Super Smash Bros. General v24: Joker Waiting Room, Please Take A Number - Games

He was using Robin as a counter example on the guy's claim of "when they try to make a more unique fire emblem character they still end up being boring". (Which in itself is still a dumb imo)

I would still have loved Black Knight as a new FE rep instead of Chrom. FE still has zero villain representation, and Black Knight is about as iconic as it gets for a series antagonist.

fuck plup

Nah, nowadays it'd probably be Grima.

If they do add Black Knight he should just be an Ike Echo, but with Roy's Up-B.

Couple of questions as long as I'm gathering every Spirit: In Inventory -> Spirit List, does the number there (out of 1303) show how many of the spirits you have obtained at least once, or is it a count of how many of the spirits you have at least one of at the current time? And in the Spirit Board, same question--what does the number there represent?

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/457/754/e0e.jpeg

As someone who grew up loving Fire Emblem I honestly agree with most of the complaints in regards to their representation. Their playstyles do seem very samey, although i don't think to the extent that some are saying. I would also like to point out that similarity in gameplay styles is pretty relative, which I think is why some people really seem to disagree over that point specifically. "Marth and Roy play very differently" is as true a statement as "Villager and Roy play very differently," but the differences being described are not quite the same scale. When comparing just the Fire emblem fighters to each other, it's easy to lay them side by side and point out each difference but in the context of the whole very diverse roster, they do look the same. I will say that I really mean the Marth-originated fighters, though. Ike, Corrin, and Robin don't feel similar to me, though I wish Corrin had continued Robin's path of FE fighters not using counters anymore. My gripes with Marth & co. are really a continuation of my feelings about sword users in general. As has been said several times before in these threads, there's only so many ways to swing a one-handed sword. Ike and Cloud shake things up a it by having swords that are enormous and Shulk's has an extendable blade (as well as all three often holding theirs two-handed) so I give those 3 a pass. But there's an additional 9-10 fighters (i'm on the fence about including meta knight) making very similar attacks. This is most noticeable on Marth/Roy/Lucina/Chrom, though, because swinging a sword is literally all that they do. The Links (who i also think there are too many permutations of) have their ranged tools, Robin, Cloud, and Corrin have magic stuff, etc., but for these four every single attack is a type of sword swipe with maybe a few stabs. Even with different properties, i's hard to deny that it doesn't look incredibly similar, and I think that's why some many people have their issues with them. My other issue is that 3 of them are from the same game. That just seems silly, although I didn't play that specific game so maybe I have some bias.

I believe Spirit List shows what you've obtained at least once and Spirit Board is what you currently have.

I think a good way to buff Marth and Roy without ruining their sweetspot playstyle would be to make both sweet and sourspot deal the exact same knockback, but sweet spot deals more damage percent. Compared to Chrom/Lucina, sourspots would do worse damage and sweetspots more (maybe more noticeably than they do now for both) but knockback would be the same between all four. Marth and Roy have less risk when nailing kills but still need to sweet spot throughout the match to deal enough damage quickly enough to get to a kill percent.

I think the very least they should do is make the sourspots deal more knockback on Marth's end. Landing Roy's sweetspots is by no means hard however; his weak sourspots are actually really useful for kill confirms at higher %s, like landing sourspot upair into fsmash.

"It's too fast for Marth's tipper mechanic to work when he was top 4 in both the slowest and fastest games in the series."

The main draw of sweetspots is early kills. That approach would make them either blatantly better than the Awakening echoes, or blatantly worse.

Marth's sourspot would launch his opponent at weird angles/distances that he has trouble following up on, while his sweetspot gives him predictable combo layups with high damage. Roy's sourspot would do much the same, but his sweetspot would cause his opponent to launch at a lower angle, more horizontally, making it more likely they'll land close and Roy can follow up.

they could also just make chrom and lucina's blades do slightly less overall damage if they're really overshadowing their counterparts

don't nerf, buff.

that's what makes melee look so good though. Yoshi especially looks so much fucking worse now than he did in Melee, they should've made every other game look like that

I've heard a good summary of Melee's art style once, which is that it's basically the closest we've got to PS1 era pre-rendered FMVs in playable form. Like how you look at a Square cutscene in '98 and go "wow, this is what graphics will look like in the future!" but it actually sort of happened. That plasticky look everybody has.

