A suggestiong to make the Razorback more useful. . . - Games

Razorback is completely useless in my opinion, Any spy worth his salt is just going to bust out the revolver and shoot that sniper dead before he can even react, save for the few very quick witted snipers that can pull out ONE shot before you die, lest it be a zoomed full power or huntsman. I just think it's stupid to be honest, most snipers just need to learn to listen to their surroundings for the spy's footsteps. (Granted, this does take good quality speakers or total silence on crappier ones) But still.... I always thought that the Targe is the Razorback we never had, like I was thinkin' the RB should be able to lessen attacks from 180 degrees behind him. That'd be nice. That would actually make the Razorback a tactical choice, and make Hunt/Razor snipers deadly.

To be honest, when it was first introduced, I was hoping you could use it in conjunction with the kukri, kind of like how the Chargin' Targe and the Eyelander work now.

Razorback should be invisible so that spies won't avoid backstabbing the Snipers. Make sense since the current version deter all spies to use Ambassador. =\

[QUOTE=powerchu;19740970]Razorback should be invisible so that spies won't avoid backstabbing the Snipers. Make sense since the current version deter all spies to use Ambassador. =\[/QUOTE] That's actually not that bad of an idea. Maybe keep it visible to teammates but make it invisible to enemies. I wouldn't want the model to just disappear forever...

Actually, i was thinking more of a "flashing" razorback. Or a razorback that becomes visible when the spy is close. It could work like this. At 2 heavies distance, spy can't see anything on the Sniper back. Nearer, the spy have to wait for 4 seconds(tendative) for the razorback to appear. If the Sniper did not notice the spy watching him, he should die horribly. [editline]09:06PM[/editline] This means the spy cannot just charge to the Sniper to backstab, or use the Amby for sniping.

[QUOTE=HAKKAR!!!;19740114]I agree with other people in this thread, it should make a really loud alarm noise.[/QUOTE] Maybe particles too?

[QUOTE=powerchu;19741116]It could work like this. At 2 heavies distance, spy can't see anything on the Sniper back. Nearer, the spy have to wait for 4 seconds(tendative) for the razorback to appear. [/QUOTE] It's a shield with a car battery taped to it, not a cloaking device.

[QUOTE=MurphyS;19742703]It's a shield with a car battery taped to it, not a cloaking device.[/QUOTE] It just makes you invisible, it doesn't have any visible (lol) mechanism that stops you from firing your revolver or swinging your knife while you're invisible. They're just boxing gloves, not strange magical devices that cause heavier injuries after multiple kills. It's just a single-shot rifle with a scope, not some electrically-charged railgun that has to charge up to do damage. It's just a tiny little shield, not nearly large enough to have any stopping power against explosions or fire. Do you really want me to keep going?

Snipers with razorback generally in my opinion are bad, since most of the time they can't watch their own back and even when they are sniping they don't notice their razorback breaking. Personally i use the Default watch and the Ambassador and i barely use my ambassador just because its more fun with just a knife.

Any spy with any ounce of intelligence will just shoot the fuck out of you from point blank, 3 shots tops and you're dead before you unscope.

[QUOTE=Fr3ddi3;19743669]Any spy with any ounce of intelligence will just shoot the fuck out of you from point blank, 3 shots tops and you're dead before you unscope.[/QUOTE] Yes I think there are.

This is a stupid idea. I always backstab Razorbacks and then come back and revolver the Sniper to show them how useless it is. DON'T TAKE THAT AWAY FROM ME.

I use it on Gold Rush when pushing the cart in conjunction with the Huntsman. A Spy would have to be mad to run up into a group of enemies just to revolver the Sniper to death. It also discourages Spies from attacking anyone near the cart because he might accidentally hit the Razorback. So even if it's only a back stab shield for me, it helps the group as a whole. I've done this many times to success. You people need to learn how to stop jumping on the bandwagon.

[QUOTE=SGTNAPALM;19748565]I use it on Gold Rush when pushing the cart in conjunction with the Huntsman. A Spy would have to be mad to run up into a group of enemies just to revolver the Sniper to death. It also discourages Spies from attacking anyone near the cart because he might accidentally hit the Razorback. So even if it's only a back stab shield for me, it helps the group as a whole. I've done this many times to success. You people need to learn how to stop jumping on the bandwagon.[/QUOTE] I don't play sniper enough to have a good opinion on this, but I might try that.

