MvM Discussion Megathread: Do Androids Complain of Overpowered Upgrades? - Games

-snip- [editline]10th December 2013[/editline] Actually, how would you build a team around having 2 soldiers? What would you equip said soldiers with? Would having both run buff banner be good, or 1 running buff banner and 1 running backup? I've done a mission with 2 soldiers, it went pretty well really. A few crit canteens and a beggars bazooka instantly anhillated a tank (Although I personally don't run beggars bazooka in MVM, just not a fan.)

Double banner, especially with the medic shield. Permanent minicrits for you team does wondrous things for your damage output. The primaries almost don't matter, as long as one of you isn't running the CM5K (and no one chooses the LL/DH/RJ, obviously).

banner + conch is best a single buffbanner can be in permanent use if the soldier isn't horrible, it's pointless to overlap 2 of the same. and the conch speed is a major bonus

[QUOTE=Hell-met;43136878]banner + conch is best a single buffbanner can be in permanent use if the soldier isn't horrible, it's pointless to overlap 2 of the same. and the conch speed is a major bonus[/QUOTE] I'd prefer the battalion's backup over the conch since you get 50% sentry resistance and 35% resistance from other things. Comes in handy when engineer bots teleport in. But there's also other situations where you might need conch + backup. It would be fucking amazing to have 3 soldiers with the backup, banner and conch.

[QUOTE=necrophilia;43137326]I'd prefer the battalion's backup over the conch since you get 50% sentry resistance and 35% resistance from other things. Comes in handy when engineer bots teleport in.[/QUOTE] battalion is bad because robots dont need crits to kill you. raw damage from any giant or heavybots or rocket/pipe spam will kill you regardless. The aura is also too small to really help your team.

buff banner mini crits and conch basically remove the need for mad milk and fan apart from slowdown, which a sapper can do, so it makes sense as to why banner + conch is the best

heyo, i'm doing some manning-up for two hours. Anyone who wants to join me, contact me on steam.

[QUOTE=necrophilia;43137326] It would be fucking amazing to have 3 soldiers with the backup, banner and conch.[/QUOTE] [thumb]http://www.sourceop.com/hell-met/TF2/mvm/triplebanner.jpg[/thumb] :v:

[QUOTE=DrCactus;43137387]buff banner mini crits and conch basically remove the need for mad milk and fan apart from slowdown, which a sapper can do, so it makes sense as to why banner + conch is the best[/QUOTE] Concheror heals are absolute shit compared to mad milk. 35% compared to 60%. I guess having it more frequently almost makes up for it, but eh I'd prefer to run a backup or a second buff banner for protection/near constant minicrits.

I just finished playing (most of) a mission with Hell-Met as the spy, and things were going exceptionally well, so I am convinced. I'm starting to wonder how much of my mvm strategy is a result of the fact that I usually do a group of two or three in boot camp, so I assume that at least half the team can barely make it out of bed.

I think that for Sniper Backpack Secondaries, an attribute to add additional base HP would be useful.

I always want to try new strategies in MVM (such as Spy) but I'm always terrified I'll do bad. Is trying new strategies best for random Mann Up (Random Boot Camp is impossible) or in 6 Mann groups?

What I typically do is go to an increased MvM player server, pick some inexperienced class/loadout, and practice there.

[thumb]http://www.sourceop.com/hell-met/TF2/mvm/crash2013.jpg[/thumb] play with armisael, receive crash [sp]ballet scout[/sp]

In times like this I wish I had a group of friends to play on bootcamp with funny team arragements, like 6 Medics, 6 Soldiers with jumping bison or 2 of each banners... That kind of stuff.

I'd be kind of interested to see how 6 medics would fare. Everyone can revive each other, everyone has shields, upgraded syringe guns w/ mad milk are pretty decent... I could see it working out pretty well. Using the shield as damage output against groups, and an upgraded syringe/melee against tanks... I'm starting to like this idea more and more.

