TF2 General Chat and Speculation Station: Whiteboard Blues

[prizepool]

[QUOTE=C. Blades;52659399][I]Goodbye money! [/I]

*valve ends TF2 development due to the payment model going out the window*

[/QUOTE]

Money vs Performance

I wonder which one Valve would pick. Hmmm...

[Kaiga]

I'd say that question is irrelevant, a free to play model with no P2W aspects like TF2 means either having a game with silly hats, or not have a game at all.

[prizepool]

I'm just kidding. Even if TF2 was optimized and had flourishing competitive and casual communities with 100,000+ players daily, the hat economy would still be essential to the lifeblood of the game.

[Jetamo]

[QUOTE=Petroklos;52659291]Was 2, fused into one. Includes new "Choose your own Adventure" contracts, new SFM short and Competitive rework.[/QUOTE]

Do we even know this to be absolutely true, or are we just assuming because it's delayed it'll have all of the above?

[CommodoreKong]

[QUOTE=prizepool;52659443]I'm just kidding. Even if TF2 was optimized and had flourishing competitive and casual communities with 100,000+ players daily, the hat economy would still be essential to the lifeblood of the game.[/QUOTE]

I'm really hoping that the Pyro update causes a permanent increase in the concurrent player count but I fear without a proper tutorial it's going to be difficult for the player base to grow.

[EmilyVasquez]

[QUOTE=ComodoreBluth;52659484]I'm really hoping that the Pyro update causes a permanent increase in the concurrent player count but I fear without a proper tutorial it's going to be difficult for the player base to grow.[/QUOTE]

Unless someone goes on a tour around Valve HQ and suggests to the TF team that they need to make a way better tutorial that teaches new players the mechanics and everything of the game then I doubt they'll even do one. But that's just me :pudge:

[Metaru]

yeah, that was rude and completely out of place. my bad.

apologies for anyone offended by that

[Dumpus]

Next week is the week guys, I can feel it.
I can feel [sp]the disappointment[/sp] already.

[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Spoiler tag abuse" - Reagy))[/highlight]

[Danzflor]

Guys, you need to sleep. Just a friendly reminder, with love :dog:

[prizepool]

A community content creator needs to start a community created tutorial update project

[BonkNickeltoon]

[QUOTE=prizepool;52659570]A community content creator needs to start a community created tutorial update project[/QUOTE]

Eh, I don't think there'd be really a use in a tutorial like that. It seems like a group effort thing.

On the same note, I did start a Particle Editor Tutorial series this week:

[video=youtube;G_9hTV7XFCg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_9hTV7XFCg[/video]

[GoldenCreator]

[QUOTE=EmilyVasquez;52659335]If that's the case then the fact that they haven't done any new additions to MvM is weird. If the possibility of them being able to make new MvM missions without the help of Mike Booth is true then I dunno why the heck they haven't done anything new with it. People still play it to this day.[/QUOTE]

Honestly, I think they abandoned it like the other gimmicks they've made. They always seem to push out some cool ideas, work on it for a little while, then never touch it again. I love MvM though so I'd more then love to see a new map, a community addition, or even just a new tour with the stock maps.

[Yikes!]

[QUOTE=prizepool;52659418]Money vs Performance

I wonder which one Valve would pick. Hmmm...[/QUOTE]

imho it's unfair to valve

TF2's performance is more than acceptable by modern standards, it's just gotten heftier as standard hardware has done the same

it's not the same game thatll run on a potato like 10 years ago but it's still gonna run fine on contemporary low-mid end hardware

[Kaiga]

That, and a lot of people who play this game still do so on the same hardware they did during the game's early years.

[fodderstompf]

[QUOTE=prizepool;52659570]A community content creator needs to start a community created tutorial update project[/QUOTE]

This'd be ineffective. Someone new wouldn't know of community resources.

[Fluury]

Once again, believe it or not, what the TF Team is pulling with this Update is a good move.

TF2's rep is at it's worst, making an Update that goes as the saving grace boosting TF2's rep at it's glory again only makes sense and will reel many players in, even to comp if they do it right.

So the question isnt when the update will release, but if they'll continue this "twice a year" update, making the same mistake over and over again.
Especially with the game heading into a competitive direction, imagine if this update buffed a weapon to an OP-only-in-comp state and well have to wait 5 months for a fix. No one will wait for that in official comp.

[Ace of Butts]

I just want to believe this will be such a big update it's going to ensure a very positive future for the game and the community.