I only find it useful for Gold Rush/Payload maps when on offense.

I think it should have some damage resistance at least. It is a shield after all.

how about it drains cloak

[QUOTE=fakedout;19750518]how about it drains cloak[/QUOTE] That would actually be pretty cool. This way a Spy can't just cloak and run away. Added incentive to avoid it.

would be better if it just stunned the spy for 5 seconds (not being able to move (just swaying around)) and/or remove the knife.

[QUOTE=omfgnex;19729976]Really? Since I've had the razorback, I've never been backstabbed properly. When I hear it break, I go back to spawn and get a new one[/QUOTE] And what of Arena? It's totally worthless.

[QUOTE=ghosevil;19751720]And what of Arena? It's totally worthless.[/QUOTE] Then don't use it in arena. All weapons have different situations. The unlocks aren't just upgrades.

[QUOTE=Pie_Tony;19729742]I think it should just reduce the damage the sniper takes, by say 10% or something. Considering you're giving up your secondary I think that's fair.[/QUOTE] it's a trap for noobs. only retards use the razorback. honestly any spy who isn't a fuckwit can just as easily swap to his revolver and destroy you. without the SMG you have to either chase down the spy and melee him, or somehow miraculously kill him in close quarters with the sniper rifle. you're still an easy target for spies, all the razorback does is confuse the spies who never use the revolver (aka the spies who are terrible). the added backstab protection is useless in 99% of situations, so really all you're doing is slowing yourself down and making yourself an easy target for ambassador shots. If you're using the razorback with the bow then you're an even bigger moron.

[QUOTE=Rambo_9;19753000]it's a trap for noobs. only retards use the razorback. [b]I beg to differ.[/b] Imagine you are using the huntsman and you are pushing the cart with your team. honestly any spy who isn't a fuckwit can just as easily swap to his revolver and destroy you.[b]What Spy is [U]stupid[/U] enough to uncloak in the middle of your teammates and start shooting you? He would be destroyed by the several Heavies, Soldiers, and Pyros.[/b] without the SMG you have to either chase down the spy and melee him, or somehow miraculously kill him in close quarters with the sniper rifle.[b]That is what your team is for.[/b] you're still an easy target for spies, all the razorback does is confuse the spies who never use the revolver (aka the spies who are terrible).[b]You're a difficult target because 1 of two things could happen: The Spy kills your team in a chain stab and in turn gets killed by you or is forced to retreat, or the Spy goes after you only and gets killed by your team. Guess what? at the end of both scenarios you're still alive.[/b] Bolded. If you're using the razorback with the bow then you're an even bigger moron.[b]Explain.[/b] all it does is make you easier to chase down and kill, the added backstab protection is useless in 99% of situations.[b]If a Spy is so good as to kill your entire team, he's probably going to kill you too, SMG or not.[/b][/QUOTE] You use it in groups [U]with your team[/U]. Listen, I know how desperately you guys want the Razorback to be useless, but you guys just lack the ability to read into new ideas. It's like the concept of building new strategies scares you guys, grow up. Of course it's not going to work with the traditional play style. That's incorrect thinking. It does it's purpose and it does it very well. Stop being morons and think for a bit.

if you're a sniper standing in a group of enemies with your gayz0rback, then the spy will almost definitely have a better/easier target to chase than you (ie. a heavy or a medic). why would a spy uncloak in a group of enemies just to shoot you anyhow? you're just making up a stupid scenario to justify using a shit unlock. in situations where you're off on your own, camping on a ledge somewhere, it's painfully easy for a spy to uncloak behind you while you're busy and pull off 2 or 3 shots on you before you know what's happening. if he somehow manages to fuck up and not kill you with his revolver, he still can just reload and run away while potshotting you before you can turn around and kill him with your kukri/sniper. the gayz0rbacka also makes you run slower which only makes it easier for the spy. the best alternative weapon for a sniper using the rifle is the SMG, since it gives you a genuine chance to defend yourself in situations where using the kukri/sniper is impractical.

