Stuff that Annoys you in TF2: MS Paint Crocket Edition - Games

[QUOTE=Oizen;49828369]Demoman can do this no matter what you bring. This is just a fact, the RR or Shotgun are completely irrelevant. What are you going to do against demoman with a shotgun? Leave your nest with 125 hp to fight the class designed for killing, who can destroy you at mid range? Even with a regular shot gun, good luck.[/QUOTE] You have two options. 1. Shoot the stickies 2. Sneak up to the corner the demoman is spamming from and shoot him in the face at point blank. He tries to kill you, he blows himself up. He doesn't, he dies. Win-win. Doing the latter might cost you your sentry, but provided there's no followup, that's not a huge price to pay considering how fast those things set up now. Huge engi buff. [quote]I'm pretty sure Engineer's main duties is maintaining his nest, anything else is just extra.[/quote] [quote]Engineer vs Spy. Engineer is at an advantage by default.[/quote] [quote]I dont think you're playing Engineer correctly if pyros are getting at your sentry. How does a class like pyro, a class with no range in the slightest even phase your sentry gun?[/quote] Something tells me you don't know quite enough about the class to discuss it's balance. To back this up: Yes, an engineer's main priority is keeping his nest up, but in this context it sounds like you count protecting it as not maintaining it and rather put it in the category of "just extra," which is bizarre considering it doesn't take much time to get everything up to level 3 if you know your shit, and past that point there's not much else to do. You want to walk rounds around your sentry's blind spots with your weapon out looking for anyone trying to cornerspam it and nail them if they do. Remember, you have your sentry always handy, you can walk into it at any time to go heal up at your dispenser in peace, they most likely can't. Just camping in the corner with your wrench/RR out ready to repair whenever your sentry happens to take damage by something you didn't see coming is a gibus-grade strategy. Spy has the upper hand over the engineer in most situations. He counters the engineer. All of his weapons are designed to torture engineers. His invisibility, disguise and sappers make him immune to sentry guns. He screws up, he can cloak without repercussions, especially since the sapper buff. Alternatively, use the dead ringer to disengage safely. If he doesn't screw up, he has a variety of options - backstab the engineer, kill him with 3 revolver shots, or a headshot+bodyshot from ambassador. If the engineer goes for melee attacks, he's setting himself up to get facestabbed. If he goes for his shotgun, he still has to get his bearings quickly - the Spy got a drop on him, he doesn't face this issue. If he has RR equipped, he's dead on the spot. If the Spy disengages and had red tape, he already did the damage. If the engineer had jag equipped, he can have the fun of upgrading everything by two levels again. Then, naturally, if the engineer does something stupid like go for sappers rather than the spy, that's a lost fight right there. However you look at it, the moment the Spy sets his eyes on your sentry, it's his game, and he's the one who calls the shots. Things only ever work out in the engineer's favor when there's a significant skill gap or some teamwork going on on his side (a factor just as easily gained by the Spy). Generally, most of my engineer engagements start and end in under a second, with the engineer backstabbed and everything he built sapped. The "smart" ones that box themselves in a corner eat lead instead. The actual smart ones get [url=https://youtu.be/7O-bD6eOvFs?t=239]harassed until they lose their minds[/url] and go pyro. The Spy truly holds all the cards here. Pyros can be dangerous to certain sentry positions which are generally strong unless flanked from a weird angle from which they can be corner spammed. Flamethrower actually does a decent damage against sentry guns. It does happen every so often to engineers who decide not to do that certain "just extra" so yes shotgun is quite pivotal here. You don't stand a chance against pyros doing that unless you have a shotgun.

RR is the only thing that stops the engineer class from having literally zero different way to play than if you were stuck with stock (excluding gslinger) and like I said it already got nerfed hard. 75 -> 60 healing is a big deal for rockets and pipes intervals

Uncle Dane would laugh if he saw this discussion...

