Super Smash Bros. General v26 - 🃏 THE SHOW'S OVER 🃏
985 replies, posted
Or it could be that casual rules are what many people find fun even if you don't see how?
I don't really watch tournaments, but I did catch some of the Smash 4 Invitational back in the day and I remember it having some cool moments. In particular, when that one Mega Man player got the Smash Ball and caught everyone else with his Final Smash. D1 went ballistic on the mic when it happened, and the crowd voting thing they did after every match was just a sea of blue. And then people kept screwing with Geoff Keighley by holding up Mega Man signs during voting for other matches afterwards, that was funny.
Where did I say people aren't allowed to enjoy casual play
Your clear disdain for everything you consider as "casual" in that comment? "These casual stages aren't fun at all." "Four-player time matches with items are dumb." "Those tournaments were casual and they were garbage."
Like, yeah, there are certain things even I won't defend like 75m or the Beetle item, but you're lumping it all together and dismissing it wholehand as if it's beneath you.
X Today at 10:25 PM
lmao nintendo still cant sanitize shit
arbitrary system shit is possible again thanks to stage builder
when you save a replay on a custom stage it saves the stage in the replay too
find the replay file and you can use an editor to move things out of bounds
if your replay overloads the game somehow then weird shit can happen to your switch depending on whats out of bounds and where
X Today at 10:30 PM
like turning on airplane mode or deleting random pictures
or just crashing your switch usually lol
cannons seem to be bestat fucking with settings
increase their x pos by atleast 100 and see what happens
cannon at x 237 y 22 make the switch think it isnt docked anymore jfc
Copypaste from discord server, name redacted. I really home this isn't true, what the fuck.
Oh dear, I hope that gets patched. It'd be best if they just saved a copy of the stage as it was when played within the replay, even if that increases the size of replays with custom stages.
Otherwise I can see this becoming an unmitigated disaster akin to the Smash Stack.
Sorry, I forgot the cardinal rule of the internet: If I don't end every sentence with "in my opinion", you'll be forced to think i'm stating an abject fact, and not, you know, my opinion.
You can think casual play with items on is fine! No skin off my nose. I mean, hell, I've played at tourneys, but I still try and vouch for time mode when playing casually with friends because nobody has to sit out or focus the best player to avoid losing. My god damn favorite mode in Melee is points mode. Doesn't make maps like Palutena's temple or playing with final smashes on any more fun (in my opinion).
I think what Sakurai wants is less of a tournament and more of an event. Like, a cool event were people of all skill levels can play Smash with items and wackiness, have a fun time while people enjoy the zany action, and maybe win a trophy or something. Not an esports thing where raw skill is being shown and the winner is the most skilled, since that naturally will exclude only the most competitive and dedicated people.
Both can definitely exist, but I really think what he's trying to say is lost in translation.
Fair enough.
Watch that video again, it was one person that ended up in the final smash, and more importantly, that person purposely jumped into it so that the people could have a hype moment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIIlIM9HlpQ
The problem ultimately, no pun intended, is that Smash casual play has become less and less competitive-friendly as the series has progressed. That's not on the players to deal with, that's an issue with the game design and fairness being at odds with each other. Even Mario Kart's items are far more balanced by comparison, which is why competitive Mario Kart chooses to use items. I used to enjoy casual play with items, but SSB4 and SSBU took items too far and just made them ridiculously overpowered, and made stages too chaotic for their own good. Brawl nailed stage design, aside from the two new DK stages being . . . . what they were.
EVO 2008 had Brawl with items on. Know what happened? The tournament was won by a literal nobody who didn't care about the game, didn't bother with the scene again and the series was ejected from EVO for having an embarrassing tournament.
If you want tournaments with items on and more stages, you need to deal with how items have gotten completely bonkers in SSB4 and SSBU and that walkoffs and stage bosses are simply aggravating as hell to fight in their current form (especially the Yellow Devil). Melee started out with tournaments that had items on. They had to stop because RNG exploding containers made it impossible to remove terribly-unavoidable scenarios.
Brawlhalla shows how you can have item-based competitive play, but Smash 4 and Smash Ultimate just aren't built for that, in fact, their items are obnoxious enough that I find casuals generally will turn items off due to being overbearing when they were tolerant of all items being on in the first 3 games.
The game series also has a massive issue with designing large stages and walkoffs because it never tries to accommodate for how exploitable the former is for fast characters and the latter is for everyone. This is partially why Smash has ridiculous levels of camping.
they cant though
you either choose all, battlefield, or final destination - you cant select specific maps
Ah, I guess my memory was foggy of that event.
