MvM Discussion Megathread: Do Androids Complain of Overpowered Upgrades? - Games

[QUOTE=Exhale;43308001]I don't think you understand what kind of gold mine you are sitting on.[/QUOTE] What can I do with them? Doesn't it cost more to craft most of the specialized kits than you get from selling them (bar things like the rocket launcher which I did craft)

[QUOTE=Hng;43308185]What can I do with them? Doesn't it cost more to craft most of the specialized kits than you get from selling them (bar things like the rocket launcher which I did craft)[/QUOTE] Finish them Keep creating proffesional killstreak weapons Sell on the steam community market PROFIT

It takes around 1,5 key to finish a spec kit and 5 keys for a prof. Parts is 1 key per fabricator if you buy the parts for 0,22 ref. You can get cheap normal killstreak kits on the market for under half of a key. Rare robot parts is also really cheap on market compared to the metal price. As long as you sell your spec for atleast 2 keys and prof for 6 keys then you make profit no matter what and since profs can go for around 10-80 euro, you make soo much profit that you could use tickets on mvm forever. I have been doing this from day 1 of 2city and I have made over 150 keys and 400 euro just from selling kits and australiums. It's a goddamn goldmine.

I wonder why they made the final wave of Hamlet Hostility so easy to beat. Like, as a Scout you can just go and refund the upgrades, buy one bullet and explosive resistance, spending the rest on your scattergun as you wish. After that you can just run among the robots like a headless chicken and kill them all before going after those tanks to help on taking them out.

Is that the one with 3 Tanks? I keep forgetting the name. Yeah, it's ridiculous. Usually we just go all Pyro with Phlog and those tanks never get pass the gate. But I don't know why but last night it was like crazy impossible to beat Empire Escalation with our team (Blame free ToD tickets). We were stuck on Wave 5 not because of the Black Box Giants, but the dam Crits Heavies. Medic has been using the Shield well but after that shield is over, the second wave of heavies just tears us apart, even with full resistance on my Engie. I've been telling the Soldier to use the Batallion's Backup so when the Medic's Shield ran out, we can still lake them out thanks to the full crits resistance. Did he listen to me? Nope.

that wave is the perfect reason on why adding refunding was dumb

Is it weird that it surprises me how many bad MvM players there are? The mode has been around for over a year and brought in one of the biggest waves of new players compared to many other updates. Everyone and their grandma should know how to play by now.

[QUOTE=KnightRider25;43309472]Is that the one with 3 Tanks? I keep forgetting the name. Yeah, it's ridiculous. Usually we just go all Pyro with Phlog and those tanks never get pass the gate. But I don't know why but last night it was like crazy impossible to beat Empire Escalation with our team (Blame free ToD tickets). We were stuck on Wave 5 not because of the Black Box Giants, but the dam Crits Heavies. Medic has been using the Shield well but after that shield is over, the second wave of heavies just tears us apart, even with full resistance on my Engie. I've been telling the Soldier to use the Batallion's Backup so when the Medic's Shield ran out, we can still lake them out thanks to the full crits resistance. Did he listen to me? Nope.[/QUOTE] medic's shield should not be down for more than a few seconds. a medic should always be healing everyone he can to full and constantly switching targets so that his shield meter is always being charged. if hes got overheal time increased, tell them to use the refund to drop that shit immediately. a medic with a shield up 24/7 is the best medic.

[QUOTE=TheJoey;43309789]medic's shield should not be down for more than a few seconds. a medic should always be healing everyone he can to full and constantly switching targets so that his shield meter is always being charged. if hes got overheal time increased, tell them to use the refund to drop that shit immediately. a medic with a shield up 24/7 is the best medic.[/QUOTE] Worst case scenario, he can alternate between shield and uber canteens. Shield meter seems to recharge lightning fast while the Medic's under fire while ubered.

