Stuff that Annoys you in TF2: bind m1 say "( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)" edition - Games

I just hate that I can't gain tours because of little things I mess up that somehow completely ruin the game meanwhile my brother who has a very, very difficult time ever killing me in 1v1 games, finished like 13 tours and got himself an Australium Grenade Launcher

[QUOTE=Metaru;47594368]Its been months since they fixed the Turner. Get over it already.[/QUOTE] Its been months or even years sense any of the items you want changed have been added or altered, GET OVER IT, you see the problem with this. Whats youre favorite class or loadout in tf2 huh? what if valve nerfed it into uselessness in a way that sucked pretty much all of the fun out of the item. Would you still just get over it? Valve has shown that they will fix broken items eventually, they changed the soda popper years after its release, they gave the sticky launcher more well thought out nerf over 5 months after they reverted the original after it had been the same way for years. [QUOTE=Trilby Harlow;47594637]Tide turner is still way too good. Even if it was just the "hey here's your charge back for doing stuff" or just "yeah go wherever, that's cool", it'd be the best shield. As it is there's basically no reason to use the other shields unless you're weird and don't like being on fire or something[/QUOTE] As for comparing tide turner to the other shields like the targe and screen, thats like saying we should nerf the flare gun because it outclasses the manmelter and panic attack. It replaces stickies, get that through your head. Honestly I would like the screen to have turning and the targe reworked entirely. I wouldnt mind if resist were lowered or removed entirely. Without charge turning demoknight is at best a gimmick to stomp terrible low level valve pubs. I get that some players find the tide turner to be annoying and I understand that, but you can change the item so its more fun to fight against without completely screwing over people who enjoyed the argument. Although there are times where you have to just tell that in some instances the people complaining simply need to get better at the game. Like a new player who whines about the phlog saying its OP, but the second he learns to press the S key and not walk into the phlog pyro when he is crit boosted it suddenly becomes pretty easy to deal with.

[QUOTE=Lolkork;47599545]I think turbine is an excellent map, feels like all the classes can do their thing, and it's chaotic goodness without too much chokepoint spam. And it's fairly difficult to turtle because of how small it is.[/QUOTE] The mid is atrocious. Snipers rule supreme. Everything is visible from the balconies. It's flat so when you stand on the ground, sniping gets piss easy. There is no ammo. Spies have nothing to surf on their way to intel, you have to hang around the mid till you collect enough cloak from weapons. For other classes, you just want to cross that place firing as little ammo as possible so you can punch through intel defenses, which is difficult considering how open it is. Even the lobby before the intel room lacks ammo so it's entirely possible that you run out of ammo by the time you're done taking out all sentries and inhabitants and have to all the way back to resupply since there's no ammo inbetween. /of course ammo is not an issue if you tend to die before you run out, if you don't it's a real pain

[QUOTE=Drury;47602836]The mid is atrocious. Snipers rule supreme. Everything is visible from the balconies. It's flat so when you stand on the ground, sniping gets piss easy. There is no ammo. Spies have nothing to surf on their way to intel, you have to hang around the mid till you collect enough cloak from weapons. For other classes, you just want to cross that place firing as little ammo as possible so you can punch through intel defenses, which is difficult considering how open it is. Even the lobby before the intel room lacks ammo so it's entirely possible that you run out of ammo by the time you're done taking out all sentries and inhabitants and have to all the way back to resupply since there's no ammo inbetween. /of course ammo is not an issue if you tend to die before you run out, if you don't it's a real pain[/QUOTE] Its a good DM map, but thats about it.

it annoys me that enemy hitscan attacks are not realtime and already happened half a second ago compared to what you see like when you swing a melee at a scout and you see your hit land and all but he shot you 0.001 second before your swing actually happened it's not clear but you can feel it after a couple thousand hours