I'll agree that the items post-Brawl have started to veer on the ridiculous side, although it was mostly confined to the Smash 4 debuts. The worst among them were the Beetle, Boss Galaga, Special Flag, and Gust Bellows - the last one of which has thankfully been toned down in Ultimate. On the other hand, Ultimate ratcheted up the power of many Assist Trophies and Poké Balls to absurd levels, to the point that I often find myself turning them off and wishing we could switch off individual summons. That being said, both games still had their fair share of fun new additions, Ultimate especially. I could name favorites, but the list of new items in each is actually bigger than I thought so I won't bore everyone. Maybe I'll make a little graphic later of what items debuted where and we can discuss 'em that way.
Stages... Yeah, I agree they got pretty ridiculous as well, at least in Smash 4 Wii U (though there were some fun gimmick stages like Jungle Hijinxs and GCO, the latter of which I'll defend until my tongue bleeds). Smash 4 3DS was more toned-down due to the smaller screen and lower processing power, and as a result I think a lot of its stages are looked upon pretty fondly, actually. Ultimate had very few new stage debuts: Dracula's Castle, Great Plateau Tower, Moray Towers, and New Donk City Hall, along with Mementos with CP1. None of those really stick out as bad to me. Moray Towers is a little clunky, but that's about it.
I'll agree, in that I think the new ones are all well-made in Ultimate, but that by virtue of bringing back a lot of the messier Melee, Brawl and SSB4 stages like Venom, 75M, Palutena's Temple, New Pork City, Gaur Plains and Paper Mario (*cough* Bowser section *cough*), Ultimate still has a chaotic stage list, plus they inexplicably chose Pac-Land over Pac-Maze, gimmick or otherwise. That being said, it's obviously a fantastic list.
I still say they should split the stages into tabs by debut game. It would make things so much more navigable.
https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/198768/1c7105ac-3b8b-47d8-8842-474b6e54376f/stagepages.png
https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/198768/2706e8b2-f34f-4ad1-a39b-c5501edbfc90/stagepagessm4sh.png
https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/198768/4c6470f5-abd8-4979-b005-e994f12c94ac/stagepagesbrawl.png
https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/198768/71332e76-3b44-4ec1-b6b7-f2decc7ed665/stagepagesmelee.png
https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/198768/e078e58d-4914-4c55-ab88-99ea1c4117b6/stagepagesssb64.png
On that note, I'm surprised just how close the Ultimate page in my mock-up came to what would become the actual custom stages page:
https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/198768/12494a12-079c-49f2-abc3-8d404a773aaa/image.png
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/283034855044956160
No rest for you, slave
Just wanted to share something, Combo Breaker is currently running for Ultimate and in Top 8 on Winner's Finals is a Game and Watch who just beat ESAM (high level Pikachu player)
You can watch it here:
https://www.twitch.tv/vgbootcamp
I don't want to see this used maliciously, but console exploitation fills me with a sense of justice.
G&W currently x-0 in Grand Finals.
Top player Tier Lists currently on suicide watch.
A Game and Watch just beat a Megaman to win the grand finals.
Also the commentators were a mixed bag. They went from making stupid jokes about Michael Jordan and just random tangents to saying really funny shit like something about Megaman being a big boy because he eats Wheaties.
I'm legitimately wondering how the smash community main take away of all of this, is "welp no Season 2"
Honestly I'm so sick of this I'm actually going to stop playing the game if this isn't patched
https://twitter.com/HelixSnake/status/1133122396276191232
I know you could say "just airdodge!" but with wifi it's not always easy to predict where I'm going to end up in time to know to airdodge instead of up+B. This affects Palutena and Mewtwo the most.
Don't play on wifi?
teleport recoveries are blatantly the best recoveries in the game so im not too fussed that they have some rusty elements to them
Doesn't Inkling still grab the ledge from the lowest point of any fighter, though?
And have the objective best dash dance in the game, insane aerial pressure, and a guaranteed kill setup?
Yes
Smash should have item placeholders before they spawn, so players can fight for stage control before the item actually spawns, and "charge up an attack but a bob-omb spawned in front of you last second" shit wouldn't happen. Seeing what would spawn ahead of time would add strategic depth, as if it's a good item you may want to maneuver over and prevent others from being near it. Maybe give 5-10 seconds of a placeholder before the item actually spawns.
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