I am actually quite pleased with this smissmas update even if it was mostly cosmetic based. Also, good job people who got their items in.
[QUOTE=qubestf2;52998302]Says the contributor to the balloonicorn hat lol.[/QUOTE]
Yeah thats why, I'm not gonna change what I make because some people don't like it. Neither will anyone else. Part of the reason I love doing stuff for TF2 is that I can do whatever. If you don't like whats getting added then complain to Valve, not the people who make it.
[QUOTE=SediSocks;52998312]Yeah thats why, I'm not gonna change what I make because some people don't like it. Neither will anyone else. Part of the reason I love doing stuff for TF2 is that I can do whatever. If you don't like whats getting added then complain to Valve, not the people who make it.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Punchy;52998296]It's not a matter of expecting them to listen, i'm well past that point. It's a matter of shifting public opinion- which IS what valve listens to. Whether or not that happens, the day everyone gives up and stops because they can't be bothered is the day the game officially dies because it's no longer held to any standard.[/QUOTE]
Well, there you go, Funke.
How do you expect us to do anything when even the hat designers go against the art style idea.
It's lost hope.
Art style is dead, and It's not gonna change it because there's not enough people who wants to change it.
[QUOTE=Zadrave;52998197]Jesus you guys act like it's the end of the world that tf2 has silly hats when that was a thing since 8+ years ago[/QUOTE]
People should be more angry over yet another garbage Smissmas update and only one major update per year.
[QUOTE=Lord Exor;52998319]People should be more angry over yet another garbage Smissmas update and only one major update per year.[/QUOTE]
Don't expect a major update yet, the jungle inferno missions didn't even end yet.
I'm assuming Heavy Update is going to have new "Operation".
So untill this one is done, don't expect any major updates.
[QUOTE=SediSocks;52998312]Yeah thats why, I'm not gonna change what I make because some people don't like it. Neither will anyone else. Part of the reason I love doing stuff for TF2 is that I can do whatever. If you don't like whats getting added then complain to Valve, not the people who make it.[/QUOTE]
I don't think anyone means to sound rude, but it really does seem like people are putting "doing what they love" ahead of things like the workshop guidelines and art style consistency for the overall user experience.
We can't blame valve for that, when the workshop is full of items like this.
[QUOTE=qubestf2;52998316]Well, there you go, Funke.
How do you expect us to do anything when even the hat designers go against the art style idea.
It's lost hope.
Art style is dead, and It's not gonna change it because there's not enough people who wants to change it.[/QUOTE]
If I conform my opinion to a epic youtuber, maybe people on Facepunch will think that I am epic!
[QUOTE=C. Blades;52998328]I don't think anyone means to sound rude, but it really does seem like people are putting "doing what they love" ahead of things like the workshop guidelines and art style consistency for the overall use experience.
We can't blame valve for that, when the workshop is full of items like this.[/QUOTE]
We can blame Valve for picking those Items, though.
[QUOTE=Rageguy;52998331]If I conform my opinion to a epic youtuber, maybe people on Facepunch will think that I am epic![/QUOTE]
Yeah lets just ignore all the other things I just disagreed with him 5 minutes ago!
[QUOTE=qubestf2;52998332]We can blame Valve for picking those Items, though.
Yeah lets just ignore all the other things I just disagreed with him 5 minutes ago![/QUOTE]
brainlet lol
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Why reply?" - Shendow))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=Rageguy;52998334]brainlet lol[/QUOTE]
Artstyle killers rejoice.
Thanks for the reply tho.
[QUOTE=qubestf2;52998332]We can blame Valve for picking those Items, though.
Yeah lets just ignore all the other things I just disagreed with him 5 minutes ago![/QUOTE]
What, are they supposed to [I]not[/I] pick the most well made and popular items, voted up by the- (this terminology is entirely too toxic and just plain rude)
[QUOTE=casass;52997880]They know a portion of their audience is furfags and horsefuckers so they tend to cater to them.[/QUOTE]
Crowd? I think not. They're kind of in a bind with what's in front of them.
pretty sure the majority of contributors do it for the monies and couldnt care less about tf2 as a game
[QUOTE=C. Blades;52998328]I don't think anyone means to sound rude, but it really does seem like people are putting "doing what they love" ahead of things like the workshop guidelines and art style consistency for the overall user experience.
We can't blame valve for that, when the workshop is full of items like this.[/QUOTE]
Its fully up to Valve what they add to the game. The workshop is full of fitting stuff that hasn't been added so its not like there's a shortage of that kind of thing. I've got a ton of stuff that's fitting on my workshop that hasn't been accepted so it's not like I'm only submitting unfitting stuff.
[QUOTE=C. Blades;52998338]What, are they supposed to [I]not[/I] pick the most well made and popular items, voted up by the- (this terminology is entirely too toxic and rude however).[/QUOTE]
They don't do it for CSGO often.