[QUOTE=poptart TF2;47600727]Its been months or even years sense any of the items you want changed have been added or altered, GET OVER IT, you see the problem with this. Whats youre favorite class or loadout in tf2 huh? what if valve nerfed it into uselessness in a way that sucked pretty much all of the fun out of the item. Would you still just get over it? Valve has shown that they will fix broken items eventually, they changed the soda popper years after its release, they gave the sticky launcher more well thought out nerf over 5 months after they reverted the original after it had been the same way for years.[/QUOTE] the turner was bad and pretty much everyone agreed about how it pretty much rendered the rest of the shields useless. the "fun" out of it was it not having downsides at all(it not being the sticky launcher is not a downside) with a braindead mechanic where you could spin endlessly until you crashed agaisnt something. as it is now, it actually encourages you to plan ahead and assault enemies by surprise around corners.

[QUOTE=Metaru;47605873]the turner was bad and pretty much everyone agreed about how it pretty much rendered the rest of the shields useless. the "fun" out of it was it not having downsides at all(it not being the sticky launcher is not a downside) with a braindead mechanic where you could spin endlessly until you crashed agaisnt something. as it is now, it actually encourages you to plan ahead and assault enemies by surprise around corners.[/QUOTE] everyone agreed, You have proof for that? Cus most people I know agreed it was fine, especially since it replaces stickies. Perhaps you should try paying attention to your sourroundings and listen for the loud screaming audio cue. Anything demoknight could do sniper could do 1,000 times better. Should we nerf sniper into the ground?

Compare the Tide Turner with it's base, the Chargin' Targe. Targe offers this: Move quickly but predictably for high damage. Can tank a few hits Tide Turner offers this: Move quickly and erratically for high damage Abuse map terrain for superb air mobility Kills refill charge meter The entire mantra for the shields was to take a risk and be rewarded with a critical melee strike. Moving in a predictable straight line is a very high risk, and the reward is an almost-guaranteed kill. It being so easy to counter makes it prime for being used in surprise attacks or to pursue a weakened foe, while still predictable. With the day 1 Tide Turner you're able to snake your way around incoming fire, where's the risk for that critical hit? Getting close to people? You getting close to people would carry the same risk with any other weapon, why is the Tide Turner suddenly special? If anything should have been changed, it'd should've been the critical strike. You get a stupid amount of mobility and you can make hairpin turns around corners where people have practically zero time to react to you zooming around. If anything, the critical hits should be mini-crits instead, forcing you to use your mobility to pursue weakened foes (thus refilling your charge and letting you zoom away) or for general mobility like you would with the Sticky Jumper. The niche that the TT was to fill was mobility, not raw killing power.

Something I could never stand with weapons with blood on them in TF2. First, the weapons with the unfitting "dried up, dark colored realistic" blood: [IMG]https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/c/c0/Axtinguisher.png/250px-Axtinguisher.png?t=20111119101944[/IMG][IMG]https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/f/f0/Eyelandertransparent.png/250px-Eyelandertransparent.png?t=20110506024213[/IMG][IMG]https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/b/bb/Scotsman%27s_skullcutter.png/250px-Scotsman%27s_skullcutter.png?t=20111211183954[/IMG][IMG]https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/5/55/Persian_Persuader.PNG/250px-Persian_Persuader.PNG?t=20110624021651[/IMG] Then there's the actually fitting "stylistic, semi-cartoonish" blood: [IMG]https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/3/35/RED_Ubersaw.png/250px-RED_Ubersaw.png?t=20111211050238[/IMG][IMG]https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/1/19/RED_Claidheamh_M%C3%B2r.png/250px-RED_Claidheamh_M%C3%B2r.png?t=20111210165215[/IMG][IMG]https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/2/25/TheBostonBasher.png/250px-TheBostonBasher.png?t=20140601154526[/IMG] On the other end of the spectrum there's the Equalizer, with the blood being way too cartoonish and looks like it's painted on instead: [IMG]https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/thumb/9/96/Equalizer.png/250px-Equalizer.png?t=20120628170841[/IMG] Really, it just contrasts way too much and looks ugly. The Ubersaw was also one of the [I]first weapons ever created[/I] so there's absolutely no excuse for the different styles of blood. In fact, just screw the concept of bloodied weapons all together: it breaks the entire mindset of keeping team color schemes from looking similar and conflict with one another as a result.

