The "Weapon Fixing Megathread" - We fix weapons' stats and get in fights - Games

[QUOTE=Limie Pie;41795972]Griefing. Friend on enemy team lightens you giving you free 160 damage per second. And you don't need a friend for this. The weapon should somehow punish the Pyro lightening Scout, not the entire team. Maybe it should charge by taking the afterburn damage? More afterburn suffered = more damage dealt with the next swing. ??[/QUOTE] same thing can happen with lots of other stuff in TF2 too like disguised spy + medic griefing [editline]11th August 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Suttles;41797114] fire + milk would be a fun combo if it got changed to light people on fire.[/QUOTE] we do not need any other weapons that light people on fire, fire is Pyro's gimmick, this is what happens when Valve decides to make other weapons do fire once in awhile, it becomes normalized when it shouldn't, afterburn is one of the most annoying and effortless things in TF2 that doesn't need further spreading

[QUOTE=The Baconator;41798098]same thing can happen with lots of other stuff in TF2 too like disguised spy + medic griefing [editline]11th August 2013[/editline] we do not need any other weapons that light people on fire, fire is Pyro's gimmick, this is what happens when Valve decides to make other weapons do fire once in awhile, it becomes normalized when it shouldn't, afterburn is one of the most annoying and effortless things in TF2 that doesn't need further spreading[/QUOTE] But here you don't need a friend on enemy team or really silly teammate. You just need one pyro who accidentally set Scout on fire with Detonator. And that's it. All your team is sentenced to fight against fast as lighting enemy killing you with 2 hits in literally 1 second.

[QUOTE=Limie Pie;41798501]But here you don't need a friend on enemy team or really silly teammate. You just need one pyro who accidentally set Scout on fire with Detonator. And that's it. All your team is sentenced to fight against fast as lighting enemy killing you with 2 hits in literally 1 second.[/QUOTE] to be fair, I never said it would be balanced

[QUOTE=Limie Pie;41798501]But here you don't need a friend on enemy team or really silly teammate. You just need one pyro who accidentally set Scout on fire with Detonator. And that's it. All your team is sentenced to fight against fast as lighting enemy killing you with 2 hits in literally 1 second.[/QUOTE] A burning Scout who's only attacking at melee range is incredibly easily dealt with. Also, crits from the weapon only do 79 damage, which isn't enough to kill anyone with 160+ health in two hits.

50% fire resistance when its out?

[QUOTE=comet1337;41803829]50% fire resistance when its out?[/QUOTE] Pocket Pistol becomes an even better utility item since with the SoaS out all of it's downsides are gone except for the firing speed one (which isn't that bad of a problem since you probably won't use it to shoot people with anyway) I always wanted the SoaS to extinguish allies, and it stores a crit when you do so. But then again that's yet [B]another [/B]weapon that counters afterburn.

[QUOTE=Lolkork;41733177]Double donks don't deal that much more damage than normal grenades most of the time, it can deal over 150 if you get a perfect (Detonation right after the direct hit) double donk with maximum rampup, but it's insanely unlikely that it will occur. And it has a low firerate due to cooking (Which becomes worse the closer a target is to you), low maximum range, complicated mechanics, and useless rollers. However, my actual in game experience with this weapon is fairly limited so please correct me if I'm wrong about something.[/QUOTE] You are right about everything. It doesn't compare well to L&L either. Double donk is more difficult to execute than a simple direct hit, while doing about the same damage. The massive knockback is a positive on its own, throwing the player out of the explosion's way doesn't make double donk any easier. It's actually easier to damage yourself with it at close quarters, since the rollers usually bounce towards you. The increased magazine is the only consolation, even though not a significant one.

