Super Smash Bros. General v26 - 🃏 THE SHOW'S OVER 🃏 - Games

Having all eight players suddenly decide to drop to the bottom of Temple and watch as their characters are ricocheted in a million different directions because of the slopes and geometry is always fun.

Temple is what 8-player maps should be. Map that is, at most, twice the size of a regular stage, with distinct but small areas for fighting. Every stage designed in Sm4sh explicitly for 8-player smash is godawful (except Big Battlefield). I don't think there's a single one anybody would be okay with playing in 8-player smash. Palutena's temple feels like it's so big it needs 16 player smash, Great Cave Offensive is a non-Smash map, Mario Galaxy is just a gimmick walk-off with literally nothing beyond it, Pac-land is a bad stage, Gaur Plain isn't... awful... but it's just too vertical. Temple, meanwhile, is perfect for 8-person smash.

Before Simon was announced, I was hoping for the Castlevania stage to be a Temple-like map with all the levels from the first game recreated as smaller areas that all linked together, it would've been pretty cool.

Y'see, I gotta disagree with the hate for Great Cave Offensive in particular. Palutena's Temple is indeed way too large to fight on (though I won't say the same for Hyrule Temple, which has always been just a sheer joy). And PAC-LAND is just an awful stage in any case, for far more reasons than size. I dunno why someone said Spear Pillar needs more than four players, though, considering it's been around since Brawl and isn't all that big. But in Great Cave Offensive, while 3-to-4-player matches indeed make the stage feel too big for the amount of people, counterintuitively enough, it actually works very well for one-on-ones. Because when it's just two players, the camera is only as zoomed out as it needs to be and the danger zones actually allow for a fight that naturally flows and travels all around the stage without having to wait for huge damage percentages to score KOs. Danger zones are something that I really wish would be retroactively added to other big stages even as a mere option, because they're a great solution to the large stage problem (I just wish you could customize their KO threshold to mix things up every now and then). That being said, I wish the camera would stop zooming out for certain items, because that just reintroduces the camera problem from when you have more than two players but not enough to fill the stage. Particularly in Ultimate where it seems more eager to do so than Smash 4 was. Actually, Ultimate in general seems to just have its camera pulled back further at all times and it can makes readability a pain. You take the same situation on the same stage in Smash 4 Wii U and Ultimate, and everything just seems too small in Ultimate. You'd think the new rim-lighting effect in Ultimate's engine would help, but everything's still too small.

GCO feels like a SSE stage. Of course you'd like it.

Y'know, I'm not sure that that's it. SSE has more in common with Smash Run than GCO. All of them involve fighting throughout a large complex instead of a singular stage with outer KO boundaries. But SSE and Smash Run have you trying to get to specific places to accomplish objectives and the KO condition comes from being launched so far that the deliberately-limited screen scroll can't keep up; it's basically a traditional KO boundary that sluggishly moves around you within a larger stage. Whereas GCO the action isn't often heading towards any particular destination so much as it is just fluidly moving throughout the map, and the KO zones are fixed with their condition based on damage rather than being launched too fiercely for the screen to keep up. You can be launched very far and still survive in GCO so long as you don't hit a danger zone, whereas in the others flying fast and far enough from where you're initially hit is what causes the KO. It's a different feel.

I recently played on Palutena's Temple with hazards off and didn't mind it too much. Without the spikes or the destructible bridge, it feels as if you have a bit more control over what happens to you. Granted, that was still only one match for variety out of the hundreds I play on other stages.

Every now and then I read about the things that could have made it into Melee but didn't I really want to see the timeline where Kojima didn't ask Sakurai to include Snake too late into development, they had time to finish the second Ice Climber stage and the Fire Emblem stage as planned, and Wario was the new Mario clone instead of Dr. Mario.

Being honest, Palutena's temple and GCO are fine, if all participants agree to always try to fight somebody at all times. What starts out as a big brawl near the center quickly turns into a few 1v1s all going in separate directions through the map, before someone is eliminated and the victor has to overcome a brief platforming challenge to rejoin the fray, or team up with someone who's clearly losing their own fight to even the odds. It can lead to dynamic, interesting stories forming, like someone playing DK constantly trying to carry people away to a part of the map he can exploit, but the rest of the players eventually wise up and form a shaky alliance against him, before inevitably betraying eachother for laughs.

