Major Update Speculation: V8: Rise of the Machines!

[Noizeblaze]

I thought the Third Degree's downside was not being the Axtinguisher.

[TonicBH]

Dumb idea for Amputator:

- Uses 5% Ubercharge on taunt
- If player has no Ubercharge, no AOE (basically identical to Bonesaw at that point)

I think this would be an interesting idea to implement, giving an additional risk/reward scenario in addition to "possibly being the next Sniper/Spy target." However, it might be ineffective if it takes away Ubercharge when you taunt since it can take time to build up said uber.

[ned_ballad]

uhh the weapon is built for Medieval, and that would make it entirely useless in Medieval mode.

[Simski]

[QUOTE=ned_ballad;37427011]loads of people use the Amputator, a third of those who own it. Other weapons equipped by a third of those who own it: Kritzkreig and all Medic Primaries.

It's the second most equipped bonesaw in the game, not actually that far under the Ubersaw (half of those who own it equip it).[/QUOTE]
What about the Ubersaw?
Still feels like the most useful and rewarding Medic melee to me, downside or not.

[The Enemy |]

[QUOTE=Simski;37427149]What about the Ubersaw?
Still feels like the most useful and rewarding Medic melee to me, downside or not.[/QUOTE]

Depends. The Amputator on its own isn't all that great, but paired with the Crossbow it gives a nice little +1 health per second that renders afterburn nearly useless.

[Simski]

[QUOTE=ned_ballad;37426895]slower swing speed is always a cheap and "safe" melee downside, that'd work easily on the Solemn Vow.

Amputator could not crit. Considering it's a Medieval weapon, the lack of crits hurts more than you think.

Third Degree could... ehh... the weapon, even being an upgrade, is still pretty bad. Any downside to this and it'll probably just be trashed, so I think it needs a buff and a nerf at the same time.[/QUOTE]
I think just about every default melee in the game should have a damage buff that does not affect the new weapons (obvious exception to Spy's knife).

[ned_ballad]

that would be a hassle to implement

[Bryceanater]

[QUOTE=ned_ballad;37427090]uhh the weapon is built for Medieval, and that would make it entirely useless in Medieval mode.[/QUOTE]

I use Aputator outside medieval mode.
I mostly hide behind a corner and constantly taunt while everyone is shooting.

This is only useful if another medic is on the team.

[Primeduck]

How about longer taunt time?

[Simski]

[QUOTE=ned_ballad;37427197]that would be a hassle to implement[/QUOTE]
Perhaps, but worth it. Just do the change and add a "-20% damage" or whatever the amount to all other weapons without damage downsides. They would remain unchanged while the default gets buffed, without having to show any new stats to the default weapons.

[ned_ballad]

anyway, now that i46 is over, I wonder if a patch tonight or if we'll go back to Thursdays.

[Bragdras]

[QUOTE=ned_ballad;37426895]slower swing speed is always a cheap and "safe" melee downside, that'd work easily on the Solemn Vow.

Amputator could not crit. Considering it's a Medieval weapon, the lack of crits hurts more than you think.

Third Degree could... ehh... the weapon, even being an upgrade, is still pretty bad. Any downside to this and it'll probably just be trashed, so I think it needs a buff and a nerf at the same time.[/QUOTE]

I have an idea for the third degree, since it seems to be the anti healbot kind of weapon:

Third Degree
While active:
Take 25% less damage and deal 25% more damage to both targets linked by the medigun beam.
Take 25% more damage and deal 25% less damage to targets not being healed.
Effect persist while the Third Degree is drawn, and up to 5 seconds after switching to another weapon.

Amputator would be easy to fix: 50% less damage, plus having to taunt to make use of it. Makes up for the fact it can heal multiple teammates.

[Simski]

[QUOTE=Bragdras;37427329]Effect persist while the Third Degree is drawn, and up to 5 seconds after switching to another weapon.[/QUOTE]
Strongly disagree.

[Bragdras]

[QUOTE=Simski;37427340]Strongly disagree.[/QUOTE]

So that the medic can stop healing his target and the pyro will suffer the +25% damage bonus from his teammate.

[wickedplayer494]

Though I'm doubting it, I wouldn't be too terribly surprised to see a small fix, even if labeled optional for servers. Don't think we'll be getting an update though.

[Evil_Knevil]

[QUOTE=ned_ballad;37427225]anyway, now that i46 is over, I wonder if a patch tonight or if we'll go back to Thursdays.[/QUOTE]

I hope they start doing weekly items again.

[BigJoeyLemons]

[QUOTE=ned_ballad;37427197]that would be a hassle to implement[/QUOTE]

Not with new priority flat rate boxes from the Postal Service. If it fits, it ships, anywhere in the country fo a [I]low flat rate.[/I]

[HazzaHardie]

I may be on my own here, but I hope that decoy gets nerfed a bit

[Scarabix]

For the third degree, I have a different idea. I'm not really sure about it, but it would give the weapon a whole new psychological dimension.

