TF2 General Chat and Speculation Station: Whiteboard Blues - Games

[QUOTE=Fluury;52749988]That would be the first time they'd do that, which may be possible, but I doubt it. I also just cant imagine them letting scream fortress be the first major update. Well, we'll see soon enough. Atleast for an answer for this question we wont have to wait 400 days.[/QUOTE] It's not a matter of them "letting" anything happen at this point. They're likely too far into development to have much control over the actual release date. They can't just drop some 90% complete piece of content from the update to make sure the update comes out earlier, or release that content unfinished. The bottom line is that if they haven't finished the update before halloween they won't release it before Halloween. It's painfully obvious that they put way too much into this one update for their team to be able to handle, as we can see from the insane time between updates with meaningful content, but there's not much they can do about it at this stage other than work hard to get it finished as soon as possible, which I'm sure they're doing. Edit: I will say that communication is one thing they could definitely be doing at this stage in development, which they're not doing, which would make things a lot smoother. That's one area where we can pretty clearly see that they're really dropping the ball[I] right now[/I], as opposed to the delay which likely has more to do with long-term planning issues.

[QUOTE=ics;52750026]In order for someone to do saxxy, maintain forums, etc, means that someone at valve needs to care about those things. Look what happened with SPUF when the guy who basically was the soul of them, left valve this spring. They got shut down because there was no one interested to maintain them. The person who worked originally with SFM, has left valve. Has it received updates for few years? No. Theres shitloads of people who still play L4D2 and that hope for new content but it never comes. If no one fills these peoples shoes or pitches in otherwise, nothing will happen. Valve has sadly grown too big to pay attention to the needs of the little people. They draw major lines and TF2 would propably be out of updates if it wouldnt have this big playerbase and still active community, that actually buys stuff from store.[/QUOTE] What does any of this have to do with the TF Team and TF2's current Update situation? The people that are working on Scream Fortress are the same working on the Jungle Update. It's not like Valve is drawing lines here, it's the people working. If those 6 Programmers wouldn't have the interest and passion they have in TF2, that's where TF2 would stop having updates, which is why I find it insanely insulting when people say "The TF Team doesnt care about TF2" - If they wouldnt care about it, they wouldnt work on it. [QUOTE=Hell-met;52749997]or maybe you could give up and stop defending valve at every turn[/QUOTE] how is a mediocre joke defending [B]the tf team[/B] for this unacceptable silence and wait laddie [QUOTE=Mort Stroodle;52750044]It's not a matter of them "letting" anything happen at this point. They're likely too far into development to have much control over the actual release date. They can't just drop some 90% complete piece of content from the update to make sure the update comes out earlier, or release that content unfinished. The bottom line is that if they haven't finished the update before halloween they won't release it before Halloween. It's painfully obvious that they put way too much into this one update for their team to be able to handle, as we can see from the insane time between updates with meaningful content, but there's not much they can do about it at this stage other than work hard to get it finished as soon as possible, which I'm sure they're doing.[/QUOTE] Personally Im rolling with the Update having been done and "finished" a few weeks ago but them holding it off for the 10th anniversary, squeezing in some extra shit related to it in the last few weeks.

Meanwhile, take some enjoyment out of this recent convo I had: [QUOTE] Myself: I only sell very few items. Myself: You can find what I sell on the list here: Myself: <LinkRemoved> Myself: You can find that link any tiMyself on my Steam Profile Page Other: Dude Other: Can you sell for Myself like 2-3 golden weapon for my all staff Other: I send you a trade Other: Go look it up Other: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Myself: Sorry, I am not selling those weapons. Other: RY Myself: I will check the trade now, just a moMyselfnt Other: Then you dont accept it Myself: I only sell the weapons listed here: Myself: <LinkRemoved> Myself: The rest are probably part of a collection or similar reason. Other: C mon one golden robot head ples Other: Selll one Other: ................ Other: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Other: Ples Other: Hello Other: ? Other: XD Other: HELLO Other: Pu c mon Myself: Seeing as it is not on my list... nope.avi Other: Ok your not jucefull idiot good bye fucker Other is now Offline. [/QUOTE] I am always open to any convo and invite, since I am friendly like that. Then there is a bonus of these entertaining moments.

[QUOTE=Hell-met;52749997]or maybe you could give up and stop defending valve at every turn[/QUOTE] This post makes no sense, Fluury was making a bitter joke about how we'll know whether the update comes out before halloween once halloween rolls around. If anything that's a criticism of Valve, saying that the only way we'll even learn whether it comes out before halloween is to literally just wait for halloween.

