The "Weapon Fixing Megathread" - We fix weapons' stats and get in fights - Games

[QUOTE=DatWut?;40723766]Sorry, but the Dispenser and Telporter are crippling. Like SERIOUSLY crippling. If those stats got in, a lot of people would yell "OMG YOU ARE SO USELESS TO THE TEAM, STOP USING THE GUNSLINGER".[/QUOTE] I like the idea of the mini he suggested, but for a dispenser I'd like a mini-sentry build speed lvl1 dispenser that cannot be upgraded. EDIT: I forgot to mention, for a tele you could either leave it as is, or have a faster building/recharging one with a limited radius.

[QUOTE=Deodorant;40723825]Like they don't already do that.[/QUOTE] Never heard a single complaint. Maybe from enemies because HurrDurrMinisentry. I for one always try to build a Dispenser and a Tele. And a lot of people use my Teleporter. My Strange PDA has tracked 26199 Health Dispensed to Allies, as well as 883 Allies Teleported, and I mainly run Gunslinger. At RARE occasions, I switch to the Jag. Buildings that automatically go down after x amount of uses are a bad idea if you ask me.

I'd say all that you need to do is reduce the ridiculous range that the minisentry has and stop it from regenerating health whilst building. Less spammable and not so much a bane to scouts and the like.

Shorter Range and blind spot sound fine to me. As for the regenenarating health, maybe it should be repairable for X seconds after initially being deployed (so that you can't abuse the pick-up and redeploy to repair it). That way, if the Engineer would stay near his Sentry and thus risk his ass being shot, it would be rewarded with him being able to repair the Sentry.

Or simply - can be repaired while deploying, but not after it has fully deployed. This way the engineers would have to choose between standing still to whack their sentry twice while it builds so it has a chance to survive, or just pop it down and run, risking it might get taken down quickly.

I think a smaller sentry range for the minis is a really dumb idea. Kinda forces you to only be able to use it in the annoying spammy way and not in the 'i found a cute little spot to tuck this in and get some cheeky kills with it' like it was supposed to be for.

[QUOTE=theharribokid;40733327]I think a smaller sentry range for the minis is a really dumb idea. Kinda forces you to only be able to use it in the annoying spammy way and not in the 'i found a cute little spot to tuck this in and get some cheeky kills with it' like it was supposed to be for.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]The 3D sphere that represents the attack range on the Combat Mini-Sentry is smaller than the normal Sentry Gun 3D sphere; however, they both have the same attack range. [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=theharribokid;40733327]I think a smaller sentry range for the minis is a really dumb idea. Kinda forces you to only be able to use it in the annoying spammy way and not in the 'i found a cute little spot to tuck this in and get some cheeky kills with it' like it was supposed to be for.[/QUOTE] There are only a couple problems with it: It's difficult to break while it's building unless you focus it (and even then, several classes have trouble outdamaging its build rate until they get close), leaving yourself wide-open to get flanked by the Engineer or his teammates. With a normal sentry gun, you can focus the Engineer and then still have time to get the gun, or you can get the gun and then chase down the Engineer. Its hitbox is puny. This is especially noticeable when using a shotgun or pistol to try to take it down from outside its range. You'd be lucky if 2 pellets hit it with every shot. And after plugging a full mag or two into the damn thing, the Engineer can just plop another one down, which you're more than 3 seconds away from, so you're sent back to trying to outrange the dumb thing. Repeat ad infinitum until the Engineer's team takes you down, you get some backup, or you run away to go get more ammo. People wouldn't complain about the mini's range so much if it were that much easier to actually shoot from outside its range. Really, if these two issues can be resolved the thing will get a lot less flak. I still standby my proposal for fixing the damn thing. [h2]Combat Sentry[/h2] [i]Takes 2.5 seconds to build and is spawned with full health, during building it will heal itself at a reduced rate: 30 hp/sec[/i] [b]Is normal sized, the only thing that distinguishes it from normal sentries is its sounds, its checker pattern, and the strobe light on top[/b] [highlight]Only does 48 dps Max health of 100 Bullets deal no knockback[/highlight] [img]http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090516202740/ganggarrison/images/6/64/Sentry_red_transparent.png[/img] You can imagine what I'm getting at. [editline]21st May 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Mr. Jelly;40733424]The 3D sphere that represents the attack range on the Combat Mini-Sentry is smaller than the normal Sentry Gun 3D sphere; however, they both have the same attack range.[/QUOTE] That sphere is a model, and it scales with the sentry gun itself. Whether or not it's intentional, it's a direct result of scaling the sentry model down. This is also evident when a Red-Tape Recorder is placed on a mini-sentry, as the toolbox the mini returns to is scaled much smaller than the one that was in the Engineer's hands when he placed it in the first place.