Are there any mods to remove blood? I'd use them.

[QUOTE=QUILTBAG;47606824]Are there any mods to remove blood? I'd use them.[/QUOTE] Here: [url]http://tf2.gamebanana.com/skins/138833[/url]

[QUOTE=Psychopath12;47606270]Compare the Tide Turner with it's base, the Chargin' Targe. Targe offers this: Move quickly but predictably for high damage. Can tank a few hits Tide Turner offers this: Move quickly and erratically for high damage Abuse map terrain for superb air mobility Kills refill charge meter The entire mantra for the shields was to take a risk and be rewarded with a critical melee strike. Moving in a predictable straight line is a very high risk, and the reward is an almost-guaranteed kill. It being so easy to counter makes it prime for being used in surprise attacks or to pursue a weakened foe, while still predictable. With the day 1 Tide Turner you're able to snake your way around incoming fire, where's the risk for that critical hit? Getting close to people? You getting close to people would carry the same risk with any other weapon, why is the Tide Turner suddenly special? If anything should have been changed, it'd should've been the critical strike. You get a stupid amount of mobility and you can make hairpin turns around corners where people have practically zero time to react to you zooming around. If anything, the critical hits should be mini-crits instead, forcing you to use your mobility to pursue weakened foes (thus refilling your charge and letting you zoom away) or for general mobility like you would with the Sticky Jumper. The niche that the TT was to fill was mobility, not raw killing power.[/QUOTE] Moving predictable is what makes the shields suck against players who know how to WASD. Seriously try getting kills with the targe outside of low tier pubs. Honestly the tide turner is what demoknight should have been from the beginning. Who are you to say what a weapon is meant to be used for? Should we nerf gunboats because they give soldier a stupid amount of mobility. Shooting feet is way easier than landing a sword crit, and its more effective.

[QUOTE=poptart TF2;47606871]Moving predictable is what makes the shields suck against players who know how to WASD.[/quote] This is exactly why I stated that they're best used on unaware players or fleeing players. [quote]Seriously try getting kills with the targe outside of low tier pubs.[/quote] Targe kills in general are hard enough as it is. You mean to say melee kills, and even that doesn't even acknowledge that the Targe was created with the intent of having a tanky grenadier berserker hybrid. It's no Stickybomb Launcher, but the Grenade Launcher is a force of its own to reckon with. [quote]Honestly the tide turner is what demoknight should have been from the beginning.[/quote]Debatable. Just because you have a hard-on for it doesn't make you right. [quote]Who are you to say what a weapon is meant to be used for?[/quote] Have you ever made a game? [quote]Should we nerf gunboats because they give soldier a stupid amount of mobility. Shooting feet is way easier than landing a sword crit, and its more effective.[/QUOTE] The Gunboats were [I]designed[/I] for mobility, the shields were not. In fact, the shield was originally so restrictive to mobility that a simple bit of knockback would ruin everything. But that wasn't the reason people used the shield back then, back then the shield had a ridiculous amount of resistances on top of self-damage resistance. It made for a tanky grenadier as I had mentioned beforehand. The eyelander synergy was added as a tool to append to the grenades-only loadout it created. It rewarded players who picked off stragglers or surprised an opponent; the reward was better health and speed. Also you're comparing apples to oranges. You brought up mobility but then you instead compare it to damage dealing. Shooting your feet is to Gunboats as is pressing M2 is to Tide Turner. How well someone controls themselves once in motion was never brought up for discussion, neither was getting kills while under the mobility-enhancing effects of either.