[QUOTE=Fluury;52750045]What does any of this have to do with the TF Team and TF2's current Update situation? The people that are working on Scream Fortress are the same working on the Jungle Update. It's not like Valve is drawing lines here, it's the people working. If those 6 Programmers wouldn't have the interest and passion they have in TF2, that's where TF2 would stop having updates, which is why I find it insanely insulting when people say "The TF Team doesnt care about TF2" - If they wouldnt care about it, they wouldnt work on it.[/QUOTE] I did not say that the TF2 team doesnt care about TF2, im saying they have no agenda to release the updates at certain intervals as we have seen. There is no rush to get it out, because they are running out of money. They can slide that long time and while they dont see it, a lot of people are waiting for update to TF2. They might even skip saxxy, halloween, smismass, just to get the current update out. No one knows what is going to happen, and thats the scary part on all this. Could be that even someone from the team left Valve at these past months. Anything could have happened.

[QUOTE=ics;52750090]I did not say that the TF2 team doesnt care about TF2, im saying they have no agenda to release the updates at certain intervals as we have seen. There is no rush to get it out, because they are running out of money. They can slide that long time and while they dont see it, a lot of people are waiting for update to TF2. [/QUOTE] They're well aware of how much the community wants the update.

[QUOTE=ics;52750090]I did not say that the TF2 team doesnt care about TF2.[/QUOTE] That wasn't in a direct reference to you, but more to some other, more direct fellas here.

[QUOTE=geel9;52750177]They're well aware of how much the community wants the update.[/QUOTE] I can imagine how many complaint letters they've already recieved over this.

[QUOTE=Danzflor;52749512]I think some people here are waaaay too serious about being competitive in a videogame. I get it, that's like YOUR way to enjoy a videogame, too bad the casual (A.k.a. MOST of the) players don't find that interesting or fun at all. I really don't get why people love to play seriously stripping all the fun things out of videogames, but oh well. In my opinion, people should get serious about games only if you get paid to do so, other wise is stressful and bad for your mental health. Just watch how LoL and Overwatch ranked games are filled with the most toxic people on the planet, no interest in having fun, just winning, winning is the only way to have fun. Like, seriously? Why even play the game then?[/QUOTE] I sure do hope you aren't the kind of person to force your ideals on to other people... It's evident you favor subjectivity over objectivity to the point where you make retarded blanket statements that denounce a popular hobby/job. How can any of these players make their dream of playing a game professionally come true if they can't [I]win[/I] in the first place? You have to build your experience up first, and of course its going to be stressful as fuck. Don't assume people don't have an end goal. [QUOTE=Danzflor;52749533]Man, I been playing videogames for years now, and writing about them as my job for a decade. I have seen all of this, been covering Esports, seing how retarded people can get over a fucking software. Don't come to school me please. Also, who is complaining? I just dislike the people's mindset who tryhard on competitive games. No one is stopping you from doing so. I just don't think it is good for your health.[/QUOTE] Which leads me to question if, as a [I]gamer[/I], I would enjoy reading something you've written. Perhaps you'd benefit from comparing the toxicity between [I]gamers[/I] and the players in sports like Soccer, Football and Hockey who beat the shit out of each other over [I]a game.[/I] If something like that doesn't tickle the literary interest within you, I'm not sure why you need to peddle your hate for a segment of the community you haven't tried to understand from a perspective on the [I]other side[/I]. [QUOTE] And yeah, HL for me is much more compelling and actual viable way of selling the game. You actually use all the characters and their abilities togheter to win matches. 6v6 is the same format of 2 scouts, 2 demos, a Solly and a Medic, making half of the roster useless or very situational. I don't think Dota 2 would have reach his popularity status if you were only forced to choose 25 of the 100+ heroes just because "the meta said so" (but fair enough that was the case a couple years ago and still is in League of Legends, lol). [/QUOTE] ... The differences between 6s and HL are quite obvious. One has more players than the other. With more players comes more inconsistencies. Highlander is fun, but it isn't nearly as consistent and easy to understand as 6s. The appeal of fast paced games are what support the interest of the fans who like to watch the competitive community, and Highlander can stalemate incredibly hard on payload/control point. Are we just going to ignore that CSGO lowers its player count in matches compared to "casual" gameplay? Overwatch from the start doesn't let you use all of the characters in a single match :^( What makes TF2 so satisfying for me is the "reserved" variety of classes to pick from. Not too many, but not too few. At times I wan't to take it more casually I prefer seeing all of the classes in the game but when it comes to quick, consistent, action packed fun, I prefer to see less.

[QUOTE=Fluury;52750182]That wasn't in a direct reference to you, but more to some other, more direct fellas here.[/QUOTE] I'm sure a lot of the more doom and gloom people here are just suffering burn out from what feels like endless waiting and low communication. I don't doubt that the team care about the game but they are most certainly understaffed and over worked. It's clear they have had to make some sacrifices (last years SF and Smissmas, no summer update this year, very likely limited SF this year, no saxxy announcement) to work on this update and I wont be surprised if they make more.