Just an idea. Don't kill me, but feel free to disagree. [IMG]http://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/b/bd/Backpack_Pomson_6000.png/90px-Backpack_Pomson_6000.png?t=20111216050325[/IMG] [img]http://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/2/29/Pictogram_plus.png/16px-Pictogram_plus.png[/img]Does not require ammo [img]http://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/2/29/Pictogram_plus.png/16px-Pictogram_plus.png[/img]Projectile cannot be deflected [img]http://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/2/29/Pictogram_plus.png/16px-Pictogram_plus.png[/img][I]On Hit: Victim cannot cloak or ubercharge for 2 seconds[/I]

[QUOTE=Bynine;41815956]Just an idea. Don't kill me, but feel free to disagree. [IMG]http://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/b/bd/Backpack_Pomson_6000.png/90px-Backpack_Pomson_6000.png?t=20111216050325[/IMG] [img]http://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/2/29/Pictogram_plus.png/16px-Pictogram_plus.png[/img]Does not require ammo [img]http://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/2/29/Pictogram_plus.png/16px-Pictogram_plus.png[/img]Projectile cannot be deflected [img]http://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/2/29/Pictogram_plus.png/16px-Pictogram_plus.png[/img][I]On Hit: Victim cannot cloak or ubercharge for 2 seconds[/I][/QUOTE] Penetration or no?

Great Engineer Fix. Something I made on SPUF a while back, but never touched the light of day on facepunch. Short Circuit Level 5 Robot Arm On Fire: Generates an electrical field that destroys projectiles and does slight damage to players No reload necessary Projectiles erased give back metal No random critical hits Per Shot: -30 ammo Uses metal for ammo Essentially Widowmaker for the Short Circuit. Not as spammable anymore, but still viable. The Wrangler Level 5 Laser Pointer[/COLOR] Take manual control of your Sentry Gun DR Treatment. Shield decays as it takes damage. Once the shield is gone, the only way of having it back is by building another sentry. Fair enough. Pomson 6000 Level 10 Indivisible Particle Smasher Does not require ammo Projectile cannot be deflected Projectile penetrates enemy targets Alt-Fire: Charged shot that mini-crits targets and drains +10% Uber Charge or 15% Cloak.[/COLOR] Penetration is back, but it's not a bison reskin. If you wanna take uber or cloak you're going to have to charge it. The Gunslinger Level 15 Robot Arm +25 max health on wearer No random critical hits Replaces Buildings with fast building mini-sentries, mini-dispensers, and speed pads.[/COLOR] [QUOTE=SkynetExploit;34748679]It's simple: Gunslinger replaces all buildings with mini versions of them. Mini-sentry Stays the same except: No knockback, 90 health. Mini-dispenser Costs 75 metal, Deploys in 5 seconds, 100 health, heal/ammo like lvl 1 dispenser Teleporter replaced with speed pads Costs 75 metal, deploys in 5 seconds, 100 health, recharge every 5 seconds, stepping on speed pad sets your speed to 200% (pretty much if you were being whipped) for 10 seconds, ends if you take damage or fire a weapon. Perfect.[/QUOTE]

you can't put an alt fire on the pomson, picking up building takes that slot. (also please don't make it mouse3 either jesus christ no)

I've been thinking about pyro stuff recently. Here's my idea: *New flamethrower* + On hit: Victim becomes marked for death - -80% damage Ok, so what's this doing? In itself, it's a strong support weapon, centred on lighting people up and pushing them away so your teammates can finish them off. The mark for death effect results in an effective increase in afterburn damage, which is something no other flamer currently does. So, rather than killing your enemies outright, it's gonna make them scared to face your team and keen to go scooting off to find a health pack. If this sounds a bit boring in itself, that's because the big change is coming up next: *Axetinguisher* +On hit: 'Marked for Death' victims are killed instantly -When weapon is active: User is marked for death BOOM! Big change! So, this has brought the puff 'n' sting combo we all know and love, but made its use not only exclusive to one flamer that can't kill by itself, but more risky to use. Pyros still have the capability to kill very quickly, but now need to be much more efficient about doing so: running around flailing the axe like a madman is going to get you killed. This also makes the role of the other flamers more distinct. The degreaser in particular is now more focussed on projectile reflection and flare combos, which are arguably weaker than the axe, because puff 'n' sting is no longer a viable option for it. Interestingly, this also leads to a situation where the weapon counters itself. In the same vein as katana duels, pyros now have the potential to 1-hit each other at close range. Problems this (at least partly) resolves: Degreaser stops being the unequivocally strongest flamer because its quick-switching capabilities are made a little less useful. The role of each flamer becomes more distinct and suited to a single task, rather than just variations on puff & sting. You can spot a pyro who's going to be attempting to puff & sting by his flamer. The puff & sting combo becomes riskier to use whilst retaining its potential power Potential issues: People may not want yet another flamethrower when there's quite a few already that currently already do a similar job The axetinguisher's utility is greatly reduced when not paired with the new flamer: mark for death is a very situational status. Could be addressed with extra stats on the axe e.g. +25% damage The new flamer will likely be boring to use without the axe. Represents a barrier to new players particularly, who might find this new flamethrower and think it completely useless. Perhaps needs a secondary effect to increase its viability as a support weapon. Thoughts?

