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Wasn´t triple tank three tanks, two healers and one dps though?
GOATS is at its base Rein, DVa, Zarya, Lucio, and the other two heals can be whatever. Usually Brig, but her nerfs made her less necessary. It's boring to play, watch, and play against. Nobody enjoys it, but it works.
So basically you are telling me that GOATS is yer olde "Triple tanks plus broken Ana" meta, but with three support heroes instead in order to compensante for Ana's, ah-ehrm, balance?
Pretty much, three tanks can do enough damage in the hands of the right players and the three supports are there to make them unkillable. Its part of why reaper got the buff, this is the exact kind of thing his character was designed to counter and he simply wasn't viable against it.
I'm not convinced reaper has become viable.
You would be right. GOATS is still going strong it seems. Not much reaper can do vs Defense Matrix, Rein shields, and Zarya Bubbles. GOATS is mainly countered by things that can stay out of reach. Being close to it is a death wish. The speed at which a good GOATS team can go really limits the time and manner to counter them, so it's usually best to just go GOATS to fight GOATS. May the best goat win.
That was the "occasional" thing, but triple tank and triple support is what I remembers clearly. Soldier 76 was the dps picked the vast majority of time.
Goats isn't a tank meta. Goats is a support meta that can barf out enough healing to enable Tank DPS. Reaper sucks hard against anything that doesnt have a big hitbox for him to exploit, which is actually 4 of the 6 heroes in goats.
reaper dominates reinhardt luckily, rein is surrounded by 5 other players (one of which has a shield that disconnects your keyboard) blizzard buffing reaper vs goats shows they have no idea why goats is meta. like you said, tanks aren't the keystone of goats
For those that give a shit the first game of the new OWL season is a mirror match 3 tank 3 supp
As if Brigitte is still the whole reason for this comp...
The issue isn't really just Brig at this point. Its healer powercreep. The one common suit among the GOATS healers, is they're all AOE healers. Math time Moira's heal gas can heal 80HP/S on her entire team. This can be pushed further with her orb which can heal 75 HP/S Thats 135 Health in a single second on your entire team. (somewhat, the orb has a max HP limit but you get the point) Lucio can heal 16 HP/S, boosts up to 50HP/S with his amp Brig also heals 16 HP/S but also can both burst 150 HP instantly from long range with no aim, but also can build 30 Armor a second on her entire team during ult. Armor is obviously better than health but for simplicity we'll just treat it the same, (it would actually make the point even stronger, Im just lazy) Add it all together now, at full power Moira(155 HP/S) Lucio (50HP/S) Brig (46 HP/S) are barfing out and the comp can shit out 251 HP in a single second for their entire team. This is ignoring brigs 150 burst armor pack. Special shutouts to Ana here who is more popular on the ladder, but if you were to run Ana (135 HP/S plus 50% to the other healing sources) Moira Brig, you could hit heal rates of around 400 HP/S ignoring burst insta heals from Bionade (+100), Brig's armor pack (+150), or Ana's Ultimate (+300) tl;dr: You can quite literally heal Roadhog/D.Va or Hammond from 1hp to max in little over a second. This pushes the game to focus solely on burst damage, as anything else will just feed support ults and do nothing. This pushes tanks with high sustain/damage to the top because they are immune to the previous point.
That is right, thought I would not call it a support meta as it is too simple and I like to have some familiarity with the term, I would call it a sustain meta. Sustain, as it stand now and as you said, is way too plentiful in Overwatch. I always felt it was an extremely problematic thing even when the game was released (so without Ana) because a character like Winston then become completely useless because his tickle gun just serves no purpose anymore as most healing source in the game heal more than his tickle gun can damage enemy. Paladins has twice the healing output (and also every support are brigitte, because they're all as lethal and capable as a normal dps is), but handwave it because you have the item shop and you can buy anti-heals to lower it. Overwatch has none of that (memorable mechanic), and suffers the consequence. But what is the solution to that? Do we want slower healing output, and a bigger focus on getting health pack around the map? That would make the game more interesting for sure. Imagine if Ana gun healed a mere 30 hp/s, which would make her more of an out of combat healer than anything and would make the players play more cautiously, and the same apply to reinhardt, because no damage could get outhealed: Heals, in combat, would only serve as a way to tank 1 to 2 hit only. It feel really bad anyway to have a duel with someone and then mercy fly in and fully undo all the damage you've done. But then, if healer get slower healing, then that would mean shield tank would be mandatory (as if they aren't currently, I say), because they'd covers their team as long as it take for everyone to be healed behind their shield. I like Ana, because her way to heal is the most skillful out of them - We need more skillful support, alongside lower healing output in my opinion. And also, thinking back about the symmetra discussion, I am sad that in the end, just like Heroes of the Storm, the support role is a healbot role. There is no variety in support kit, merely a difference in healing output and how do you want to heal people, and it saddens me, because there's no such thing as utility support, offensive support and defensive support without heals. Every support, from now on, will have healing in some forms, and I think this is very unfortunate.