[Nebrassy]

[QUOTE=Fluury;52659898]Once again, believe it or not, what the TF Team is pulling with this Update is a good move.

TF2's rep is at it's worst, making an Update that goes as the saving grace boosting TF2's rep at it's glory again only makes sense and will reel many players in, even to comp if they do it right.

So the question isnt when the update will release, but if they'll continue this "twice a year" update, making the same mistake over and over again.
Especially with the game heading into a competitive direction, imagine if this update buffed a weapon to an OP-only-in-comp state and well have to wait 5 months for a fix. No one will wait for that in official comp.[/QUOTE]

heh, pretty much all OP weapons in CSGO have been there since the start, Valve nerfs one weapon every year, then the next OP weapon is discovered, and the cycle continues

[CommodoreKong]

ScottJAw visited the TF2 team with Dane and made a video about it. Not any new info but a fun watch:
[video=youtube;Jcd_rRrXYtE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jcd_rRrXYtE[/video]

[ics]

[QUOTE=prizepool;52659570]A community content creator needs to start a community created tutorial update project[/QUOTE]

I dont think many people want to watch tutorials, instead they want to play the game. So the tutorial would need to be a link on the menu "START HERE" and when players click that, it loads a level that seems interesting to the player to explore and learn at the same time. Teach players some neat simple tricks visually and under guidance, such as:

- This is a control point, stand on it to help your team and to capture it
- As engineer, hit your buildings at all times, they build faster. You dont need to wait for them to finish "unloading" or building to next level.

And so on. Doing an extensive tutorial is quite a lot of work and i dont think its doable without valve pitching in. They do several things in the existing levels in the code. In a code that we have no access to. So even if you wanted to use some of the things they use in their own maps as community map maker, it's just not possible right now.

[EmilyVasquez]

I think TF2 should do what OW did and when you boot up the game for the first ever time it sends you through a tutorial to complete before you actually go to the main menu.

[DrVincentWolf]

[QUOTE=ToastyToes;52659356]As a demo main I'm more than alright with this.[/QUOTE]

As a demo main who is much better at using pipes than stickies, would I have a problem?

[[ToRn]]

Well MvM is dead.

I just wasted $1 to try and finish my last tour and I keep getting placed with people who don't know what they're doing, which leads to losing wave 1, which [I]always[/I] leads to one person rage quitting, which then demotivates the others which leads to them rage quitting too.

So me and the two others wait for a team again and back to step one that i mentioned, which repeats my story all over again.

Is MvM really this dead? I used be the lowest person with tours at 13. Now I'm usually the one with the most.

I assume all the 1000 tour guys have their set teams, but there used to be quite a lot of people with 50+ tours roaming randomly.

[bobpineapple]

[QUOTE='[ToRn];52660066']Well MvM is dead.

I just wasted $1 to try and finish my last tour and I keep getting placed with people who don't know what they're doing, which leads to losing wave 1, which [I]always[/I] leads to one person rage quitting, which then demotivates the others which leads to them rage quitting too.

So me and the two others wait for a team again and back to step one that i mentioned, which repeats my story all over again.

Is MvM really this dead? I used be the lowest person with tours at 13. Now I'm usually the one with the most.

I assume all the 1000 tour guys have their set teams, but there used to be quite a lot of people with 50+ tours roaming randomly.[/QUOTE]

You probably just got really unlucky. I've done 15 tours in the past two months, and about 90% of the time I was placed in a lobby with actual experienced players.

edit: I think it really depends on the time of day you do it. midday on mon-fri and late night games tend to work the best.

[Big Snake Bos]

The only fun you can ever have in mvm is in maps with custom maps as most people testing the map there dont really care about winning or losing but figuring out if the map is balanced.

[[ToRn]]

I just wanna finish my latest tour. I started it like 2 years ago and just wanna finish it out of boredom.

[ics]

[QUOTE=Chuggoth;52660030]Tutorial pop-ups that can be turned off at any moment. It's already been done in many other games, no need to reinvent the wheel.[/QUOTE]

In this case, you do. There is only 2 options in a map to display test. One is game_text entity, which fades in and out of the screen and looks pretty bad with big letters. The other is game_text_tf that does bring up cool info box with clear text but it has no setting how long it displays. There is currently no proper way to do this, without Valves help of them creating a system that mapmakers can easily use to display messages.