[QUOTE=Hell-met;52998340]pretty sure the majority of contributors do it for the monies and couldnt care less about tf2 as a game[/QUOTE]
If I was in this for the money I'd have moved to DOTA years ago
[QUOTE=C. Blades;52998328]I don't think anyone means to sound rude, but it really does seem like people are putting "doing what they love" ahead of things like the workshop guidelines and art style consistency for the overall user experience.
We can't blame valve for that, when the workshop is full of items like this.[/QUOTE]
because if we conformed to the proverbial "artstyle" we'd be making the same drab unassuming baseball caps and helmets and fedoras that have been made since 2009
shoving the "artstyle" in the face of artists is disrespectful and only serves to stifle creativity; something TF2 is a mecca of, an environment where artists of all backgrounds can come and flex their creative muscles
Virtually nothing really goes against TF2's "artstyle" because TF2 is not the serious, gritty, action-packed FPS experience you thought it ever was. TF2 is a breeding ground for creativity and design and has been since launch with mod support and later officially with the advent of the workshop
[QUOTE=C. Blades;52998328]I don't think anyone means to sound rude, but it really does seem like people are putting "doing what they love" ahead of things like the workshop guidelines and art style consistency for the overall user experience.
We can't blame valve for that, when the workshop is full of items like this.[/QUOTE]
well i mean, the middleman in the workshop is literally valve. valve have to personally inspect and accept every item.. donhonk, neodement, sedisocks and myself all have an abundance of unaccepted military items and items that better fit the style, yet we keep getting items like the cat hoodie and the dog in game, it's valves choice
[QUOTE=Hell-met;52998340]pretty sure the majority of contributors do it for the monies and couldnt care less about tf2 as a game[/QUOTE]
this is not true at all lol
[QUOTE=SediSocks;52998341]Its fully up to Valve what they add to the game. The workshop is full of fitting stuff that hasn't been added so its not like there's a shortage of that kind of thing. I've got a ton of stuff that's fitting on my workshop that hasn't been accepted so it's not like I'm only submitting unfitting stuff.[/QUOTE]
So... You're saying people are free to make these art style consistency-breaking things all they like, with the handy "blame valve if it gets accepted" card in their back pocket, so they don't have to worry about contributing to the continual leak of pyroland into the real world?
I've got a lot of respect for you in particular and the modeling community, but I'm really just confused here.
That thought process doesn't seem very orderly.
My 2 cents as someone who makes Dota stuff: unicorn hats don't break the art style.
Having the option to paint them pink and lime, while wearing an unusual hat, an australium festive unusual professional lightning gun, and also wearing a santa coat with cowboy boots does.
Blaming this on the workshop guys is retarded because not a single hat breaks the art style on it's own. Not even the banana hat or the Max's head. As Ikes said, if you adhere 101% to the "guidelines" that even valve breaks, you'd have the same shit x200. Could they accept more "fitting" hats instead of mostly "unfitting" ones? Sure. They could also stop breaking sets when accepting them so maybe people would have less of a reason to look like mismatched retards.
IMO the (main) problem is that there's too much "it's rare and expensive so who cares" on different slots, and when combined you get the art style breaking shit. So blame Valve for doing all that shit and not keeping it to unusual hats.
also just gonna add this, the thing that is dying is the theme, not the art style, art style and theme are completely different things.
most well known contributors still make all of their items fit the art style but sometimes make some wackier themed stuff like balloonicorn hats and such, but the art style on those wacky items still fit the art style of tf.
the whole cold war/spy tech theme shit has been dead for years, it's TOO too late to fix this, just simply don't wear the wacky themed cosmetics if you don't prefer them.
[QUOTE=DatHarry;52998352]well i mean, the middleman in the workshop is literally valve. valve have to personally inspect and accept every item.. donhonk, neodement, sedisocks and myself all have an abundance of unaccepted military items and items that better fit the style, yet we keep getting items like the cat hoodie and the dog in game, it's valves choice[/QUOTE]
Exactly this. If Valve is accepting stupid items over consistent ones, what are people going to do? Keep making consistent items? Yeah, they can do that but in the end it's less likely to be accepted which also means less money on the table for contributors. It's 100% Valve's fault. And it all started to go downhill ever since the good 'ol banana hat.
[QUOTE=Zadrave;52998369]Exactly this. If Valve is accepting stupid items over consistent ones, what are people going to do? Keep making consistent items? Yeah, they can do that but in the end it's less likely to be accepted which also means less money on the table for contributors. It's 100% Valve's fault.[/QUOTE]
Returning to my first post about this.
Valve doesn't care and will not listen to our opinions.
[QUOTE=C. Blades;52998355]So... You're saying people are free to make these art style consistency-breaking things all they like, with the handy "blame valve if it gets accepted" card in their back pocket, so they don't have to worry about contributing to the continual leak of pyroland into the real world?
I've got a lot of respect for you in particular and the modeling community, but I'm really just confused here.