First of all, stop rating yourself agree. I find it hard to believe that someone stalks you and rates you agree the second you make posts. Second of all, exactly. The Spy WOULD have a better target, but he can't easily kill you any more. So what if he fails? What you find him? He dies. You say that I'm making up the situation. That's because I am. It never happens. In a group a Spy would never single you out first, but you can single him out. That's the effectiveness of it: The Spy will always have one enemy that he can't do anything about. And if you're good, you will be able to dispose of him before he does any damage to your team. When your good enough, you can effectively Spy-proof your push. Also, your use of the word 'gayz0rback' makes it hard for me to take you seriously. In situations where I'm off own my own... [B][U]What the fuck did I just say about not using the correct mindset Jesus Christ you proved my point for me.[/U][/B] You don't use the Razorback like that. In those cases you use the SMG. If you use the Razorback like that then you are a moron. That's why you [U]use situational weapons in the correct situations.[/U]

just because you're using the gayz0rback, doesn't make you impossible for a spy to kill. all he has to do is get about 10 feet in front of you and strafe back and forth while unloading his revolver into your face. it only makes it harder for a spy to kill you in a group, which in most cases would be a stupid idea anyhow. spies should only target snipers when they are alone since they aren't really an important backstab target. there really aren't many situations where the gayz0rback is more useful than the SMG or even jarate. it's a mild inconvenience for good spies. even if they removed the movement speed nerf, it would still be a piece of shit scrub unlock.

You are completely missing my point, and you keep running miles away from my point. I see no reason to continue with this talk if you insist on missing my point each time.

[QUOTE=SGTNAPALM;19753557]You use it in groups [U]with your team[/U]. Listen, I know how desperately you guys want the Razorback to be useless, but you guys just lack the ability to read into new ideas. It's like the concept of building new strategies scares you guys, grow up. Of course it's not going to work with the traditional play style. That's incorrect thinking. It does it's purpose and it does it very well. Stop being morons and think for a bit.[/QUOTE] No, it's not as great as you say. Let's see the Sniper vs. Spy update page. The sniper must have killed the spy with a non scoped shot or with the Kukri. Obviously, the Spy won't always be on the range of the Kukri, and noscopes do around 50 damage only. Razorback snipers aren't useful unless it's Payload and they're pushing the kart, because sometimes you just can't 'skip' them, because they're too close to the others and you may mistakenly backstab him and get stunned. If he's at a medium distance, you can simply go to the other enemies and backstab them, as the sniper will have no Jarate or SMG to deal with your at a medium range, which is the perfect range for you to use your revolver and kill him then.

scenario #1: you're a lone sniper off on some battlements or something. assuming you have no immediate help from nearby teammates, you're fucked if a spy pops up. even if you're aware of his presence you have to frantically chase him down with your kukri before he can kill you with his revolver. scenario #2: you aren't alone, or you're in a group pushing the cart or capping or something. a competent spy will try to backstab as many of your teammates as he can, then proceed to finish you off with his revolver. all you can do is chase him around with your kukri before he can kill you. either way you're incredibly inefficient at dealing with the spy. the gayz0rback just slightly complicates the spy's task, while making the sniper useless at medium range. at least with the smg you can deal a decent amount of damage at medium range, or you could coat the spy with piss and let your teammates have at him as he tries to escape.

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;19754467]No, it's not as great as you say. Let's see the Sniper vs. Spy update page. The sniper must have killed the spy with a non scoped shot or with the Kukri. Obviously, the Spy won't always be on the range of the Kukri, and noscopes do around 50 damage only. Razorback snipers aren't useful unless it's Payload and they're pushing the kart, because sometimes you just can't 'skip' them, because they're too close to the others and you may mistakenly backstab him and get stunned. If he's at a medium distance, you can simply go to the other enemies and backstab them, as the sniper will have no Jarate or SMG to deal with your at a medium range, which is the perfect range for you to use your revolver and kill him then.[/QUOTE] First of all, most Spies that I've seen can't shoot worth shit. Bum rushing them with the Melee generally works. Then you can just corner them and very easily destroy them. Second of all, I know it's only useful for Payload. That's what I've been saying. If you move around a lot, you can make life for the Spy very, very hard! I know this because I've used it and it works! If he's at medium distance and he back stabs someone, and if you are on a smart team, they will turn around and kill the Spy! It's that simple!