Third degree:

damage is dealt to all players connected by healing beams
[B]while active: a distinctive buzzing noise is emitted from the weapon[/B]

How this comes into play:

the medics would now be able to hear third degree pyros coming. The pyro would as such be able to harass the medic without even showing himself, and create a new atmosphere of paranoia, not unlike a spy.

Of course this would also be a nerf in that the medics would be able to switch to another weapon to protect their patient, or really just warn them of what's going to happen. But all in all the weapon would be more interesting. [B]It would be the exact opposite of the current tomislav.[/B]

[Eriorguez]

The point of melee unlocks was to leave the vanilla version outdated, seeing it was melee and wouldn't make much of a difference anyway, but would be slighty harder to use. Case in point: Medic, Pyro and Heavy updates.

Give the amputator a different, more leghty taunt, and we are set. It is the same deal as the rainblower, a gimmick that can be useful, but all in all quite minor. Except in situations without Medigun.

Most melee weapons for most classes outdo the vanilla option. I'd say it was intended, seeing melee weapons are such a minor part of the game it doesn't really matter.

[Lord Exor]

[QUOTE=HazzaHardie;37427729]I may be on my own here, but I hope that decoy gets nerfed a bit[/QUOTE]
How can a map get nerfed?

[Hell-met]

a bit offtopic but I just remembered I crafted the iron curtain when the recipe was broken

if it were tradeable i'd probably be rich

valve :(

[ned_ballad]

[QUOTE=Hell-met;37428105]a bit offtopic but I just remembered I crafted the iron curtain when the recipe was broken

if it were tradeable i'd probably be rich

valve :([/QUOTE]

I have a unique level Foster's Facade, and I am not rich. Sometimes random stuff is not really worth anything on the market, despite being unique.

[editline]27th August 2012[/editline]

[QUOTE=Lord Exor;37428077]How can a map get nerfed?[/QUOTE]

MannUp is practically impossible unless you have a well coordinated team.

TF2 is not built to be impossible to play unless you gather up all your buddies. It's always been balanced assuming everyone are total strangers and never communicate above voice commands. And you just can't beat Decoy on advanced with just a random group of strangers.

[Scarfulhu]

[QUOTE=Lord Exor;37428077]How can a map get nerfed?[/QUOTE]

No random critical hits.

[GladoSC]

[QUOTE=ned_ballad;37428237] And you just can't beat Decoy on advanced with just a random group of strangers.[/QUOTE]

Did this yesterday. Both advanced missions with total strangers. Not even with optimal weapons/upgrades. Its not really that hard

[AbeX300]

[QUOTE=Necrotic Fever;37428262]No random critical hits.[/QUOTE]

+20% fire damage vulnerability

[ned_ballad]

[QUOTE=GladoSC;37428400]Its not really that hard[/QUOTE]

then I guess the vast majority of people complaing about this particular mission being too hard to play in public matches (including myself) are just terrible at the game?

And even if they [i]are[/i] terrible at the game, it's still a problem.

There's a huge jump in difficulty from normal to advanced. You can beat normal with a team of four engineers. Or run the crossbow as a primary, or do a bunch of other really silly stuff and still finish with an A+. Then you jump to advanced and you have to make sure you're getting at least As on every map, and making sure no upgrades are wasted at all. Waves get incredibly hard and suddenly the game jumps into huge ridiculous difficulty, even if the previous normal mission was a piece of cake.

[AbeX300]

[QUOTE=ned_ballad;37428832]then I guess the vast majority of people complaing about this particular mission being too hard to play in public matches (including myself) are just terrible at the game?

And even if they [i]are[/i] terrible at the game, it's still a problem.

There's a huge jump in difficulty from normal to advanced. You can beat normal with a team of four engineers. Or run the crossbow as a primary, or do a bunch of other really silly stuff and still finish with an A+. Then you jump to advanced and you have to make sure you're getting at least As on every map, and making sure no upgrades are wasted at all. Waves get incredibly hard and suddenly the game jumps into huge ridiculous difficulty, even if the previous normal mission was a piece of cake.[/QUOTE]

There should be a new difficulty between Normal and Advanced, and that obviously being Hard.

[zombays]

Personally, I prefer the Vita-saw, cause it isn't actually -25, it's just -10. And it makes it so much easier to be a medic for when you die, you get that precious 20% back

[BigJoeyLemons]

[QUOTE=AbeX300;37428858]There should be a new difficulty between Normal and Advanced, and that obviously being Hard.[/QUOTE]

omg guise i cant even pley the norml difficulty its to hard!!!! we need an easy diffivuly