That thought process doesn't seem very orderly.[/QUOTE]
I guess I am saying that? My ratio of fitting items to unfitting ones on my workshop is probably 10:1, if Valve keeps adding the unfitting ones that's not my problem. I don't think I should stop making the items people deem unfitting purely because people don't want Valve to add them.
Contributors push the artstyle because valve allows them to. Years ago nobody would even think of making many hats they do now at any time aside from halloween. Once valve began implementing the horrid crate tiers, everything became game.
Workshop voters are extremely manipulatable. The more absurd and outlandish, the more buzz you create. The more buzz, the better chance it's added. It's a self sustaining cycle.
To stop this, yes contributors could theoretically quit abusing the artstyle with the intent of high tier additions, but that makes no sense because it's their role to make items and whatever has the best chance logically will be made.
So you go to the next step, valve, who decide what's added. But guess what, valve doesn't give a flying fuck how many outlandish items stack over the years.
So this leaves you with the only real way the community has any power, and that's as a sum of our parts. If you get enough people to show backlash, valve will stop. There are plenty of artstyle items in the workshop valve ignores in favor of ones more likely to generate key sales.
Want valve to fix their theme? Stop buying cases.
[QUOTE=SediSocks;52998376] I don't think I should stop making the items people deem unfitting purely because people don't want Valve to add them.[/QUOTE]
That kind of seems to go against the point of the workshop on two counts, first valve ignoring the feedback and art theme and selecting items that are purposefully unfitting over the normal ones, and secondly item makers publishing these items even though people [I]don't [/I] want them added to the game.
This is a strange world we live in. Thank you for clearing that up, I'll accept this as reality and go buy myself a hoodie now :v:
[QUOTE=Punchy;52998388]Contributors push the artstyle because valve allows them to. Years ago nobody would even think of making many hats they do now at any time aside from halloween. Once valve began implementing the horrid crate tiers, everything became game.
Workshop voters are extremely manipulatable. The more absurd and outlandish, the more buzz you create. The more buzz, the better chance it's added. It's a self sustaining cycle.
To stop this, yes contributors could theoretically quit abusing the artstyle with the intent of high tier additions, but that makes no sense because it's their role to make items and whatever has the best chance logically will be made.
So you go to the next step, valve, who decide what's added. But guess what, valve doesn't give a flying fuck how many outlandish items stack over the years.
So this leaves you with the only real way the community has any power, and that's as a sum of our parts. If you get enough people to show backlash, valve will stop. There are plenty of artstyle items in the workshop valve ignores in favor of ones more likely to generate key sales.
Want valve to fix their theme? Stop buying cases.[/QUOTE]
Do you still have hope that anything will change since my post arguing with you that we can't do anything about this?
Valve doesn't care neither do hat creators. It's a lost battle already.
[QUOTE=C. Blades;52998389]That kind of seems to go against the point of the workshop on two counts, first valve ignoring the feedback and art theme and selecting items that are purposefully unfitting over the normal ones, and secondly item makers publishing these items even though people [I]don't [/I] want them added to the game.[/QUOTE]
There's a section of people that don't want them, but there's also people that [I]do[/I] want them. The Balloonihoodie was sitting at an 88% approval rating before it got added, and I've had lots of messages and comments saying that they're happy the hat got added. If the majority of people really don't want this kind of item then they should be on the workshop downvoting them.
i mean don't get me wrong, if you have issues with the items that are selected by all means protest with your wallet or make your opinion heard to valve, there's absolutely nothing wrong with being annoyed about the selection of items or anything valve does in general
bbbbut if you're gonna slam workshop contributors about it, go check their workshop files first becuase you will find that a majority of their items (outside of halloween) will be significantly more fitting to the games theme and yet sit there unaccepted for years
at the end of the day, from my pov it doesn't really matter. i can choose to wear what i want and i rarely spend too much time even noticing cosmetics on other characters, i def understand if people arent happy with the picks valve make but the majority of people are happy with it and at very little cost to your gameplay experience.
Not only that but a BIG portion of TF2's playerbase is either meme spouting idiots, furries, people below the age of 14, and others.
And those are the people who [I]eat these items up.[/I] And probably praise these items. So in the end, probably the majority of the community couldn't give a shit about the items, or actually love them.
[QUOTE=SediSocks;52998405]There's a section of people that don't want them, but there's also people that [I]do[/I] want them. The Balloonihoodie was sitting at an 88% approval rating before it got added, and I've had lots of messages and comments saying that they're happy the hat got added. If the majority of people really don't want this kind of item then they should be on the workshop downvoting them.[/QUOTE]
I suppose it would be useless to point out that those people are largely the ones who don't give a damn about the artstyle to begin with...
Ah whatever. If valve, the item fans, and the contributors are fine with this sort of thing, we might as well update the promotional and box art to something the game more accurately resembles, because the in-game visual theme is now no longer what's being advertised.
Slap some unicorns and rainbows on the meet the team videos and store images and see how that affects player counts.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.