[QUOTE=Drury;49828601]You have two options. 1. Shoot the stickies 2. Sneak up to the corner the demoman is spamming from and shoot him in the face at point blank. He tries to kill you, he blows himself up. He doesn't, he dies. Win-win. Doing the latter might cost you your sentry, but provided there's no followup, that's not a huge price to pay considering how fast those things set up now. Huge engi buff. Something tells me you don't know quite enough about the class to discuss it's balance. To back this up: Yes, an engineer's main priority is keeping his nest up, but in this context it sounds like you count protecting it as not maintaining it and rather put it in the category of "just extra," which is bizarre considering it doesn't take much time to get everything up to level 3 if you know your shit, and past that point there's not much else to do. You want to walk rounds around your sentry's blind spots with your weapon out looking for anyone trying to cornerspam it and nail them if they do. Remember, you have your sentry always handy, you can walk into it at any time to go heal up at your dispenser in peace, they most likely can't. Just camping in the corner with your wrench/RR out ready to repair whenever your sentry happens to take damage by something you didn't see coming is a gibus-grade strategy. Spy has the upper hand over the engineer in most situations. He counters the engineer. All of his weapons are designed to torture engineers. His invisibility, disguise and sappers make him immune to sentry guns. He screws up, he can cloak without repercussions, especially since the sapper buff. Alternatively, use the dead ringer to disengage safely. If he doesn't screw up, he has a variety of options - backstab the engineer, kill him with 3 revolver shots, or a headshot+bodyshot from ambassador. If the engineer goes for melee attacks, he's setting himself up to get facestabbed. If he goes for his shotgun, he still has to get his bearings quickly - the Spy got a drop on him, he doesn't face this issue. If he has RR equipped, he's dead on the spot. If the Spy disengages and had red tape, he already did the damage. If the engineer had jag equipped, he can have the fun of upgrading everything by two levels again. Then, naturally, if the engineer does something stupid like go for sappers rather than the spy, that's a lost fight right there. However you look at it, the moment the Spy sets his eyes on your sentry, it's his game, and he's the one who calls the shots. Things only ever work out in the engineer's favor when there's a significant skill gap or some teamwork going on on his side (a factor just as easily gained by the Spy). Generally, most of my engineer engagements start and end in under a second, with the engineer backstabbed and everything he built sapped. The "smart" ones that box themselves in a corner eat lead instead. The actual smart ones get [url=https://youtu.be/7O-bD6eOvFs?t=239]harassed until they lose their minds[/url] and go pyro. The Spy truly holds all the cards here. Pyros can be dangerous to certain sentry positions which are generally strong unless flanked from a weird angle from which they can be corner spammed. Flamethrower actually does a decent damage against sentry guns. It does happen every so often to engineers who decide not to do that certain "just extra" so yes shotgun is quite pivotal here. You don't stand a chance against pyros doing that unless you have a shotgun.[/QUOTE] It is now when I realize that I am the only one here who actually utilizes the essentially unlimited ammo pistol to fight things. In terms of weapons, Engineer outguns spy. Stronger Melee, stronger primary, plus a secondary. The Knife is a pretty terribly melee weapon, no crits, low damage, unless you're just going to offer your back to him, you really shouldnt be losing in a melee fight with a wrench. Due to how critical chance works in tf2, engineer actually can have a good deal of crit, up to 65%. This will oneshot the spy from any direction. But even if its just two idiots meleing eachother, the wrench will take out 125 hp before the knife does. I'm not seeing how spy is at an advantage. If you even know the spy class exists, theres some pretty obvious things you can exploit to prevent spies from destroying your shit. And if there 2+ people in the area the spy is just 100% fucked. But lets keep it at 1v1 for the sake of convenience, despite the fact that rarely actually happens with engineers. If we're actually using decent players in a scenario, you're massively underestimating Engineer. Invisibility only get him into the nest, if he makes any aggressive action towards you he has to place the sapper first. Which means that person on your team running towards your sentry rather than your dispenser is most likely a spy. Your best bet is to kill the spy before removing the sapper, most idiot engineers dont do this, and give the spy the time the actually get revolver shots off. Most smart engineers stay in a place where backstabbing isn't an option and force this scenario to play out. Even if the dead ringer plays out, you just need some common sense to figure out where they went. If you hit them they're probably retreating to a health pack, or more commonly. By or on top of your dispenser. All it takes is a bit of intuition and random shots around the room to make spy non viable in a 1v1 fight. Of course, thats Spy v any class, not just Spy vs Engy. I dont get the video you posted. Infact if he brought the RR this wouldn't even be an issue. He shot the sentry from long range with his revolver. Any class can and will do that, taking out a sentry is pretty much mandatory in a push because they're aimbots. this example is hardly even remotely an engineer vs spy thing, and more of an an Engineer vs enemy team thing. There was nothing really remarkable about that youtube video at all. Infact I'd like to note that he defaulted to hitting the spy with his wrench rather than using his shotgun. [QUOTE=Hell-met;49828629]RR is the only thing that stops the engineer class from having literally zero different way to play than if you were stuck with stock (excluding gslinger) and like I said it already got nerfed hard. 75 -> 60 healing is a big deal for rockets and pipes intervals[/QUOTE] It actually can shunt soldiers using Stock RL, I think Soldier would have to shoot 8 rockets in order to finally kill the thing if you did nothing but shoot it after he did. Taking you out isn't even an option, since you can just hide and shoot from saftey. I'm not really seeing any change in playstyle here, you can still gun down people, via pistol or hell, just get good with the RR bolts. It just opens up more options in terms of Metal Conservation, Healing, and its other function we haven't even talked about yet, teleporting buildings to you from a distance. I'm not seeing it guys, I really dont see how this isnt a flat upgrade.

