Super Smash Bros. General v24: Joker Waiting Room, Please Take A Number - Games

That it used to. And it doesn't help that, as stated previously, Melee's scene is struggling with an image problem right now. Look at this from a heavily corporate-funded event's perspective, and the potential for furthering controversy is clear. Melee has always been a controversial scene, it's just now that actual PR-level problems are surfacing, to an extent sponsors are getting uncomfortable.

What PR level problems exactly

The usual stigma of the types of people who play isn't helping ("unwashed masses" comment), but player tantrums (in-venue and post-event in hotels), drop-outs for questionable reasons, unprofessional behavior on camera/microphone, a somewhat unfriendly community at the entry skill level (which is where onlookers go who see the game and are interested in trying it too, particularly unfriendly to women), and especially lately, the big ruleset changes that have always sparked extremely hostile sentiment (or outright user-directed flaming) to flood the chats of the streams where these sponsors advertise.

Melee's community is a double-edged sword. Its pretty toxic on the outside but incredibly passionate on the inside. It's self fufilling, since only passionate fans put up with the negatives to enjoy the positives, but in turn that can make the obnoxious shitlords you see ruining other stuff since it can become insufferably echo-chambering. No other game is quite like Melee. Nothing sates that niche that playing Melee has created in me. PM, Slap City and Lethal League all come close, but don't have the communities to support themselves.

Melee's Dead long live Ultimate

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSNLKQvImIk This is a great video to document as to why people hate melee players

No way I never would have seen that coming. Smash 4 is fucking dead you guys.

It'd be nice if they ported Melee over to something that didn't rely on CRTs. I mean they thought countless console Zelda ports were a good idea. I'd like to play Melee on the go. I have more fun in no item Melees on dumb maps than I do in any other Smash game; it's fun just ricocheting people off of Tingle or temple or sliding back and forth on the spot as Luigi.

Dumpster fire of a fanbase aside, I've always strongly disliked the "stop having fun with Melee" thing. Like people get mad at the fact that people continue to play and enjoy Melee en-masse instead of ditching it forever like most fighting games. Some people just seem straight up angry that people continue to play it based on that alone. Wrap it in a layer of elitism or refusal to move on if you want, I don't know what the problem is with preferring a particular game in a series that has no real replacement.

There's a myriad of valid reasons to dislike Melee players, but the situation this video focuses on is blown way out of proportion. Not being satisfied with equipment you brought to an event where you are required to bring your own equipment is a valid reason to exit a tournament. Their examples of people bringing their own sticks and not wanting to play with anything else makes sense. People practice thousands of hours with their own equipment which they expect to use at the highest level of play for potentially a shitload of money. I agree that in an ideal world all controls are standardized so everyone is on a perfectly even ground, but as long as people can build their own boxes and play with their own controllers, this is not something that is unreasonable.

Remember hearing that it would have input lag due to how modern tvs work. A perfect 1:1 port is impossible.

Now's the perfect time for Nintendo to announce... https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/1822/62cbbcfa-d4d8-42af-8f05-7679ac6d34e2/explosion_png_by_dbszabo1_d3hmssu-fullview.png

Current Dolphin emulation is lagless IIRC. It can be done (perhaps not on Switch), but I have no doubt purists would still choose the purple cube. You can play high level melee without a broken controller. The vast majority of top players play with whatever controller they've used for a long time and broken in for their own use. Cases like Amarda and Westballz and certainly far from the norm. Until it can be garunteed every controller will act exactly the same, this cannot be considered cheating. Every controller is going to be different in someway, either from production or from normal use. If the standard tournaments set is "Use a unmodified Gamecube controller" and not "Use a unmodified Gamecube controller that can and cannot perform these actions:...", there is no cheating going on.

Alright, next time I play Ultimate against you, I'll make sure to give you my controller that doesn't have working L or R triggers. It's just different from normal use, brah, don't worry about it. Also if you re-assign your controls the controller is going up somewhere unpleasant

as long as i can sound the control stick and close my anus around cstick i'll take you to hell and back

No Melee also means no grief by the crewmen setting up and renting CRTs and the necessary conversion setups. This will be the first EVO in 7 years where all mainstage games use HD monitors and only the third they've had without CRTs in their over-20-year history.