[QUOTE=Psychopath12;47606970]This is exactly why I stated that they're best used on unaware players or fleeing players.[/QUOTE] Unaware and retreating, so you mean terrible players who just installed the game 5 minutes ago? [QUOTE] Targe kills in general are hard enough as it is. You mean to say melee kills, and even that doesn't even acknowledge that the Targe was created with the intent of having a tanky grenadier berserker hybrid. It's no Stickybomb Launcher, but the Grenade Launcher is a force of its own to reckon with.[/QUOTE] Umm you have interviews from valve saying this or is this, like most of what you said just personal assumption. The fact that the item is a shield and not an assault vest in addition to the fact that the word KNIGHT is in the title its pretty obvious melee combat is more likely to be the focus. [QUOTE]Debatable. Just because you have a hard-on for it doesn't make you right.[/QUOTE] Real mature there, you have actual reasoning or logic to support that? [QUOTE]Have you ever made a game?[/QUOTE] You're the one claiming you know valves intentions not me. [QUOTE]The Gunboats were [I]designed[/I] for mobility, the shields were not. In fact, the shield was originally so restrictive to mobility that a simple bit of knockback would ruin everything. But that wasn't the reason people used the shield back then, back then the shield had a ridiculous amount of resistances on top of self-damage resistance. It made for a tanky grenadier as I had mentioned beforehand. The eyelander synergy was added as a tool to append to the grenades-only loadout it created. It rewarded players who picked off stragglers or surprised an opponent; the reward was better health and speed.[/QUOTE] Thats what targe is, I dont personally consider targe the same as demoknight. Mainly because its skill ceiling is far lower than the tide turner or sticky launcher. It is pretty badly designed too, at least with the black box you have to land rockets to tank hits, the demo gets essentially 300 health against fire and explosive with no effort on his part. [QUOTE] Also you're comparing apples to oranges. You brought up mobility but then you instead compare it to damage dealing. Shooting your feet is to Gunboats as is pressing M2 is to Tide Turner. How well someone controls themselves once in motion was never brought up for discussion, neither was getting kills while under the mobility-enhancing effects of either.[/QUOTE] You said tide turner gives an insane amount of mobility, gunboats actually give greater mobility while still allowing the soldier to maintain the rocket launcher, which is far more reliable weapon than the grenade launcher, theres a reason its so heavily used in high level competitve play. Unlike the prenerf tide turner, which was inferior to stock stickies anyway.