I was thinking maybe the Disciplinary Action shouldn't have random crits anymore, but always crits when you are under the speed boost effect. As is it's pretty stupid to use the thing during an actual fight and you're stuck using it just to get there faster, but with this change it could actually be viable in a fight and turn you and an ally into a whirlwind of destruction Also it should maybe let you run normal speed when drawn so you can actually hit people but there would need to be a pretty strong downside to counter that

[QUOTE=Venezuelan;41823963]I was thinking maybe the Disciplinary Action shouldn't have random crits anymore, but always crits when you are under the speed boost effect. As is it's pretty stupid to use the thing during an actual fight and you're stuck using it just to get there faster, but with this change it could actually be viable in a fight and turn you and an ally into a whirlwind of destruction Also it should maybe let you run normal speed when drawn so you can actually hit people but there would need to be a pretty strong downside to counter that[/QUOTE] It would be worse than the degreaser+axtinguisher combo and all you'd need is a quickfix buttbuddy medic

[QUOTE=RandomGamer342;41824288]It would be worse than the degreaser+axtinguisher combo and all you'd need is a quickfix buttbuddy medic[/QUOTE] ah, good point, never mind then maybe it can reduce the damage you take when boosting?

[QUOTE=Venezuelan;41824403]ah, good point, never mind then maybe it can reduce the damage you take when boosting?[/QUOTE] It's really fine as it is, it gives you speed boosts and ridiculous range at the cost of 25% less damage(which the range itself makes up for anyway)

[QUOTE=Antwon;41822420]I've been thinking about pyro stuff recently. Here's my idea: *New flamethrower* + On hit: Victim becomes marked for death - -80% damage Ok, so what's this doing? In itself, it's a strong support weapon, centred on lighting people up and pushing them away so your teammates can finish them off. The mark for death effect results in an effective increase in afterburn damage, which is something no other flamer currently does. So, rather than killing your enemies outright, it's gonna make them scared to face your team and keen to go scooting off to find a health pack. If this sounds a bit boring in itself, that's because the big change is coming up next: *Axetinguisher* +On hit: 'Marked for Death' victims are killed instantly -When weapon is active: User is marked for death BOOM! Big change! So, this has brought the puff 'n' sting combo we all know and love, but made its use not only exclusive to one flamer that can't kill by itself, but more risky to use. Pyros still have the capability to kill very quickly, but now need to be much more efficient about doing so: running around flailing the axe like a madman is going to get you killed. This also makes the role of the other flamers more distinct. The degreaser in particular is now more focussed on projectile reflection and flare combos, which are arguably weaker than the axe, because puff 'n' sting is no longer a viable option for it. Interestingly, this also leads to a situation where the weapon counters itself. In the same vein as katana duels, pyros now have the potential to 1-hit each other at close range. Problems this (at least partly) resolves: Degreaser stops being the unequivocally strongest flamer because its quick-switching capabilities are made a little less useful. The role of each flamer becomes more distinct and suited to a single task, rather than just variations on puff & sting. You can spot a pyro who's going to be attempting to puff & sting by his flamer. The puff & sting combo becomes riskier to use whilst retaining its potential power Potential issues: People may not want yet another flamethrower when there's quite a few already that currently already do a similar job The axetinguisher's utility is greatly reduced when not paired with the new flamer: mark for death is a very situational status. Could be addressed with extra stats on the axe e.g. +25% damage The new flamer will likely be boring to use without the axe. Represents a barrier to new players particularly, who might find this new flamethrower and think it completely useless. Perhaps needs a secondary effect to increase its viability as a support weapon. Thoughts?[/QUOTE] Axt is now useless without that flamethrower, the flamethrower itself makes no sense focusing on afterburn damage since it is easy to put out. This thing would be worse than the phlog.

