So, what do we think of the new weapons? - Games

Directhit is good enough to not need mini-crits, banner is amazing, equalizer is overpowered, targe needs a nerf, scottish is underpowered, sword is fine, gunboats is underpowered.

What I like most in the Equalizer, because it's an all-purpose-weapon. Depending on the map and what's going on, sometimes I use it as: An escape weapon (When running away from another soldier or a demo, usually.) A last stand (Kill a pyro W+M1ing me when I have 40 health and speed away to a health kit.) A ninja weapon (Rocketjump behind enemy lines and own everyone spy-style.) An Eyelander + Targe counter-weapon (You want to charge me down to 20 health? Feel free, I'll kill you in one hit.)

I only have all the demo stuff, but all the milestones for both classes, lol'd at the steam cloud fail. Anyway, love the demo stuff. But, agreeing with what some other people are saying. When you targe, you can stop whenever you want. Maybe you can only stop after a certain amount of time instead of right away or mid-targe. Anyone?

I love the targe because its made the axtinguisher useful

How do you shield charge? I feel like I'm missing something with the Targe.

right click

Since I'm an offensive berserker, the Targe was the best item ever. Then when I decide we're getting fucked in our own base, I'll use the Resistance to cover the chokepoints.

With the Scottish Resistance, I feel like I have to aim in a certain area around the sticky bomb, and sometimes aiming directly at it does nothing.

I love all of the melee demomen, they are incredibly easy to take down, they don't seem to expect you to take out your melee weapon.

[QUOTE=NotPigeon;19105549]I thought the same thing at first, but as I used it more I found that sometimes it seems like it charges almost instantly. I think it gives you more charge the more people you hit at once.[/QUOTE] It's based on damage done, so that makes sense.

[QUOTE=yuki;19085409]The sword is fucking bullshit, plain and simple. It undermines the entire idea behind what the Demoman is supposed to be: A defensive, ambushing class. Not an ultra-offensive warrior. Here's what I would have done: [b]Flak-Gun, Grenade Launcher replacement[/b] -Destroys enemy stickybombs -Large radius, lots of projectiles, lower damage -Projectiles bounce off of flat surfaces(depends on velocity) [b]Explosives Shield/Suit, Melee replacement[/b] --75% explosive damage -Reduced speed Scottish Resistance is fine, perfect for the Demo. Also, alternatively for the soldier: [b]I-C-U:[/b] -Remote controlled rocket: When fired, camera shifts to the rocket's perspective. Guide it into an enemy or at a turret. -Gradually loses speed and maneuverability, drops and explodes -Can be remotely exploded -One rocket mag, 8 rockets total -Lower reload speed And instead of giving the demoman a sword, the Tenth class: [b]A goddamn Viking[/b] -No ranged weapons -Raised health -Reduced speed (Heavy-ish) +Big fucking battle axe +Chargin' Targe +Mutton (healing item)[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=yuki;19085409]The sword is fucking bullshit, plain and simple. It undermines the entire idea behind what the Demoman is supposed to be: A defensive, ambushing class. Not an ultra-offensive warrior.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=yuki;19085409]It undermines the entire idea behind what the Demoman is supposed to be: A defensive, ambushing class. Not an ultra-offensive warrior.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=yuki;19085409]It undermines the entire idea behind what the Demoman is supposed to be[/QUOTE] There's your problem right there. UNDERMINING THE ORIGINAL PURPOSE IS WHAT THE UNLOCKS ARE SUPPOSED TO FUCKING DO.

I like the Charging Targe and the Eyelander. Fun new way to play Demo, but easy to counter as Scoot.

[QUOTE=PsychoMantis;19109124]UNDERMINING THE ORIGINAL PURPOSE IS WHAT THE UNLOCKS ARE SUPPOSED TO FUCKING DO.[/QUOTE] They're supposed to offer a different way to play a class, not destroy the entire purpose behind a class. Case-and-point: Every other class update.

[QUOTE=yuki;19085409] Bitching about main idea of Demoman[/QUOTE] What I have understanded about updates is giving new playing tactics for classes. Its true that they could have made it better, but still it gives new play options and new tactics eh? Making Demo from defensive to more aggressive type. Making Soldier from huge jump shoot jump shoot tactic to more sharpshooting and teamtype thing. Allmighty Sniper to more in the battlefield type. List goes on....i guess... So thats my oppinion of things, and im glad

[QUOTE=yuki;19109372]They're supposed to offer a different way to play a class, not destroy the entire purpose behind a class.[/QUOTE] The charge lets him physically get up close and [i]demo[/i]lish a defense, the fire/explosion resistance lets him tank damage and get through those tight, spammy spaces most other classes would just get gibbed on. The Demo's always been good at destroying defenses, and this doesn't change that.

[QUOTE=NotPigeon;19109864]The Demo's always been good at destroying defenses, and this doesn't change that.[/QUOTE] I'm not saying he's not supposed to have an offensive purpose, I'm arguing that he shouldn't have the power to become more offensive and destructive than any other class.

[QUOTE=yuki;19110015]I'm not saying he's not supposed to have an offensive purpose, I'm arguing that he shouldn't have the power to become more offensive and destructive than any other class.[/QUOTE] That one's pretty debatable, though- how are we defining that? In terms of pure DPS, the Heavy still wins out. In terms of uber viability, he's always been the go-to choice for when you just need to smash stuff. The only thing the Targe really lets him do is get up close really fast, get a kill, and wreak close-range mayhem while his team cleans up; the damage resistance is so he can do it to focused groups of defenders and get through the wall of spam you typically find in chokepoints.