So, bot suggestions time! [B]Scout Bots:[/B] [I][U]War Announcer Scout[/U][/I] Uses the Fan O' War. Comes just before a group of other enemies, like Soldiers or Demomen. They always come up in a group of almost the same amount of a Spybots group, and spawn on a location where the players are not looking at and try to mark everyone to death. [I][U]Butcher Scout[/U][/I] Uses the Flying Guillotine only, throwing them in a constant rate, like the Sandman Scouts. Can spawn along with groups of Sandman Scouts for the horror of everyone. [I][U]Baby Face Scout[/U][/I] Equipped with the Baby Face's Blaster, starts walking really slowly, but with some shots, it runs as fast as a Super Scout. Good luck killing them before they do it. ;) [I][U]Hype Train[/U][/I] A giant Scout wielding the Soda Popper. Spawns with full hype bar and recharges it really fast. Deals a lot of damage and runs really fast, so try to take it down when it's not mini-crit-boosted. Optional: Maybe it has a really powerful Soda Popper, but only shoots while hyped. [I][U]Milk Delivery Scout[/U][/I] Spawn in small groups and throws Mad Milk at the players. Always spawn along with groups of other enemies. Now these crit-boosted Heavies will be almost immortals with these in the field. Also, this one is more of a support-like robot. [I][U]Santa Clank Helper[/U][/I] A giant Scoutbot that wields the Candy Cane and restores his entire health when he kills someone. Run as fast as a normal Giant Scout and is vulnerable to explosives. Wears the Smissmas Scout set. [B]Soldier Bots:[/B] [I][U]Samurai Soldier[/U][/I] Uses the Half-Zatoichi and the Mantreads. They do not retreat, they do not have fear, and they have knockback resistance. [I][U]Miner Soldier[/U][/I] Uses the Equalizer and the Mantreads. With improved knockback resistance, these are something to be feared if they reach you. Bonus points if it uses a mechanic similar to the old unsplitted Equalizer or has some speed upgrades from the start. [B]Pyro Bots:[/B] [I][U]Incinerator Pyro[/U][/I] Pyrobot equipped with the Phlogistinator. Spawns with full "mmph" and activate it as soon as they get in the map. After the mmph is gone, they are more vulnerable, so it's a good thing to get your distance from them at first. [I][U]Attendant Pyro[/U][/I] Pyrobot with some speed upgrades and holding the Powerjack, that are easy to kill, but can get a really high overheal if it kills a player. Also, they wear the Attendant hat, yeah. [I][U]Shark Pyro[/U][/I] A Pyrobot that spawns along with groups of Jarate Snipers or Mad Milk Scouts, and hunt everyone who is coated in Mad Milk/Jarate. Also good in maps with water, [I]too bad that there isn't one![/I] [B]Demoman Bots:[/B] [I][U]Suicide Demo[/U][/I] A Demomanbot equipped with the Splendid Screen and the Ullapool Caber. Rush at the players to explode them, but always get destroyed after they attack. To avoid them, just get out of the way before they hit you. [B]Engineer Bots:[/B] [I][U]Gunslinger Engineer[/U][/I] Spam mini-sentries, but does not build teleporters. Destroy them before their sentries or you're gonna have a baaad time... It's not supposed to be a support, like the normal Engineerbot, but instead an offensive bot, just like the Bowman. [I][U]Texas Clanger[/U][/I] Basically, just a big annoying Gunslinger Engineer that still spam mini-sentries (maybe giant mini-sentries?) and tries to hit anyone in the way, getting critical hits on the third consecutive punch. Bonus annoying points if the third punch is made so it would insta-kill anyone, regardless of his Critical Damage Resistance. [I][U]Deflector Engineer[/U][/I] Equipped with the Short Circuit, destroy sticky traps and annoy Soldiers and Demomen a lot. Does not build anything and instead it spawns with groups of other bots, protecting them from a rocket or grenade barrage, for example. But of course the Short Circuit always let something pass by sometimes... [I][U]Leecher Engineer[/U][/I] Equipped with the Pomson. Aim at Medics and Spies mainly, and recover health equal to the amount of cloak or übercharge it removes. They still build sentries and teleporters normally. The horrooor!! [B]Medic Bots:[/B] [I][U]Blutsauger Medic[/U][/I] A giant Medicbot equipped with a crit-boosted Blutsauger. Does not heal or übercharge, but has a really high regen rate thanks to his aimbotted syringes. [B]Sniper Bots:[/B] [I][U]Jarate Master[/U][/I] Unused Sniper bot. Does his job better than a Sydney Sleeper Sniper, tho. [I][U]Assassin Sniper[/U][/I] Equipped with the Hitman's Heatmaker and the Cozy Camper. Is able to headshot the players, but also easy to take down thanks to the damage vulnerability. Optional: Is not able to use his Kukri in close combat. [I][U]Street Sweeper[/U][/I] Uses the Cleaner's Carbine. Shoots at everyone, and get crits on kill. Basically, a kind of Demoknight that is effective also at medium and long ranges. [I][U]Bushwacka Sniper[/U][/I] Equipped with the Bushwacka. Spawns along with groups of Jarate Masters. [I][U]Arabian Shooter[/U][/I] A giant Sniperbot equipped with the SMG that shoots everyone until it goes down to 50% health, when it gets the Shanhanshah out and gets a speed boost, hunting everyone next to him. [B]Spy Bots:[/B] [I][U]Immortal Spy[/U][/I] A giant Spybot that shoots everyone with his revolver (or maybe the Enforcer instead), and activates his Dead Ringer when it gets to two thirds of his health bar, and again at one third left. Good luck trying to drain the DR cloak while this guy is almost immortal when he is invisible.