While the newer games are more visually appealing and reflect the source material better, Melee had a mysterious vibe to it that I really miss from the sequels. The weird-looking characters, the strange, Matrix-like menus, the otherworldly bonus stages, and the most unnerving and creepy Challenger Approaching screen in the series (fuck off Brawl with your boring ass siren that's been untouched for three games now) Stuff like Luigi just having pitched up Mario lines and the obviously reused voicelines from other games and media made it seem like the intention was to give off the feeling that all the characters are just programs trapped in a simulation. Melee's off-ness can't really be replicated in this day and age with how graphics have progressed and the focus on production quality is higher than ever, and while I love the newer games visually, Melee has a special place in my heart because of how weird and atmospheric it is.

This x 100. Melee looks cheap in the best possible way. It's a perfect combination of the GameCube's technical limitations and the edgy side of early 2000's design. https://www.ssbwiki.com/images/6/62/Racetothefinishm.png https://www.ssbwiki.com/images/6/6b/Classicmodeintro.png https://www.ssbwiki.com/images/5/57/SSBM_Multi_Man.png I LIVE for this dark aesthetic. If I were any good at graphic design, I'd try to infuse every project with as much Melee as possible because I love it so much. The menu design gave the game its own identity, while Brawl and onward were instead defined by the characters and series represented. Also, in regard to your "programs trapped in a simulation" line, I have to point out Melee's event match screen. The words "Subject Table" at the top make me imagine the list as a clipboard filled with scenarios that the simulation is meant to test. I really like that interpretation overall. https://www.ssbwiki.com/images/b/bb/EventMatchMelee.png

This is probably one of the most petty of nitpicking I could think of on my end, but considering that Link has both his modern and classic costumes, I can't help but wish that his classic costume had his SSBM grunts as recorded by Nobuyuki Hiyama I mean, i get that voice actors get older, but they tend to not age that badly.

I dunno. Mario soubds raspy and raw as hell in Ultimate.

Hell, Mario's voice clips in Ultimate are from a decade old game.

As much as the plasticky Melee aesthetic has its charm I have to admit some trophies look downright terrifying or disgusting Just look at this... thing https://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/pokemon/images/3/38/Eevee_trophy_SSBM.png/ It's not as ugly as Brawl's aesthetic tho

Remember when Donkey Kong was made of wood? https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/129/0da27fcb-a778-4cc4-a651-6056677ebea4/Donkey_Kong_Trophy_Melee[1].png

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39NnUqwnPr0

To throw my hat into the ring while I do think some of the models in Melee looks off (Yoshi in particular) the game itself looks very good especially for 2001. It's not like Brawl where everyone agrees ten years later that the aesthetic was a mistake. The trophies aren't going to hold up as well compared to the fighter models though for obvious reasons. And yeah that DK model looks like wood but it's meant to be an interpretation of his original appearance, like all the classic mode trophies are https://www.ssbwiki.com/images/8/8b/Donkey_Kong_Trophy_%28Smash%29.png He looks like this in the actual game.

Let's not forget the worst offender https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/1822/f5bbb213-3fdb-499d-ac57-185a2fa883c6/image.png

I wish Ice Climbers had a buff exclusive to Popo just called "Uphill Battle" When Nana eventually kills herself he just gets a boost to launch power and a very, very slight damage increase. I want to love the character but Nana just keeps murdering herself or getting killed off nothing just snapping the gimmick in half out the gate. With this sopo at least has some kind of trade off for losing half his damage and not being able to recover anymore.

Still very disappointed that Daisy's final smash wasn't her firing a laser from her third eye.