[QUOTE=Oizen;49829792]It actually can shunt soldiers using Stock RL, I think Soldier would have to shoot 8 rockets in order to finally kill the thing if you did nothing but shoot it after he did. Taking you out isn't even an option, since you can just hide and shoot from saftey.[/QUOTE] Unless the engie is set up against a wall that you can get splash damage off of to kill the engie with, a soldier with the stock RL isn't going to be killing a sentry an engie is actively healing anyways.

Good old times where you could heal Wrangled sentries with your RR at a 75 HP rate, effectively 225 HP more to do to the sentry. Even an heavy at minimum range couldn't do anything against that. On a serious note tho, what I dislike about the RR is that it has TWO super awesome utility mechanics: healing buildings from a range AND teleporting them to your hands, IMO that's just too much for a single weapon. I'm not sure how we could balance things so at least one of the features gets moved to a secondary or a melee or even place them on a stock engie. Like, what would you guys think about permanently giving the engie the passive ability of picking up buildings when aiming at it for an increased metal cost (the farther away the more metal will be used, ranging from 50 to 200) and being marked to death while doing so, and rescue ranger will only have the healing bolts perk and makes the pick-up buildings from a distance always cost 100 metal?

[QUOTE=Plaffy46;49830118]Good old times where you could heal Wrangled sentries with your RR at a 75 HP rate, effectively 225 HP more to do to the sentry. Even an heavy at minimum range couldn't do anything against that. On a serious note tho, what I dislike about the RR is that it has TWO super awesome utility mechanics: healing buildings from a range AND teleporting them to your hands, IMO that's just too much for a single weapon. I'm not sure how we could balance things so at least one of the features gets moved to a secondary or a melee or even place them on a stock engie. Like, what would you guys think about permanently giving the engie the passive ability of picking up buildings when aiming at it for an increased metal cost (the farther away the more metal will be used, ranging from 50 to 200) and being marked to death while doing so, and rescue ranger will only have the healing bolts perk and makes the pick-up buildings from a distance always cost 100 metal?[/QUOTE] IMO the pickup buildings from a distance is heavily a situational ability. Even then it's not powerful enough to be a standalone sidegrade.

I think the RR should just give you the ability to repair your own buildings, not others. As it tends to just be 3 engineers crouched around a dispenser just spamming onto one level 3 sentry. I believe that'd fix a lot of the annoyance the RR brings when fighting against it.

[QUOTE=X marks it;49830149]I think the RR should just give you the ability to repair your own buildings, not others. As it tends to just be 3 engineers crouched around a dispenser just spamming onto one level 3 sentry. I believe that'd fix a lot of the annoyance the RR brings when fighting against it.[/QUOTE] That comes down to an issue of too many engineers. And not being able to help your buddy engineer's sentry is not fun. Also 3 stickies will still blow up that sentry.

[QUOTE=Stiffy360;49830169]And not being able to help your buddy engineer's sentry is not fun.[/QUOTE] That's what the wrench is for.