[QUOTE=BlindSniper17;43138673]I think that for Sniper Backpack Secondaries, an attribute to add additional base HP would be useful.[/QUOTE] Or the ability to pick up a small ammo pack or health kit. Would be useful in maps where it's hard to find health kits and ammo packs. So you could either help your team out with small health packs or small ammo packs, or just be a douche and hog them.

I feel weird for refusing to Mann Up without Supply tickets.

I would love it if scout had a "money vision" upgrade or something that lets him see an outline around money piles. Would make it much easier (perhaps too easy) to find that one random pile of $6 at the end of a wave that fell into a corner. [QUOTE=BlindSniper17;43138753]What I typically do is go to an increased MvM player server, pick some inexperienced class/loadout, and practice there.[/QUOTE] Every time I've joined one of those servers it's just 8 people as heavies murdering everything as soon as it spawns.

A bunch of you wanted more info on the upgrade exploit. Here's a video I put together. [video=youtube;hbn6Ps78opk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbn6Ps78opk[/video] It's probably still being processed but I have to run so I'll just post it now.

[QUOTE=Spectre1406;43142763]I feel weird for refusing to Mann Up without Supply tickets.[/QUOTE] It's probably because you're a generous person, and you want people to receive something after winning?

[QUOTE=Anderan;43143543]I would love it if scout had a "money vision" upgrade or something that lets him see an outline around money piles. Would make it much easier (perhaps too easy) to find that one random pile of $6 at the end of a wave that fell into a corner.[/quote] Not quite that but try [url=http://tf2.gamebanana.com/sprites/4558]this[/url]

[QUOTE=sergiuung;43144861]A bunch of you wanted more info on the upgrade exploit. Here's a video I put together. [video=youtube;hbn6Ps78opk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbn6Ps78opk[/video] It's probably still being processed but I have to run so I'll just post it now.[/QUOTE] So I was trying this out, but all I got was this: [t]http://i.imgur.com/ll6B4FL.png[/t] [t]http://i.imgur.com/goAr1jw.png[/t] (Replacing heal on kill with critboost on kill) Do they not work together or is it just fixed out?

[QUOTE=LightFlock;43145736]So I was trying this out, but all I got was this: [t]http://i.imgur.com/ll6B4FL.png[/t] [t]http://i.imgur.com/goAr1jw.png[/t] (Replacing heal on kill with critboost on kill) Do they not work together or is it just fixed out?[/QUOTE] I don't know. Haven't tried on a mann up server lately, it worked 3 days ago. They might have added some sort of temporary server side check. It still works on non official servers as I recorded it today. I'll try it on a mann up server tonight and report back.

[QUOTE=sergiuung;43144861]A bunch of you wanted more info on the upgrade exploit. Here's a video I put together. [video=youtube;hbn6Ps78opk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbn6Ps78opk[/video] It's probably still being processed but I have to run so I'll just post it now.[/QUOTE] does this risk a ban? or can valve not do anything about this other than patch it?

[QUOTE=sergiuung;43145904]I don't know. Haven't tried on a mann up server lately, it worked 3 days ago. They might have added some sort of temporary server side check. It still works on non official servers as I recorded it today. I'll try it on a mann up server tonight and report back.[/QUOTE] I wasn't on a mann up by the way, just to clarify.

[QUOTE=Spectre1406;43142763]I feel weird for refusing to Mann Up without Supply tickets.[/QUOTE] The extra weapons are not worth the 2 dollars. I always thought you get extra robot parts at least but that's' not the case.

[QUOTE=sergiuung;43144861]A bunch of you wanted more info on the upgrade exploit. Here's a video I put together. [video=youtube;hbn6Ps78opk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbn6Ps78opk[/video] It's probably still being processed but I have to run so I'll just post it now.[/QUOTE] not sure how this works and why changing the value of each upgrade's costs doesn't. like a much simpler exploit would be to just change every upgrade cost to 50, which doesn't work, but THIS does?

The upgrades won't work unless it's for a weapon that's supposed to have the upgrade in the first place Switching burn time+damage for crits on kill and firerate removed the upgrades outright from my flamethrower, but gave the flaregun two firerate upgrades.