[QUOTE=Psychopath12;40733543][editline]21st May 2013[/editline] That sphere is a model, and it scales with the sentry gun itself. Whether or not it's intentional, it's a direct result of scaling the sentry model down. This is also evident when a Red-Tape Recorder is placed on a mini-sentry, as the toolbox the mini returns to is scaled much smaller than the one that was in the Engineer's hands when he placed it in the first place.[/QUOTE] That makes too much sense too much

The only change to the mini imo is to remove bullet knockback, and no health regeneration while building.

I feel like the range nerf/blind spots is what it needs the most. You can prevent roamers from accessing ridiculously large areas on open maps with it. Hence Viaduct becomes unplayable with minis, the whole map becomes a death zone.

Give the minis the knockback of regular bullet weapons, not sentries, and remove their regenerating health during building so engineers can't shit out sentries in front of classes without it getting destroyed

Gunslinger is fine as it is. STOP CRYING

[QUOTE=The_Gardek;40740380]Gunslinger is fine as it is. STOP CRYING[/QUOTE] You're telling me that an engineer should be able to shit out level 1 sentries right in front of the face of a scout without the scout being able to do [U][B]ANYTHING ABOUT IT[/B][/U] before it's built and he's 3/4 dead?

[QUOTE=The_Gardek;40740380]Gunslinger is fine as it is. STOP CRYING[/QUOTE] You know, you're like a mjaority of the puff'n'sting Pyros: You're too blind/dumb to admit there's something wrong with the stuff you're using. I play a lot of Gunslinger and I admit it needs a nerf.

Could any of these changes actually be tested on a server one day? I feel like what sounds good on paper doesn't always mean it works well in-game.

[QUOTE=The_Gardek;40740380]Gunslinger is fine as it is. STOP CRYING[/QUOTE] You have a point. I just can't see it.

[QUOTE=mySvenLabs;40741288]Could any of these changes actually be tested on a server one day? I feel like what sounds good on paper doesn't always mean it works well in-game.[/QUOTE] Problem is that I know nothing about editing a weapons' stats via items_game.txt, and some of the things may require some new coding/things that can't be done with items_game.txt. I could test the speedbuff for the Hibernating Bear set though. :v:

AFAIK you can't do jack shit about minis via item schema.

Well I was just asking because, if Valve is going to have more "community-made updates" we, as a whole, might be able to balance some things out since it seems Valve doesn't want to.

[QUOTE=RandomGamer342;40740460]You're telling me that an engineer should be able to shit out level 1 sentries right in front of the face of a scout without the scout being able to do [U][B]ANYTHING ABOUT IT[/B][/U] before it's built and he's 3/4 dead?[/QUOTE] because scout is so amazing against engineers to begin with, right?

Scouts can't do anything about regular Engineers in the Engineer's own turf. And that's fine. However, Gunslinger Engineers can run around just about anywhere, and, without warning, leave the Scout unable to attack in areas where he'd normally have an advantage, on a very disproportionate scale. In many situations it's the same problem with Pyros, too.

but its called area denial for a reason.

But the thing about minis is that they can't be simply taken down for good like normal ones, they get re-built in 3 seconds. That way you can build them wherever and lock areas that you normally wouldn't be able to. And shouldn't be able to.

How about giving it a time limit from the mini is destroyed till a new one can be deployed? Maybe like the time it takes jarate or milk to regenerate? Only if the engineer destroys it himself can he place a new one instantly.

My biggest problem with them is how there's no way to outsmart them, like with normal sentries. You can rocketjump over those, circlestrafe them, but minis have that damn turning speed and sweep you right off the sky. If anything they they should have nerfed ability to instantly kill everything around them. Inability to aim upward, 180 degree rotation, anything. That'd also force the engineers to use their brain when placing them.

I think the lollichop should function as a reskin of the third degree.

The Scout would be able to prevent the engineer from "shitting out" level 1 sentries if the mini sentry didn't have regenerating health while it built. That way, the engineer has to think about placement, he can't just place it in front of someone and run, he'd have to put thought into sentry placement, or else his sentries would be destroyed before they could fire anything.

Could someone email the TF2 team/Eric Smith suggesting that they remove health regen on the minisentry?

Lets try this. [IMG]http://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/c/ca/Item_icon_Gunslinger.png/100px-Item_icon_Gunslinger.png[/IMG] +25 max health on wearer No random crits Replaces Sentry with Mini-Sentry For Mini-Sentries: -100% knockback -65% damage penalty for Mini-Sentries compared to a LVL 1 Sentry (usually -50%) Increases HP during build time beginning with 0 HP (just like normal Sentries). Doesnt drop metal when destroyed Maximum amount of 2 Mini-Sentries per team at once Good or bad idea?