Anyone else witnessed when for 75% of the round the enemy team's asleep and you see maybe 4 people out of 12 until the end where the game makes a full U-turn and your team does that instead? Annoys the hell outta me

[QUOTE=Plaffy46;49830118]Good old times where you could heal Wrangled sentries with your RR at a 75 HP rate, effectively 225 HP more to do to the sentry. Even an heavy at minimum range couldn't do anything against that. On a serious note tho, what I dislike about the RR is that it has TWO super awesome utility mechanics: healing buildings from a range AND teleporting them to your hands, IMO that's just too much for a single weapon. I'm not sure how we could balance things so at least one of the features gets moved to a secondary or a melee or even place them on a stock engie. Like, what would you guys think about permanently giving the engie the passive ability of picking up buildings when aiming at it for an increased metal cost (the farther away the more metal will be used, ranging from 50 to 200) and being marked to death while doing so, and rescue ranger will only have the healing bolts perk and makes the pick-up buildings from a distance always cost 100 metal?[/QUOTE] I would enjoy a RR split. one for healing and one for hauling the one for healing wouldn't have a mark-for-death and would have 75bolts again

Don't underestimate the kill power of the shotgun - a really fantastic weapon on all the classes it's on. The Rescue Ranger is a pretty significant drop in dps, plus a projectile and not hitscan. You generally can't be found alone with the RR, as you will die to anyone 1v1.

Stock Sticky bomb should have more of a delay on detonation, Scottish should have it's reduced to match how it is now to cope with the Sticky bomb's change and Quickiebomb should remain the same. Stickyspam shouldn't be as viable as it is plus I don't even get why people would even Stickyspam with stock when the Quickiebomb exists, since the Quickiebomb is just so much better at Stickyspam than Stock is :\

[QUOTE=Dookas;49830986]I don't even get why people would even Stickyspam with stock when the Quickiebomb exists, since the Quickiebomb is just so much better at Stickyspam than Stock is :\[/QUOTE] Because the quickie-bomb launcher has damage ramp-up when it is held in long, and that takes[B] time[/B]. That and the -15% damage penalty when you ACTUALLY just rapid fire the stickies is a major turn-off for any panic sticky spamming Demo. It's good for sticky sniping, which is the main reason I use it sometimes. But other than that, everyone prefers Stock.

The quicke-bomb seems to be intended for a more passive demoman playstyle.

[QUOTE=X marks it;49831118]Because the quickie-bomb launcher has damage ramp-up when it is held in long, and that takes[B] time[/B]. That and the -15% damage penalty when you ACTUALLY just rapid fire the stickies is a major turn-off for any panic sticky spamming Demo. It's good for sticky sniping, which is the main reason I use it sometimes. But other than that, everyone prefers Stock.[/QUOTE] Oh, so I guess I'm the only one who really loves the Quickiebomb then I guess :frown:. Also funny enough I always thought it was easier to spam fire with quickie over stock even with that damage penalty

The only reason I'd use the Quickiebomb over stock is because of its ability to destroy enemy stickies. The rest of the upsides don't really matter, and with stock I can actually place traps that stay.

[QUOTE=Soniku00;49825814]It's 2016 and I'm still seeing this shit in every game. [IMG]https://i.imgur.com/caL6c4T.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE] To be honest, most people like this don't change. :saddowns:

[QUOTE=ILLUMM;49831575]To be honest, most people like this don't change. :saddowns:[/QUOTE] I did alot of these 2 years ago. Then I discovered how absolutely stupid it is.