When somebody decides to hold the intel and not cap it just to be a dick

[QUOTE=poptart TF2;47607205]Unaware and retreating, so you mean terrible players who just installed the game 5 minutes ago?[/quote] You are insinuating that anyone that doesn't know everything ever or has to retreat from the frontline for health has only had the game installed for a mere 5 minutes. Shut up. [quote]Umm you have interviews from valve saying this or is this, like most of what you said just personal assumption.[/quote] You tend to pick up on things when you play the game with the developers. It also helps to have experience creating games yourself, as it becomes more easy to recognize design choices behind additions and alterations. [quote]The fact that the item is a shield and not an assault vest in addition to the fact that the word KNIGHT is in the title its pretty obvious melee combat is more likely to be the focus.[/quote] "Knight" wasn't in the title until Uber update, and that name was given by a [i]community member[/i]. The official name for the subclass's tools was [i]Close-Combat Kit[/i]. Also, an item that's 100% passive is pretty boring. I have no doubts that the targe started out that way, and through testing they found it was more fun to have some sort of synergy with the only other weapon the Demoman had on his person: his melee. The WAR update attempted to appeal to Demomen who [i]didn't[/i] use the stickybomb launcher. It primarily appealed to Demomen who primarily used their grenades and fell back on stickytraps to cover their weaknesses. This is where the Scottish Resistance came into play, as it was horrid for offensive pushes but worked well when covering one's self while reloading pipes. The Targe was the answer to Demomen who didn't want a stickybomb launcher to rely on at all, and through iterative changes became what it was on release. I know you'll attempt to bring up the Gunboats as a passive, but that's mostly untrue. While it is technically a passive item, the benefit it offers is strictly active. If you were to never attempt to rocketjump, you'd never feel its effects. Contrast with a fully-passive item like the Danger Shield, it matters not what you do, you just feel it's effects all the time. [quote]Real mature there, you have actual reasoning or logic to support that?[/quote] Time and time again you bring up how the shields are inferior to the stickybomb launcher. Until you see a plank of wood shooting explosives out of it, it will never be the same. It's simply a disproportionate comparison. You're isolating the weapons as themselves and not the Demo loadouts it's created to compare. Stock: Most power, extreme vulnerability and self-damage. Very versatile. CCK: Good power, tanky, pursuit-based quick-kills. Good at direct combat. Full Demoknight: No power, tanky, relies entirely on melee. Must catch people who are distracted, straggling, or otherwise vulnerable. Pipes + ScoRes: Solid power, extreme vulnerability and self-damage. Operates best in fallback situations. And so forth. You're out of your mind if you think you could create a new combination that's as strictly potent as the stickybomb launcher + pipes, because that's what the stickybomb launcher + pipes are for. Each alternative in those 2 slots prompt a playstyle change that usually sways them toward using grenades more frequently. Stickies are challenging to balance against, but creating alternative ways to encourage grenade-play is what pretty much every non-stock non-melee Demoman weapon has done (aside from Ali Baba's Wee Booties, B.A.S.E. Jumper, and Quickiebomb Launcher). [quote]You're the one claiming you know valves intentions not me.[/quote]See above [quote]Thats what targe is, I dont personally consider targe the same as demoknight. Mainly because its skill ceiling is far lower than the tide turner or sticky launcher. It is pretty badly designed too, at least with the black box you have to land rockets to tank hits, the demo gets essentially 300 health against fire and explosive with no effort on his part.[/quote] Again, isolating weapons and not recognizing combinations and their implicit changes to one's style of play. [quote]You said tide turner gives an insane amount of mobility, gunboats actually give greater mobility while still allowing the soldier to maintain the rocket launcher, which is far more reliable weapon than the grenade launcher, theres a reason its so heavily used in high level competitve play. Unlike the prenerf tide turner, which was inferior to stock stickies anyway.[/QUOTE] I am comparing shields to shields, not shields to shoes. The Tide Turner wins that hands-down. If there's one theme that's been pretty consistent in TF2 weapon design, it's a tendency to design 3 different variants on the same thing. Resisting damage. Dealing damage. Movement. All three rely on the player resource of: health, damage, positioning. Medigun, Kritzkrieg, Quick-Fix. Battalion's Backup, Buff Banner, Concheror. Backscratcher, Axtinguisher, Powerjack. And so forth. They do bleed into one another, but a large majority of weapon variants tend to abide by this pattern. It'd be sensible for the shield pattern to be Chargin' Targe, Splendid Screen, Tide Turner. But the issue is that for mobility, it offers the same offensive capability as its brethren while simultaneously being [i]easier[/i] to get in-range for due to the steering control one would get with it. Things that are easier to perform should reasonably have a lower payoff. This goes back to my earlier point outlining how it'd be reasonable for the Tide Turner to be reverted to its launch version, but with minicrits only. You want to fly around? Go right ahead. You hit someone with a pipe and they're fleeing? You can chase them down and lop that 88 health off for them. Mindful charges are what separates a good grenadier and a bad one, since it's so predictable you [i]need[/i] to jar your opponent pretty hard if you're planning on running straight into their face. Why the TT got what is, compared to the other shields, a free pass isn't fair when comparing them against one another. You can argue about how shields aren't stickylaunchers until you're blue in the face, but you'd be missing the point.