[QUOTE=Hell-met;43309571]that wave is the perfect reason on why adding refunding was dumb[/QUOTE] Yeah, it is a bit stupid that you can just swap unneeded classes and upgrades to something more suitable. But the whole wave in general is just dumbest one ever Valve has created IMO. It can be done in a heartbeat if the team ditches classes that are not meant for fighting tanks: Spy, sniper and heavy.

I think the wave refund has more pros than cons. If a player who's doing a vital role (like Scout, Engy, or on the new levels Medic) leaves mid match and doesn't come back, and the player who replaces him sucks with said class, doesn't have the right weapons for it or is much better at another class that another player is willing to swap for, then you can refund and the game doesn't turn into a grinding halt or "kick the new player" time. Of course you can cheese some waves, but I'm seeing some players refunding near the last round to swap to a class they prefer like Spy or Pyro so they can have more fun, and that's worth the minor drop in difficulty in my opinion. Besides, the refund glitches out on me constantly where everyone on my team has enough credits for the refund but the button doesn't show up, so I don't see refunds happening that often.

it's useful for screw-ups but it completely ruins the fun of planning and creating a team from start to finish. remember the boss waves in mecha engine? yeah no, they're obsolete now. this is why valve stopped making 1-boss waves like those, because the team can just refund-spam into one class and steamroll it no matter what happened during the game

Tried to play MvM after a while and it's full of f2p'ers/retards. Or it's just me lucky on bad servers.

[QUOTE=Hammer7;43312600]Tried to play MvM after a while and it's full of f2p'ers/retards. Or it's just me lucky on bad servers.[/QUOTE] Valve's been giving out free ToD tickets

[QUOTE=Hammer7;43312600]Tried to play MvM after a while and it's full of f2p'ers/retards. Or it's just me lucky on bad servers.[/QUOTE] Both Boot Camp and Mann Up are full of idiots right now because of those free ToD tickets. That's a good reason to gather a full party of decent players for the missions instead of relying on pubs for a while.

[QUOTE=Hell-met;43311833]it's useful for screw-ups but it completely ruins the fun of planning and creating a team from start to finish. remember the boss waves in mecha engine? yeah no, they're obsolete now. this is why valve stopped making 1-boss waves like those, because the team can just refund-spam into one class and steamroll it no matter what happened during the game[/QUOTE] Pretty sure they planned having a non-spammable one time refund but just broke it. It always says one refund credit available but you can spam it as much as you want.

Refund would be a good addition to the gamemode if it wasn't completely broken.

I just tried playing Mann Up, 5 times in a row. First 3 times we had an extremely stuck-up-his-own-ass guy with several completed tours who felt the need to boss everyone else and force them to pick classes they weren't good at just to fit the meta class selection. Time after that, we did great! Got an A+ on cash collection and not even the first forward spawn got capped. Everyone left. 5th time, we did horribly. 2 guys who didn't have a clue what they were doing, 2 guys who were good at the class but didn't seem to understand MvM, and me and my friend were the team. Steam server went down partway through and all the other players disconnected, then reconnected at the end of the first wave, then disconnected again after the next. They didn't come back. Also apparently I'm a bad medic for keeping people alive.

Talking about bosses, I wish Valve could make new interesting bosses. Sir Nukesalot was a step in the right way, but we can still improve. And I'm talking about bosses with powers like "calls a wave of minions to help" "teleports every X seconds" or something like that. Boss battles are hell of fun!

God, follow the new meta, you scrublord!! The medigun is a crutch for bad players. All the pros uses mad milk syringes and resistances only.

[QUOTE=Omninerd;43314821]Talking about bosses, I wish Valve could make new interesting bosses. Sir Nukesalot was a step in the right way, but we can still improve. And I'm talking about bosses with powers like "calls a wave of minions to help" "teleports every X seconds" or something like that. Boss battles are hell of fun![/QUOTE] I don't know, TF2 bosses seem like tanks that can shoot, all you have to do is dodge. It would be interesting if they worked more like traditional videogame bosses. Like they would use weak attacks at first, then when their health drops they get crits, different weapons, maybe shoot in patterns even.