[QUOTE=Danzflor;52749533]Man, I been playing videogames for years now, and writing about them as my job for a decade. I have seen all of this, been covering Esports, seing how retarded people can get over a fucking software. Don't come to school me please. Also, who is complaining? I just dislike the people's mindset who tryhard on competitive games. No one is stopping you from doing so. I just don't think it is good for your health.[/QUOTE] I understand where you're coming from, but there is no need to be antagonistic. I share the sentiment that when things get too serious, it becomes less fun, but this is just one perspective. People are definitely going to disagree with you in this thread, because we are concerned about the state of the game, of which the competitive side is a big factor in the future direction of the game, whether we like it or not. I was not a fan of the shift in direction, mainly because it marginalised community servers even more than quickplay, but I don't disapprove of the people who play competitively, their dedication after 10 years is testament to how fun the core game can still be, regardless of setting.

[QUOTE=Danzflor;52749533]Man, I been playing videogames for years now, and writing about them as my job for a decade. I have seen all of this, been covering Esports, seing how retarded people can get over a fucking software. Don't come to school me please. Also, who is complaining? I just dislike the people's mindset who tryhard on competitive games. No one is stopping you from doing so. I just don't think it is good for your health.[/QUOTE] We've also seen it all, and can relate to years of this game too. If you're going to wave your experience around, please remember who you're talking to in this thread. I think you not understanding what you're complaining about is a fair criticism of your statements. I'm sure south american UGC steel has given you a breadth of knowledge on how seriously people are capable of taking a competitive video game, but regardless, your blanket statements about what people find fun could use a little more facts and less opinion.

So imagine a feature or piece of content added into the update. It's not a bug, and its use is intentional. Now think of that thing as the worst thing the Team could do with TF2. What is that for you? For me, it would be a move away from the community, like remaking the server browser in a way that makes community servers ever harder to find properly.

[QUOTE=valvenews;52750828]So imagine a feature or piece of content added into the update. It's not a bug, and its use is intentional. Now think of that thing as the worst thing the Team could do with TF2. What is that for you? For me, it would be a move away from the community, like remaking the server browser in a way that makes community servers ever harder to find properly.[/QUOTE] Overwatch Ultimates.

randomer crits

[QUOTE=C. Blades;52750352]We've also seen it all, and can relate to years of this game too. If you're going to wave your experience around, please remember who you're talking to in this thread. [B]I think you not understanding what you're complaining about is a fair criticism of your statements.[/B][/quote] this statement applies to most game journalists lol

[QUOTE=valvenews;52750828]So imagine a feature or piece of content added into the update. It's not a bug, and its use is intentional. Now think of that thing as the worst thing the Team could do with TF2. What is that for you? For me, it would be a move away from the community, like remaking the server browser in a way that makes community servers ever harder to find properly.[/QUOTE] They've already struck the community down by adding their own official servers with sv_pure 1. Quick-connect (in the past) and "Casual Mode" have taken a fairly sizable crowd away from the community servers. At this point, if Valve adds any additional [i]out there[/i] concepts like Demoknight or Pyro Combos I'll most likely jump ship.

Now that Hat in Time is out, MekuCube can finally get back to working on Advanced Weaponiser. I mean, he probably won't, but I hope he does. I've been itching to play AW2, and although CTF2W is fantastic, it doesn't quite compare to the classic that is AW. Edit: Oh shit, nevermind. Mecha the Slag made AW, not Meku.

[QUOTE=valvenews;52750828]So imagine a feature or piece of content added into the update. It's not a bug, and its use is intentional. Now think of that thing as the worst thing the Team could do with TF2. What is that for you? For me, it would be a move away from the community, like remaking the server browser in a way that makes community servers ever harder to find properly.[/QUOTE] a spy weapon that allows him to survive being killed and fake his own death and the ability to restore it with ammo kits creating unending uncertainty as to whether the spy is dead OH FUCKING WAIT

[QUOTE=Jboby1;52750899]Now that Hat in Time is out, MekuCube can finally get back to working on Advanced Weaponiser. I mean, he probably won't, but I hope he does. I've been itching to play AW2, and although CTF2W is fantastic, it doesn't quite compare to the classic that is AW. Edit: Oh shit, nevermind. Mecha the Slag made AW, not Meku.[/QUOTE] I seriously doubt Mecha is ever gonna go back to tf2 coding. not after Valve basically slaughtered 90% of custom game modes, and especially not after basically giving all his custom modes to his underlings who now run RedSun.