[thumb]http://www.sourceop.com/hell-met/TF2/unsync.jpg[/thumb] this is the only videogame i've ever played that has an engine so much full of shit it gives you free wallhacks

The Tide Turner was absolutely stupid in its inception and I hated it. I would've much preferred they made the crit swing only a mini crit swing instead of the somewhat peculiar halt-on-any-damage downside, but better an underpowered but still serviceable and fun weapon than a terribly annoying one

Tide Turner is honestly probably the only weapon I thought had no place being put in the game Before Tide Turner, Demoknight was completely fine. You had the ability to right-click and become the fastest class in the game with free critical hits, at the cost of losing the most powerful mid range weapon in the game and you could only move in a straight line. Then Booties came along, and you could have extra survivability and be able to [I]freely control your movement while you were still the fastest class in the game with free critical hits[/I], at the cost of, again, losing a very powerful mid range weapon. Then Tide Turner came along and said "Lol, you can now move around freely while still having one of the most powerful mid range weapons in the game. Also you have extra resistances because fuck balance. Also, that whole "fastest class in the game with free crits" thing? You can do that more often now." It completely destroyed the Booties' primary purpose and Demoknight as a whole; you couldn't play on any pub without a black guy with a wheel on his arm. It was stupid and it "fixed" a problem that didn't exist in the first place. It's not much better now.

i would like to note here that most original variants of the targe already had the tide turning with a couple binds

I never really noticed any significant difference in control with the booties on, but then again I never really played demoknight back before the tide turner was released. I also could never get the turning controls unlocked not matter what I did.

[QUOTE=Anderan;47608470]I never really noticed any significant difference in control with the booties on, but then again I never really played demoknight back before the tide turner was released.[/QUOTE] the booties never did anything if they actually made it so that you could turn like with the tide turner with the booties, the tide turner wouldn't exist today

they actually had to patch the turning the booties were suposed to give you years later.

I hate the fact that the shields can give you a guaranteed crit at literally any range with the most generous window of timing possible.

[QUOTE=Trekintosh;47609190]I hate the fact that the shields can give you a guaranteed crit at literally any range with the most generous window of timing possible.[/QUOTE] Only if the one with the shield isn't you.

[QUOTE=QUILTBAG;47606824]Are there any mods to remove blood? I'd use them.[/QUOTE] German TF2. We got oil bleeding robots (with human skin/voice), no blood decals and silly gibs before it was cool. [B]I hate it.[/B] You can barely see the oil bleeding effect and the silly gibs tend to cover dropped weapons.

they could just disable bash-n-slash for the tide turner and remove the charge cancel thing. you could still do a distance crit but you would have to race around the enemy to trigger it. whoaaa balance.

[QUOTE=Hell-met;47611208]they could just disable bash-n-slash for the tide turner and remove the charge cancel thing. you could still do a distance crit but you would have to race around the enemy to trigger it. whoaaa balance.[/QUOTE] Id be fine with that, most demoknight enthusiasts including myself find the bash crits to be stupid anyway, this is what im talking about, making knights fun to fight against without screwing them over.

[QUOTE=Trech;47610837]German TF2. We got oil bleeding robots (with human skin/voice), no blood decals and silly gibs before it was cool. [B]I hate it.[/B] You can barely see the oil bleeding effect and the silly gibs tend to cover dropped weapons.[/QUOTE] With the help of my german friend, I figured out how to bypass it. Someone from outside of Germany has to give you the access to their game library via Steam Family Sharing (Teamviewer may help).

[QUOTE=Hell-met;47611208]they could just disable bash-n-slash for the tide turner and remove the charge cancel thing. you could still do a distance crit but you would have to race around the enemy to trigger it. whoaaa balance.[/QUOTE] Bash-n-slash as in 'bash an enemy at any range, get free crit because Splendid Screen broke everything'? Because if so, I can support removing that horseshit from every shield