GCO is fine because you can always kill someone on lava. Palutena's Temple is absolute horseshit for 1v1s (and remember, most FFAs become a 1v1 in the end) because killing an opponent takes forever, and you have to have a good kill option for whatever region you're in or you're fucked. Don't have a good kill off the side option? You're fucked if you're in the middle left or middle right of the stage, or in a cave of life. Don't have a good spike and the opponent does? Then they're naturally going to gravitate towards areas of the stage where they have a giant advantage, and there's fuck all you can do about it. And of course, everyone at high percent is going to go to the cave of life, where it is 3 times as hard to kill someone than Hyrule Temple's. And god forbid that you end in a 1v1 where one person is a stock ahead or feels like pressing their luck with sudden death, because they're just going to run away and time you out, on the easiest stage to do so. Palutena's Temple might be tied with Icicle Mountain for the worst stage in the series. Hell, it might surpass it.

I'd still say Palutena's Temple is better than PAC-LAND. 75m is a contender for the absolute worst, too, especially after enduring that damn Pauline fight...

yeah 75m sucks. boring stage theme, and awful layout.

I read somewhere that Ganondorf was added at the absolute last minute and only because his demo model was similar enough to Captain Falcon, and I wonder sometimes if they at all considered using Snake for Captain Falcon's clone. There's an alternate universe probably where Ganonorf has a completely unique move set based on his home series and Snake has a more CQC-oriented fight style that is gradually de-cloned every game

https://youtu.be/VIfq26HnFMA

Apparently they didn't completely nerf Snake's ass from Brawl.

Snake's ass was never nerfed, his thighs are just dummy thick now so the ass seems less prominent.

Holy shit. I'm a few months late no doubt, but i just remembered part of why smash ultimate feels so empty is because there are no event matches. You could say that technically the spirit stuff is event matches, but it doesn"t have nearly the same feel, and i really miss melee's and brawl's event matches. There was something really cute about referencing Super Mario 128 or the other basic but really charming events in melee specifically, like protecting a passive AI peach from a bowser cpu that guns for her.

Some of the Spirits feel kind of like event matches, but there's just so many unique ones in the previous entries (like breaking down the whole wrecking crew building or preventing G&W from landing on that spaceship stage in Smash 4) that it still feels underwhelming. Some Spirit fights are really nice though, especially if you know what it's referencing.

Here is hoping we get Stadium in a patch. I miss Melee events.

I'd kind of like something of a mix between SSE and Smash Run. SSE's linearity and perhaps going from 2 to 4 player co op. Smash Run's sense of escalation and variation. Plus you could have Kirby-esque ai companions when there's less than 4 players. Though I'm mainly into the mixing of areas and enemies from varying series since that's what I enjoyed the most of Melee's Adventure, SSE, and Smash Run.

So do you guys think we'll get a character announcement before E3? Timingwise I'd feel like an announcement before E3 and another one during would work the best, although I'm afraid we'll get nothing until the E3 direct.

Isn't the spirit battle for Wedding Bowser almost exactly that same fight? It is a bummer that almost all of the spirit fights come down to defeating the enemy fighter though, rather than something to do with the stage elements like the wrecking crew one or defending an item like that one with the Yoshi egg. Other than that they literally are just event matches with just as much focus on referencing specific moments and characters, even if the sheer number of them makes each one seem less special.

I'm betting there will be two characters announced at E3. One that would come out during the Summer, and one that would come out during the Fall.

spirit mode is less about creating scenarios as much as its about creating specific characters it doesn't have things like "you are mario trying to save peach from bowser"

Pauline Spirit

how the fuck does this game feel empty

All the content missing from it that was in the other games for the Spirits mode Are we really gonna start another one of those "well yeah but the game is still good so you aren't allowed to be bummed and reminisce about things like event matches" discussions? Because I've been a clear nostalgia freak for Melee and Brawl since I started posting in the thread. Ultimate is an incredibly solid game and I'm not gonna say it isn't bursting at the seams with content, but as somebody who doesn't have friends to invite over to play anymore, outside of online, there isn't much pulling me back like there was for Melee and Brawl. 4 Wii had the same problem, but 4 DS had Smash Run which was stellar and more than enough.

Ultimate is lacking in entertaining singleplayer content. All the Classic stuff is really cool, but that's about it. Certainly a step up from WiiU but still pales in comparison to Melee and Brawl.

Yep, and even then, while I can appreciate all the little nods to other stuff in the Class content, there's no denying that the bosses are all super boring, super generic gameplay-wise, and the fact that there's only like 5 bosses and they're repeated a bunch takes a lot of charm out of them.

people tend to think that just because WOL is stupidly bloated that means the game is suddenly enriched with content even though ultimate launched with like at least 4 less gamemodes from the previous game (break the target, homerun contest, coin battles, stage builder) considering we got stage builder back (and better than ever) hopefully this means we will get everything back and they will receive the same treatment.