[QUOTE=Omninerd;43314821]Talking about bosses, I wish Valve could make new interesting bosses. Sir Nukesalot was a step in the right way, but we can still improve. And I'm talking about bosses with powers like "calls a wave of minions to help" "teleports every X seconds" or something like that. Boss battles are hell of fun![/QUOTE] nukes, major, colonel and chief need a hat. it's really stupid that they don't have a hat.

Do you guys know any good MvM servers? Boot Camp keep connecting me to people hardly knowing what game they're playing.

[QUOTE=Omninerd;43314821] "teleports every X seconds"[/QUOTE] That would be awesome for a Giant Bonk Scout boss. Make it 2 seconds too. And full health refill on teleport.

[thumb]http://www.sourceop.com/hell-met/TF2/moneyspawn.jpg[/thumb]

[QUOTE=Hell-met;43318821][thumb]http://www.sourceop.com/hell-met/TF2/moneyspawn.jpg[/thumb][/QUOTE] If only that one had been a headshot... :v:

I've been berated numerous times today, again, for using the Quick-Fix in MvM, so I feel the need to explain why Quick-Fix is actually on-par with Kritz despite people refusing to believe it. At the start of the first wave, an un-upgraded Quick-Fix has a faster revive rate, faster heal rate and faster shield charge rate than the kritzkrieg, which has the advantage of occasional crit boosts instead. During normal healing, you can revive faster with the quick-fix than any other medigun, which is fantastic for keeping a heavy and soldier alive on the front lines (often the same soldier who was berating me prior, and still refuses to accept it's viability after the 17th or 18th revive on the same wave) During an un-upgraded ubercharge, all mediguns revive at the same rate. However, the quick-fix has a faster ubercharge, and it's ubercharge is affected by medigun upgrades, meaning that if you have even a [I]single[/I] point in Healing Mastery (as you should), you have a medigun that revives faster than any other can ever achieve. The faster heal rate also means you can build up a shield much quicker, making it much easier to have a shield up close to 24/7 during waves even if you don't have half your team [I]directly[/I] behind you. If you [I]don't[/I] put any points into overhealing upgrades, it's even easier to do so because decaying overheal means I can top you up again and get even more shield charge, please stop complaining about it goddamnit. Also not to mention it's additional features of following explosive jumps and moving at faster heal-speed targets means that I can heal a scout who's moving towards you, intentionally or otherwise, and get to you faster. This has allowed me to save the life of teammates without having to revive them numerous times, and it means I can follow a soldier onto the higher ledge in Mannhattan, or onto the crates if the first or second point has been captured. And for gods sakes can Valve please make votekicks contribute, perhaps at a lesser, towards abandoning penalties? People change class specifically to be useless to get kicked and avoid the penalty, and it's annoying as shit because in Mann Up you're really, really unlikely to have someone replace their slot if you're not in a position of pre-first-wave-start.

Guess I should stop buying jump upgrades with the giant demos helping me achieve way greater heights for free when available. [t]http://i.imgur.com/2jQzUYZ.jpg[/t] Now if only it was not THAT high sometimes!

[QUOTE=AlfieSR;43323628]I've been berated numerous times today, again, for using the Quick-Fix in MvM, so I feel the need to explain why Quick-Fix is actually on-par with Kritz despite people refusing to believe it.[/QUOTE] Those people are jerks. The Quick-Fix is awesome! I've only been asked about it twice or so, and just describe it this way: The Kritzkrieg's good for when you need occasional, yet consistent, offensive support But the Quick-Fix's good for when you need to focus on keeping the entire team healthy, and getting those overheals topped off. It's especially good for the Mannhattan maps, on account of the intense spamming. No point in getting a Kritzkrieg if you can't be protected long enough to get a charge when you need it most. Although I'll admit - some of my decision-making hinges on the fact that the Quick-Fix playstyle is way funner than spending most of your time babysitting the same two classes. Your beraters remind me of the type of asshole who spams the 'E' button the second he notices you dared to leave his side, just because the nearby Demoman's lungs got blown into another county.