Leffen actually thinks EVO will come crawling back to melee next year. Lmao what is wrong with that man.

He's a giant child, just like his hatecrush that he can't shut up about, Hungrybox. Granted, the dude has literally attested to playing as much as 6 hours every day, so to him Smash probably is the world to an almost literal degree.

Melee pulls in a lot of viewers. The stats from EVO 2018 (after removing the Ninja host from SFV) show that Melee was the second most watched, being in a fairly early slot as well it's really good.

It's pretty clearly a "we don't want melee here" thing more than a viewer numbers thing. It's not a bad thing given that Melee has lots of majors and supermajors each year, and it makes way for UNIEST which is shocking to be on the main stage given that it isn't a corporate pick.

I'm pretty sure at Genesis 6 Melee had higher main stream peak viewers than ultimate. We can already play Melee on things which aren't CRTs with no extra discernable lag. CRTs are not lagless. We just choose not too (I'm currently trying to convert my scene to HDMI melee as moving CRTs kills me). I think Melee not being included at EVO is sad, but we had 5 years there as their second most popular game on stream. We don't have the backing of Nintendo to fund our position, so I get it why games with a quarter of the viewers but get device support would get their EVO spot. They deserve it. But melee will still be played next year, with the same number of viewers. Its truly up to Nintendo and EVO if they want to capitalise on that.

Mr. Wizard openly fucking hates Melee, I'll be *floored* if it ever comes back.

I think Melee has outgrown EVO and EVO has outgrown Melee. I don't think it adds as much to the community as it used to. EVO contributed a lot to the "melee is toxic" idea people have in their head as well. It isn't true, and it's getting tired as all fuck now.

I remember the whole #OneUnit fundraiser team-up between the Brawl and Melee camps to get Melee into EVO 2013 in the first place. Bear in mind, Melee was fizzling out around then while Brawl was still going reasonably strong even in comp - Brawl at Apex 2012 had 400 entrants, the largest Smash tournament ever at the time - so this was a huge shot in the arm for Melee. If I remember correctly, either Melee or Brawl would've been eligible to fight Skullgirls for the eighth slot but both camps agreed that Melee players were more into comp than Brawl players, so they pooled their resources towards Melee as the contender. I still wonder how things would've turned out had Skullgirls won the fundraiser; Smash's comp scene may have never gotten bigger than that. That was Summer 2013, right around E3, so that was also around when Smash 4 got revealed, too.

Too bad that Melee's gone, but I'd rather watch Ultimate anyway lmfao

There's a lot for people to unpack to be honest. There's a reason that those stereotypes about melee players that happened over the years happened.

Many of which even date back to that original Melee era of the early 2000s and GameFAQs message boards. Just back then it wasn't "Melee players", it was different camps within the Melee playerbase since it was the latest game at the time.

Oh I'm not denying that Melee players have that stereotype for a reason, they're absolutely toxic in almost any scenario that revolves around another smash game. I'm just saying that meeting toxicity with toxicity isn't the best thing to do

This is a stupid take. So many Melee players are playing Ultimate, loads played Smash 4 fine. In our local scene the crossover has been pretty good between the camps and there has never been toxicity issue, and I would say that is the same for every local scene in the UK. You're lumping people together and saying "you're toxic" then wondering why people get annoyed. No shit. EVO isn't done "for exposure", it meant a lot to Melee players on a personal, competitive and spectator level. That has been lost, and I don't think Melee necessarily deserved it every year but it's still something we had which is now gone.

Sorry Icemanz, but when I, a literal nobody got harassed online by the melee community for liking Smash 4 more and had people try to tell me I'm wrong I'm gonna call that community toxic. When I read how False and other top players got harassed I'm gonna call it toxic. Whenever melee so much as had to share the spotlight with another smash game and people boo and hiss and shit all over the other game guess what its gonna get called. Melee not at EVO? Melee fans are now calling EVO complete garbage and "only shilled games allowed I see" which, fuckers, look at Samsho or UNIST and shut up. "We're too good for EVO anyway. EVO will beg us to be back next year they can't live without us." typed post are already cropping up- not just from Leffen. The Melee community has some insane complex and nothing you can say will ever change that dude. I'm sure you and your friends that play together might be super cool but by-in-large it's dire and I'm glad it's gone.