[QUOTE=valvenews;52750828]So imagine a feature or piece of content added into the update. It's not a bug, and its use is intentional. Now think of that thing as the worst thing the Team could do with TF2. What is that for you? For me, it would be a move away from the community, like remaking the server browser in a way that makes community servers ever harder to find properly.[/QUOTE] Scatter arrow

[QUOTE=valvenews;52750828]So imagine a feature or piece of content added into the update. It's not a bug, and its use is intentional. Now think of that thing as the worst thing the Team could do with TF2. What is that for you? For me, it would be a move away from the community, like remaking the server browser in a way that makes community servers ever harder to find properly.[/QUOTE] Casual matchmaking changing to map rotations, losing the ability to check/uncheck each map individually.

Imagine being one of the devs on the TF team right now. With the community as ravenous as it is, I would not wish to be in their shoes right now. Imagine the vitriol they're going to get if there is literally one thing wrong with the update. [sp]Which is basically guaranteed to happen[/sp]

[QUOTE=valvenews;52750828]So imagine a feature or piece of content added into the update. It's not a bug, and its use is intentional. Now think of that thing as the worst thing the Team could do with TF2. What is that for you? For me, it would be a move away from the community, like remaking the server browser in a way that makes community servers ever harder to find properly.[/QUOTE] Pay to use sprays

Honestly, unless they manage to do some mega-screwup (which I imagine is exactly what they're trying to avoid by taking their time with it) it's probably going to be like most game updates - a majority of people liking the new stuff (esp. those who don't ravenously follow thread like this) just because it's new stuff, a majority of regulars liking the new stuff (the balance changes are enough for a lot of people) and then the smaller minority who piss about the relatively insignificant stuff, but do so fairly vocally. There'll probably a bit more on the "oh wow updates have slowed down" side of things, but for the dev's sake one hopes the reaction is...reasonable.

[QUOTE=valvenews;52750828]So imagine a feature or piece of content added into the update. It's not a bug, and its use is intentional. Now think of that thing as the worst thing the Team could do with TF2. What is that for you? For me, it would be a move away from the community, like remaking the server browser in a way that makes community servers ever harder to find properly.[/QUOTE] an Overwatch Crossover in the comics.

[QUOTE=RedDagger;52751037]Honestly, unless they manage to do some mega-screwup (which I imagine is exactly what they're trying to avoid by taking their time with it) it's probably going to be like most game updates - a majority of people liking the new stuff (esp. those who don't ravenously follow thread like this) just because it's new stuff, a majority of regulars liking the new stuff (the balance changes are enough for a lot of people) and then the smaller minority who piss about the relatively insignificant stuff, but do so fairly vocally. There'll probably a bit more on the "oh wow updates have slowed down" side of things, but for the dev's sake one hopes the reaction is...reasonable.[/QUOTE] there will always be people who hate a change, it's not avoidable if they change the flamethrower to have better damage and you have to actually aim, some people will complain that they can't play with their foot anymore

[QUOTE=slapdown3;52751032]Pay to use sprays[/QUOTE] Paid for sprays that work on Valve servers exist in CSGO so I'm guessing we'll see those in TF2 as well. Unfortunately the CSGO ones are limited use (50 uses I think) so if they bring them to TF2 I hope they're unlimited use.

[QUOTE=gigazelle;52750992]Imagine being one of the devs on the TF team right now. With the community as ravenous as it is, I would not wish to be in their shoes right now. Imagine the vitriol they're going to get if there is literally one thing wrong with the update. [sp]Which is basically guaranteed to happen[/sp][/QUOTE] As someone who's worked on games, I feel bad, because it is a terrifying position to be in, but, as a member of the community, I also can't help but not feel bad at all. [B]This is their fault.[/B] Like this isn't the fault of an unreasonable fanbase like in dota 2 or OW whenever there's an update, this is a matter of it being over 400 days since the last major update and they've barely told us a fucking thing, virtually nothing. Especially in the past 3 months. Complete radio silence and as each day goes by, some grow more apathetic, and some grow more red hot with rage, and that divide only grows bigger and the idea of releasing this or actually talking to us only grows more and more terrifying by the second. All it would have taken is one blog post during the middle of summer, maybe before TI7 or just after July ended, giving us a "what we're up to" or "how things are going" progress post, or literally any time since then, just let us know what the fuck is up. I'm 1000 times less likely to be upset at them for letting the community know how fucking slow they're taking than I am by this complete wall of silence.

All I want is for them to put in a better anti-cheat system. If they released the Pyro update with only a new anti cheat system (without any rebalances or comp changes, just a better anticheat system) I would honestly be fine with it. It's a big problem. I get so anxious when queuing up for competitive, because I KNOW there's going to be a cheater in the game. All I can hope is that they're on my team, or that there's a cheater on both teams. Side note: The report system does nothing. I've reported several cheaters several times, nothing. There's this one dude who posts anti-Semitic posts, has a picture of Hitler as his avatar, and even has screenshots of his cheating settings. Nothing has happened to him.