[QUOTE=AlfieSR;43323628]I've been berated numerous times today, again, for using the Quick-Fix in MvM, so I feel the need to explain why Quick-Fix is actually on-par with Kritz despite people refusing to believe it. At the start of the first wave, an un-upgraded Quick-Fix has a faster revive rate, faster heal rate and faster shield charge rate than the kritzkrieg, which has the advantage of occasional crit boosts instead. During normal healing, you can revive faster with the quick-fix than any other medigun, which is fantastic for keeping a heavy and soldier alive on the front lines (often the same soldier who was berating me prior, and still refuses to accept it's viability after the 17th or 18th revive on the same wave) During an un-upgraded ubercharge, all mediguns revive at the same rate. However, the quick-fix has a faster ubercharge, and it's ubercharge is affected by medigun upgrades, meaning that if you have even a [I]single[/I] point in Healing Mastery (as you should), you have a medigun that revives faster than any other can ever achieve. The faster heal rate also means you can build up a shield much quicker, making it much easier to have a shield up close to 24/7 during waves even if you don't have half your team [I]directly[/I] behind you. If you [I]don't[/I] put any points into overhealing upgrades, it's even easier to do so because decaying overheal means I can top you up again and get even more shield charge, please stop complaining about it goddamnit. Also not to mention it's additional features of following explosive jumps and moving at faster heal-speed targets means that I can heal a scout who's moving towards you, intentionally or otherwise, and get to you faster. This has allowed me to save the life of teammates without having to revive them numerous times, and it means I can follow a soldier onto the higher ledge in Mannhattan, or onto the crates if the first or second point has been captured. And for gods sakes can Valve please make votekicks contribute, perhaps at a lesser, towards abandoning penalties? People change class specifically to be useless to get kicked and avoid the penalty, and it's annoying as shit because in Mann Up you're really, really unlikely to have someone replace their slot if you're not in a position of pre-first-wave-start.[/QUOTE] Now let me tell you why you are both wrong and right. Quickfix has a 40% faster healing rate, shield recharge and revive time the whole game compared to the other mediguns. Yes, 40% faster revive is nice when someone dies, but good players/teams will not die that often, making the faster revive not that useful. Everyone dies now and then but if the team only die 0-2 times total a wave, the faster revive becomes less worth it. It's great for shit teams, that can't stay alive for more than 2 sec. Shield has more or less become medics new main thing and faster shield recharge = better for the team. This would be a valid thing if it didn't recharge so fucking fast already. To recharge the shield you need 400 healing done. It takes around 5,4 sec to recharge with no healing rate upgrades and 2,7 sec when maxed. Unupgraded Quickfix shaves of 1,4 sec, while with max healing rate it becomes 0,7 to a total of 4 sec when unupgraded and 2 sec when upgraded. If the team can't take cover for the few sec that it takes to recharge the shield, then they aren't good to begin with. It's uber isn't good compared to the rest. Vac uber is fast to gain and we all know that reviving under uber is extremely fast. Stock uber beats quickfix uber because invulnerable > faster healing and shield recharge rate doesn't matter when you are immune to all damage. No knockback with quickfix can be devastating, since your patient can't surf the explosions to avoid further damage and will end up taking every single crit rocket to the face. And I don't think I have to explain why krits are good. Quickfix isn't total shit even tho I make it sound like it. The new mechanics made the other mediguns actually viable and not just shit. Vaccinator can help with crit bots in the beginning and revive extremely fast. Stock medigun uber is good. Quickfix is an all-rounder, that is good at the new mechanics but have a meh uber. Kritskrieg is an extremely big help against giants, tanks and even commons. Kritskrieg is the best, because it's uber actually helps good teams greatly compared to the other mediguns, without being horrible at any of the new mechanics. The 3 other medi guns are on par with each other but kritskrieg is the king. I just know I wrote something wrong or bad.