[QUOTE=OceanGovernor;41824461]Axt is now useless without that flamethrower, the flamethrower itself makes no sense focusing on afterburn damage since it is easy to put out. This thing would be worse than the phlog.[/QUOTE] Not to mention that this is a prime example of ripping the bandage-fix that is the Axtinguisher off the gaping wound that is the Pyro.

Something I thought for the Fists of Steel +Downgrades crits So if you hit him with a crit, It'll be turned into a mini-crit If you hit him with a mini-crit, it'll do normal damage

[QUOTE=RandomGamer342;41824426]It's really fine as it is, it gives you speed boosts and ridiculous range at the cost of 25% less damage(which the range itself makes up for anyway)[/QUOTE] I agree that it's balanced as is, I just think it's missing something. Making it a viable combat support item seems a lot more interesting to me than just a tool to get to the front lines

[QUOTE=light dasher;41825885]Something I thought for the Fists of Steel +Downgrades crits So if you hit him with a crit, It'll be turned into a mini-crit If you hit him with a mini-crit, it'll do normal damage[/QUOTE] That would make hordes of steel gauntlet heavies hell to destroy

[QUOTE=Konork;41825019]Not to mention that this is a prime example of ripping the bandage-fix that is the Axtinguisher off the gaping wound that is the Pyro.[/QUOTE] Degreaser and power jack are more band aids than the axt

[QUOTE=light dasher;41825885]Something I thought for the Fists of Steel +Downgrades crits So if you hit him with a crit, It'll be turned into a mini-crit If you hit him with a mini-crit, it'll do normal damage[/QUOTE] I think the fists of steel are fine as is, its not like you see someone taking down teams with that item alone as heavy, honestly I see people using the GRU more or default fists. or fat scout

[QUOTE=Giggle;41826001]I think the fists of steel are fine as is, its not like you see someone taking down teams with that item alone as heavy, honestly I see people using the GRU more or default fists. or fat scout[/QUOTE] You shouldn've been on the server I was on earlier.

[QUOTE=OceanGovernor;41825992]Degreaser and power jack are more band aids than the axt[/QUOTE] Whichever item it is, the point is that we should fix the Pyro first because he really can't stand up very well without it right now.

[QUOTE=Konork;41826062]Whichever item it is, the point is that we should fix the Pyro first because he really can't stand up very well without it right now.[/QUOTE] Pyro's biggest problem is airblast being stupid and hit detection. If you could fix those two you'd actually be able to make the class worthwhile

[QUOTE=legalize it;41826326]Pyro's biggest problem is airblast being stupid and hit detection. If you could fix those two you'd actually be able to make the class worthwhile[/QUOTE] How would you 'fix' airblast?

I play almost stock Pyro (except for the Homewrecker) and I don't get what you people are on about. I manage to handle myself quite well.

[QUOTE=OceanGovernor;41826365]How would you 'fix' airblast?[/QUOTE] Keep it the same, but make it so airblasting people does not completely immobilize them. That seems to be the thing most people find annoying about it.

[QUOTE=MissingGlitch;41826464]Keep it the same, but remove the ability to airblast people. That seems to be the thing most people find annoying about it.[/QUOTE] Keep it I say and remove it on the Degreaser.