feel unfulfilling. You can't even bother to play HOE unless you grind a perk to level 15 at least, some perks like GS are insanely less optimal without certain skill levels, damage is straight up just injected into skill levels. It sucks.
I posted that video on the previous page
Literally, just punching things. Plus EMP heavy attack to keep HVTs less raged. Makes me miss how well done the Martial Artist can be.
Just imagine if MA came out with the aformentioned Katana and corresponding weapons (I mean literally, both GS/SS almost share the same attributes, but GS excels better. Why not Zerk and MA?), having parry turn into a counterattack and either knockback/stun the attacking ZED.
What's the deal? Steam won't let me nominate Tripwire Interactive for Best Developer. There's no way in Satan's eternally burning Hell that I'd ever nominate Valve, and of course, that option's available.
Speculation: Since the new event-tied weapons have all been boss weapons with skins exclusive to their alternate event skins (Han's Mkb, Abomination's giant axe) , the next "secret" event weapon will either be Fleshpound gauntlets or Patriarch's MG.
one in the pipe
What about the bloat's meat clever ?
Not a boss
What about the Abomination's nipple rings?
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Beta 2 is now live
Event
Twisted Christmas : Season’s Beatings
Beta 2 Start 11 / 27 / 2018, Beta 2 End on Final Release
Beta 2 for this update contains adjustments and bug fixes from the Beta 1 feedback! We appreciate your feedback and thank you very much for it. Stay tuned for a link to another survey to assess how you felt with the balance adjustments.
General
Sound improvements to the Tommy Gun, Fire Axe, Battle Axe, and M32 Grenade Launcher.
Balance
Weapons
Berserker
Fire Axe Heavy attacks now have a chance to stun
Battle Axe Heavy attack speed reduced by 10%
SWAT
Tommy Gun ( cross perk with Commando )Bullet spread increased by 195%
Recoil reduced by 13%
Upward recoil reduced by an additional 15%
Fire rate increased by 20% (600 RPM to 720 RPM)
Designer Note - These adjustments were in response to provided community feedback via the BETA 1 survey. The Fire Axe lacked gameplay identity when compared to its other tier 2 weapon counterparts. As such, we added the chance to stun on heavy attacks, and head shots increase that chance substantially. This will be the first melee weapon that can stun.
As for the Battle Axe, its heavy attack damage is substantially higher than all of our other melee weapons, and the speed of those heavy attacks felt a bit too fast for its damage output. We adjusted the speed down to counteract that immense damage.
Lastly, the Tommy Gun’s recoil felt too high, and its fire rate felt too slow. We adjusted both values so that it is easier to control the gun and fire faster with it. We also increased its spread so that it is not effective long range. Community feedback mostly wanted this weapon to be effective close to medium range, so the spread adjustments should align it better to those ranges.
Bug Fixes
Top Community Issues
Fixed an issue where the player’s Pistol would disappear from the inventory when not having enough weight to pick up a second Pistol.
Fixed an issue where the M32 Grenade Launcher grenade ammo floated during one of the weapon check animations.
Fixed an issue where Perk passives that applied an increase to ammunition were not applying.
Fixed an issue where the Pulverizer was not using the intended values for its explosion damage and explosion radius.
Shopping SpreeFixed an issue where crawlers were getting stuck at their spawns.
Fixed an issue where Zeds were unable to cross over a couch and enter the playspace.
Gameplay
Fixed an issue where crashes would happen mid-game.
Fixed an issue where the M99 AMR had broken 3rd person reload animations.
User Interface
Fixed an issue where the Weekly objective icons overlapped the text of the weekly description.
Map(s)
Santa’s Workshop
Fixed an issue where the sleigh cart was unable to be welded during the 2nd and 3rd Escort missions.
Fixed an issue where untextured presents appeared near the sleigh cart.
Fixed an issue where lag spikes occurred during the 1st Escort objective.
Fixed an issue where code script text appeared whenever the sleigh cart exited a gate.
Shopping Spree
Fixed an issue where the splattermap was enabled on water meshes.
Sound
Fixed an issue where when the player is defeated on an Endless game of Santa's Workshop, Santa's defeat voice lines are played instead of the Patriarch.
Fixed an issue where the Santa Trader VO lines for the 10 second reminder of trader time were too long.
Art
Fixed an issue where the Main Menu cinematic would freeze after returning from a game session.
Fixed an issue where interrupting an Emote animation by equipping a cosmetic breaks all Emote animations.
Localization
Fixed an issue where debug text displayed for the Battle Axe on the shared content window.
Fixed an issue where the Tommy Gun was missing a localized description in the Trader Menu.
should just take the thompson off commando
Yep. IMO either make it cross-perk with survivalist (for a multitude of aesthetic reasons) or just make it SWAT only. If you're gonna give it a prestige skin that uses the survivalist icon, it only makes sense to make it a survivalist weapon in some way.
I don't know how I feel about this adjustment for the thompson:
-Tommy Gun ( cross perk with Commando )Bullet spread increased by 195%
I can understand that it needs to be tweaked, but almost 200%? Maybe i would understand it more if I saw the original value used and the new value they changed it to.
okay did they really just make the pulverizer NOT suck
Abomination is so goddamn boring to fight against, and a pain in the ass imo.
Solo is fucking boring against that thing, it's the most boring boss they could've added, oh yeah let's a bullet sponge, I'm sure people will love that shit.
I'm surprised they didn't changed the M32 bug that doesn't affect by the reload speed perk
Exactly. He's a massive bullet sponge, his gloob boys are annoying as shit, his succ attack is still buggy and doesn't have much counterplay. All you have to really do to beat him is hold S and aim at his head.
I think some good fixes for Abomination would be:
While he's doing his succ attack, throwing a grenade at it interrupts it and deals bonus damage. Increase the range and # of players able to be succed in.
His rage is stronger and faster with each part of health being reduced. At 15% health, he's constantly raged.
Gloob boys don't explode if killed with fire or killed before their animation begins.
Gas clouds are significantly reduced in duration.
Equalize his armor. Its not bad removing the armor on his head, but he may as well as have an ass and front made out of titanium.
they did, they just didnt mention it
the thompson is nice looking but it's sound design leaves much to be desired
inb4 tripwire makes a big long blog post about how hard their sound designer worked on these new sounds and how grateful we should be even though they're terrible
never forget 9mm that sounds like a fucking black powder musket
The variant enemy bosses are fucking boring as shit and feel like "Oh god we need to make more bosses" instead of being... actual bosses
glad they reverted that change / made a new 9mm sound
Did they actually in the update?
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Killing Floor V11 - Upgrade to make your 9mm stronger than a 12G shotgun