I have never had so many soldier/demo kills as pyro before, I have even started using the backburner again, just to sidestep the chargers and crit the hell out of their backs. Soldiers charge me with their little axe out and I know all I have to do is s+m1 to kill them, because they're low enough on health to switch to it. Valve gives these classes melee weapons and suddenly they think they can compete with the class designed for point blank slugging matches. It's brilliant.

I equipt the Targe, I charge someone. If I charge a small distance I get crit sparks. Is it supposed to deal damage. The large spike on it would suggest so, but nothing seems to happen.

[QUOTE=yuki;19109372]They're supposed to offer a different way to play a class, not destroy the entire purpose behind a class. Case-[b]in[/b]-point: Every other class update.[/QUOTE] Fixed :P

This has probably been pointed out before, but today I was unable to heal soldiers with the kritzkrieg if they had the equalizer equipped. Weird. [editline]11:36PM[/editline] [QUOTE=mat552;19110163]I have never had so many soldier/demo kills as pyro before, I have even started using the backburner again, just to sidestep the chargers and crit the hell out of their backs. Soldiers charge me with their little axe out and I know all I have to do is s+m1 to kill them, because they're low enough on health to switch to it. Valve gives these classes melee weapons and suddenly they think they can compete with the class designed for point blank slugging matches. It's brilliant.[/QUOTE] Being a Natascha heavy is also good for similar reasons.

As we all know, soldiers already get a decreased amount of damage dealt to them when they rocket jump. How about a con for the Equalizer is that rocket jumps do more damage to you.

not a big fan of scottish resistance, maybe i don't know how to use it well enough yet. i feel that being unable to detonate without looking is rather pointless.

[QUOTE=Jacklus;19117711]As we all know, soldiers already get a decreased amount of damage dealt to them when they rocket jump. How about a con for the Equalizer is that rocket jumps do more damage to you.[/QUOTE] I think the best way to nerf the Equalizer is to take away random crits. It crits so much anyway I'm convinced that it's glitched. Even when the Soldier is at full health.

[QUOTE=Waals Vander;19117958]not a big fan of scottish resistance, maybe i don't know how to use it well enough yet. i feel that being unable to detonate without looking is rather pointless.[/QUOTE] You technically don't have to actually see them so long as you're looking in their direction; they detonate through walls. Still, the SR would be a lot more useful if it had some kind of 'all-detonate' feature, especially when one of your traps gets blown away and you can't figure out where the last one or two ended up.

[QUOTE=mat552;19110163]I have never had so many soldier/demo kills as pyro before, I have even started using the backburner again, just to sidestep the chargers and crit the hell out of their backs. Soldiers charge me with their little axe out and I know all I have to do is s+m1 to kill them, because they're low enough on health to switch to it. Valve gives these classes melee weapons and suddenly they think they can compete with the class designed for point blank slugging matches. It's brilliant.[/QUOTE] Me too. I thought that the increased amount of Soldiers would make my life a a Pyro harder. I was wrong. All of these Demomen and Soldiers are trying to melee me to death are funny. They all seem to forget that the Pyro is, always has, and always will be the king when it comes to close range combat. You want to crit me with your little shield? Ha! I laugh at you! I will just ignite you, airblast you, and axetinguish you. You want to rush me with your little axe? Then I'll show you a REAL axe!

The new weapons are really good for the solider and demoman, but they're a disaster compared to the pyro. The flames are no longer useful, you can't kill a solider who has a pickaxe because he will instantly kill you once you flame him, as if you're buffing him, which is really too bad, same goes for the heavy, if he miniguns him, he would probably speed up and become faster than a scout and eventually kill him with 2 hits.... I don't want to be like one of those "nerf" guys, but.....MERCY!

[QUOTE=UnrealHope;19118218]The new weapons are really good for the solider and demoman, but they're a disaster compared to the pyro. The flames are no longer useful, you can't kill a solider who has a pickaxe because he will instantly kill you once you flame him, as if you're buffing him, which is really too bad, same goes for the heavy, if he miniguns him, he would probably speed up and become faster than a scout and eventually kill him with 2 hits.... I don't want to be like one of those "nerf" guys, but.....MERCY![/QUOTE] Pyro just has to airblast them. Charging soldiers and demos are harmless in the face of airblast. Heavies: Now is a good time to bring Natascha back out.

[QUOTE=NotPigeon;19085710]One of the Demoman's roles is area denial, through sticky traps and grenade spam. However, he's always had a second job: Breaking through ([b]demo[/b]lishing) enemy defenses. The Targe sacrifices his area denial job to boost his destruction job (the SR is the opposite); the damage resistance and charging ability allow him to literally bust down a defensive front.[/QUOTE] True, but there's a distinction between breaking through the enemy lines and going on a murderous rampage aided by high mobility and endurance. In my experience, the Targe and Eyelander can annihilate a defensive line and then continue to hold that area without a problem (unless a Heavy shows up). The Targe and Eyelander would fit the described role much better if their utility quickly deteriorated upon usage or passively, allowing for quick bouts of destruction but not much more shortly after that. Edit: The Equalizer is fine. Unless an enemy soldier can stealthily flank you, which isn't a possibility on many maps, you can pick them off like flies with most weapons. Charging with the Equalizer is usually asking to be killed.

[QUOTE=NiGHTS88;19118462]True, but there's a distinction between breaking through the enemy lines and going on a murderous rampage aided by high mobility and endurance. In my experience, the Targe and Eyelander can annihilate a defensive line and then continue to hold that area without a problem (unless a Heavy shows up). The Targe and Eyelander would fit the described role much better if their utility quickly deteriorated upon usage or passively, allowing for quick bouts of destruction but not much more shortly after that.[/QUOTE] I find that the best way to deal with a Targe Demoman is with a Scout. They do a lot of bullet-based damage (so no reduction from the Targe) really fast. Heavy's also a good choice, but Scouts can dodge pipes a lot easier.