[Ghostlier]

things I have done tonight:

- played huntsman sniper on skial 2fort
- played equalizer taunt-kill soldier on skial 2fort

I recently got a Lumbricus Lid so I naturally only go for taunt kills with the Equalizer with it on. Skial servers in particular let you switch weapons while taunting which means you can use an exploit that lets you switch to your Rocket Jumper when you are mid-taunt which nullifies the self-damage of the taunt kill.

I first kept harassing Snipers because apparently the [url=https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/9/9c/Taunt_wormsHHG.wav?t=20100826173810]really loud sound that plays[/url] doesn't make it immediately obvious that they should unscope. I then went for health and was chased by a Medic who thought I was an easy kill. I rocket jumped around, he fired a few crossbow bolts at me, then I started walking away with my melee out and taunted around the corner. He hit me once for 25% uber, then tried to go for a second one to finish me off. Apparently that didn't work out in his favor:

[t]https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/862858943317203073/0D9608C4C3C87DC0EEE09ABE949CA7E485243E36/[/t]

on that note, I really wish the Lumbricus Lid's hat and grenades were 2 separate items, but I guess that's kind of the charm to it.

[starblaster64]

[QUOTE=ics;52660221]In this case, you do. There is only 2 options in a map to display test. One is game_text entity, which fades in and out of the screen and looks pretty bad with big letters. The other is game_text_tf that does bring up cool info box with clear text but it has no setting how long it displays. There is currently no proper way to do this, without Valves help of them creating a system that mapmakers can easily use to display messages.[/QUOTE]
Actually, there's 2 other methods of displaying HUD text.

There's the [I]'training_annotation'[/I] entity:
[T]https://image.prntscr.com/image/YoTDj6qnR9iaqCc15UshPQ.png[/T]
[url]https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Training_annotation[/url]

And there's the [I]'ShowTrainingMsg'[/I] and [I]'ShowTrainingObjective'[/I] inputs for the [I]'tf_logic_training_mode'[/I] entity:
[T]https://image.prntscr.com/image/Wz0MRlL1TsO29HU-mgHGVw.png[/t]
[url]https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Tf_logic_training_mode[/url]

Both of these methods also allow you to specify any duration you want.
The annotations are [I]technically[/I] coded to be able to follow a moving target (like when you're Coaching another player and target something that moves), however you can't actually use that functionality without the help of SourceMod. At least, not that I've found anyway.

EDIT: In fact, [I]tf_logic_training_mode[/I] probably has all the inputs/outputs you'd need to make a fully playable tutorial map. If someone was dedicated enough, I don't think it would be terribly difficult to just reverse engineer a decompiled Valve training map and go from there.

[Kegan]

[QUOTE=Ghostlier;52660232]things I have done tonight:

- played huntsman sniper on skial 2fort
- played equalizer taunt-kill soldier on skial 2fort

I recently got a Lumbricus Lid so I naturally only go for taunt kills with the Equalizer with it on. Skial servers in particular let you switch weapons while taunting which means you can use an exploit that lets you switch to your Rocket Jumper when you are mid-taunt which nullifies the self-damage of the taunt kill.

I first kept harassing Snipers because apparently the [url=https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/9/9c/Taunt_wormsHHG.wav?t=20100826173810]really loud sound that plays[/url] doesn't make it immediately obvious that they should unscope. I then went for health and was chased by a Medic who thought I was an easy kill. I rocket jumped around, he fired a few crossbow bolts at me, then I started walking away with my melee out and taunted around the corner. He hit me once for 25% uber, then tried to go for a second one to finish me off. Apparently that didn't work out in his favor:

[t]https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/862858943317203073/0D9608C4C3C87DC0EEE09ABE949CA7E485243E36/[/t]

on that note, I really wish the Lumbricus Lid's hat and grenades were 2 separate items, but I guess that's kind of the charm to it.[/QUOTE]

Skial servers are the best play to shitpost via gameplay. I have spent so much time just being completely worthless on Skial 24/7 2fort servers, like going engie and lurking on the battlements, constantly placing teleporters and watching the 4 snipers on the other side shoot them, I'm pretty sure they were amused as I was by it.

I've also gone sniper and hung out with other snipers before, spamming NICE SHOT each time they'd shoot, I actually a few THANKS MATEs in reply :v:

Best thing I've done is just go scout and pan the shit out of the other team while spamming "NEED A DISPENSAH HEAH", it got even better when people from both teams started spamming it with me.
Goddamn, I love TF2.