I would argue that the skillbased healing of Ana pomoting standing right next to a group of tanks anf hipfiring into them endlessly isn't actually skillfull
Of course it's not, seeing how tank make up 30% of your screen. It's only skillful when you're trying to hit DPS and non tank without a huge hitbox/frame. Exception for Zarya. Which ironically is why Reaper is not a counter against her. The generous tank hitbox work as well for Ana as it work for the enemy.
Would a general nerf across all healer's HPS change anything?
It'd make people upset.
This game is upsetting to play to begin with.
Reducing healing would actually require people to make an effort to not take damage instead of just standing in the choke for 5 minutes and expecting your healing to just carry you through. And seeing as people still haven't gotten the hang of advanced concepts like "picking a tank" or "changing hero" I think that's a big thing to ask of your community.
Remember the cycle: *DPS HERO* sucks Increase *DPS HERO*'s damage/abilities *DPS HERO* is now OP Buff healers Minor changes to the over-all game *DPS HERO* sucks again Repeat ad-nauseum.
Healing should not stack. Simple fix. Whatever source is doing the most HPS is what would be calculated, not the sum of multiple sources. That would solve most issues without directly nerfing a single character's effectiveness.
But that might make some hero's abilities null and void if say.. Mercy or Ana is healing them
Well, sure, if you're okay with the meta treating Brig/Lucio/Zen as if they're pure DPS and not specifically healers. Moira's effectively an 80 HP/s area of effect heal (75 HP/s orb), and although the biotic energy limits your healing somewhat, it's never been so much that Moira can't be a main healer. Then there's Ana and Mercy.
Would it change anything if snipers get their view punched from getting damaged when they're scoped in?
It would essentially make them useless as all you'd need is a dva to spray in their direction to completely invalidate them.
I think a better solution would be to cap the amount of HP/s any given hero can take.
Then it shouldn't be a fixed punch, the severity of the punch depends on how hard you've been hit. A soldier plinking at your chest and head would kick your view more than a reaper or d.va tickling you in vain at range.
That's what you do to invalidate Sombra hacking anyway.
Overwatch gets nine swell action figures — including a huge Rein.. https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/kL8F6-rZol1vHEkKavhdnovJYcY=/800x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13788825/OVERWATCH_ULTIMATES_SERIES_6_INCH_Figure_Assortment___Tracer_oop__4____pckging.jpg https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/rCXkyjwcxcGHG7B5OBLLyKoQZIc=/800x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13788822/OVERWATCH_ULTIMATES_SERIES_6_INCH_Figure_Assortment___Sombra_oop__3____pckging.jpg https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/j5Cir73-9VpFFIkPnsGG4_LTFXU=/800x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13788819/OVERWATCH_ULTIMATES_SERIES_6_INCH_Figure_Assortment___Lucio_oop__3____pckging.jpg https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/w-DmX6Y5EYQ_jNlrRp0-yxDlIIg=/800x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13788838/OVERWATCH_ULTIMATES_SERIES_6_INCH_Figure_Assortment___Blackwatch_Reyes_oop__3____pckging.jpg https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/9zh3Y7ZlnZnC_NDn3UxALsBxynA=/800x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13788882/OVERWATCH_ULTIMATES_SERIES_6_INCH_DUAL_PACK_Figure_Assortment___Soldier_76___Ana___oop__3____pckging.jpg https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/5sg7o0sTSCXiySbHtk6ulJxUf6g=/800x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13788883/OVERWATCH_ULTIMATES_SERIES_6_INCH_DUAL_PACK_Figure_Assortment___Phara___Mercy_oop__3____pckging.jpg https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/q8YnBO3LMrB2fvtbyG3HRss8RuA=/800x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13788925/OVERWATCH_ULTIMATES_SERIES_6_INCH_Figure___Reinhardt_in_pck.jpg I like the inclusion of the effect parts.
I like all of them excepted Gabriel Reyes cause the joint are way too visible.
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