[QUOTE=Drury;49828601]You have two options. 1. Shoot the stickies 2. Sneak up to the corner the demoman is spamming from and shoot him in the face at point blank. He tries to kill you, he blows himself up. He doesn't, he dies. Win-win. Doing the latter might cost you your sentry, but provided there's no followup, that's not a huge price to pay considering how fast those things set up now. Huge engi buff. Something tells me you don't know quite enough about the class to discuss it's balance. To back this up: Yes, an engineer's main priority is keeping his nest up, but in this context it sounds like you count protecting it as not maintaining it and rather put it in the category of "just extra," which is bizarre considering it doesn't take much time to get everything up to level 3 if you know your shit, and past that point there's not much else to do. You want to walk rounds around your sentry's blind spots with your weapon out looking for anyone trying to cornerspam it and nail them if they do. Remember, you have your sentry always handy, you can walk into it at any time to go heal up at your dispenser in peace, they most likely can't. Just camping in the corner with your wrench/RR out ready to repair whenever your sentry happens to take damage by something you didn't see coming is a gibus-grade strategy. Spy has the upper hand over the engineer in most situations. He counters the engineer. All of his weapons are designed to torture engineers. His invisibility, disguise and sappers make him immune to sentry guns. He screws up, he can cloak without repercussions, especially since the sapper buff. Alternatively, use the dead ringer to disengage safely. If he doesn't screw up, he has a variety of options - backstab the engineer, kill him with 3 revolver shots, or a headshot+bodyshot from ambassador. If the engineer goes for melee attacks, he's setting himself up to get facestabbed. If he goes for his shotgun, he still has to get his bearings quickly - the Spy got a drop on him, he doesn't face this issue. If he has RR equipped, he's dead on the spot. If the Spy disengages and had red tape, he already did the damage. If the engineer had jag equipped, he can have the fun of upgrading everything by two levels again. Then, naturally, if the engineer does something stupid like go for sappers rather than the spy, that's a lost fight right there. However you look at it, the moment the Spy sets his eyes on your sentry, it's his game, and he's the one who calls the shots. Things only ever work out in the engineer's favor when there's a significant skill gap or some teamwork going on on his side (a factor just as easily gained by the Spy). Generally, most of my engineer engagements start and end in under a second, with the engineer backstabbed and everything he built sapped. The "smart" ones that box themselves in a corner eat lead instead. The actual smart ones get [url=https://youtu.be/7O-bD6eOvFs?t=239]harassed until they lose their minds[/url] and go pyro. The Spy truly holds all the cards here. Pyros can be dangerous to certain sentry positions which are generally strong unless flanked from a weird angle from which they can be corner spammed. Flamethrower actually does a decent damage against sentry guns. It does happen every so often to engineers who decide not to do that certain "just extra" so yes shotgun is quite pivotal here. You don't stand a chance against pyros doing that unless you have a shotgun.[/QUOTE] I agree to an extent. Say a spy runs up in disguise and saps your sentry (and keeps doing it). For me anyway, the indecision between destroying the sapper and killing the spy ( I usually opt for the latter but if his team is pressing I sometimes try and stop him sapping long enough to hold them off or check their advance) can be really fatal. The very fact that you have to think about a spy makes you really vulnerable when the other team is pushing, and if the spy keeps sapping whilst they're also bursting in (think of perhaps the first barn in barnblitz where it takes minimal time to get into the barn and at your sentry), it can be tricky to juggle the threats. Especially with a pub team.

In regards to sticky spam: I'm just of the opinion that explosive damage in general needs one of two things to happen. 1. Reduce damage based on the ratio of distance from the explosive radii (which is my preferred one anyway) Or 2. Just reduce splash radius by 20%. Adjust DH and any other explosive radius unlocks to accomodate for this so they stay the same. I feel that the Explosive Master Race™ when it comes down to it is just a tad too powerful. I'm a very mediocre Soldier, and an average Demo (read: stick spam lunatic) and I feel that for the effort I put in (literal epitome of Ground Shoot Man™) I get way too many kills/clear way too many rooms in a pub environment. I don't want them to murder Soldier or Demo like some people do, but even just like a ~10% decrease in their stopping power would be great considering just how much mobility and annoyance factor they can have.

this already happened during L&W.

Seems like every time I play this game, I always get that [I]one[/I] person to tunnel-vision me the entire match, calling me out even though I never say anything. It's worse when it's someone with nothing but Hale's Own stranges and smothered in unusuals, spamming binds in every kill against you. Like dude go away, I just wanna enjoy the game. /rant

Usually these stranges are farmed and unusuals are bought on market. Seen these kinds of people all over the Steam,less than 1000 h in tf2.

I hate rabid spies. Spies that just run into a room and stab everything in the face as many times as possible in the hopes that it glitches and they get a backstab. Even worse is thanks to the fuckyness of the knife, they almost always get a boatload of instakills.

[QUOTE=Mifil;49836027]Usually these stranges are farmed and unusuals are bought on market. Seen these kinds of people all over the Steam,less than 1000 h in tf2.[/QUOTE] You do know the numbers on stranges are reset when they're traded, right? They have to put in all the work of killing stationary bots with their expensive stranges themselves.

[t]https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/1/10/RED_Prehistoric_Pullover.png[/t] This annoying eyesore. Extra bonus points if a Pyro is wearing it. Fucking scalies.

[QUOTE=Enterim;49836644]You do know the numbers on stranges are reset when they're traded, right? They have to put in all the work of killing stationary bots with their expensive stranges themselves.[/QUOTE] I thought stranges didn't count bot kills?

b-but its kawaii!!!!11!! Another thing that annoys me? Pink pyros and medics. You're not cute, go away.