TF2 General Chat and Speculation Station: Whiteboard Blues - Games

[QUOTE=testinglol;52711307]you people are setting yourselves up for disappointment. dont get mad at them when you get disappointed...[/QUOTE] If only this was somehow avoidable by an acceptable PR model Valve deserves every cent of anger they make. If they surprise everybody, great. If they lack what people wanted, they dug their own grave by not outlining it ahead of time. It's been over a year (over 3 waiting for functional comp) This is not an update to update wishlist. We are in the territory of overhauling most every disliked gameplay mechanic ingame. The longer they go without speaking, the more expectations are allowed to inflate.

[QUOTE=Punchy;52712083] The longer they go without speaking, the more expectations are allowed to inflate.[/QUOTE] you... you really did not learn anything about hl3 did you. the more expectations you grow about something, the more you idealize it. wich in turn will make the unnavoidable dissapointment hit you even harder. there was a point of no return for HL3. expectations grew so big no ammount of manpower could match the ideal final result - to a point the thing sells more being vapowarebecause no matter what they do, they will not achieve what people expects it to be. this is valve we're talking, they have proven over time how they are basically detached from the whole industry, working at their own pace as they do not depend of anyone but themselves. while this might sound rude to us, customers, we should be more than aware how things works by now with them. we're tied to the only company that literally works whenever it feels like, however it feels like. by now we're either blessed by this, after all these years, or doomed by this.

[QUOTE=Metaru;52712132]you... you really did not learn anything about hl3 did you. the more expectations you grow about something, the more you idealize it. wich in turn will make the unnavoidable dissapointment hit you even harder. there was a point of no return for HL3. expectations grew so big no ammount of manpower could match the ideal final result - to a point the thing sells more being vapowarebecause no matter what they do, they will not achieve what people expects it to be. this is valve we're talking, they have proven over time how they are basically detached from the whole industry, working at their own pace as they do not depend of anyone but themselves. while this might sound rude to us, customers, we should be more than aware how things works by now with them. we're tied to the only company that literally works whenever it feels like, however it feels like. by now we're either blessed by this, after all these years, or doomed by this.[/QUOTE] And that's not his fault, that's Valve's fault for being a bad company that unfortunately produced products we've become attached to.

thats a fault on both sides. they've grown past the industry's workflow with rused pieces of shit that get content cut out for DLC purposes and cut ties a year or less after launch as they literally fund themselves, eich in return has turned them into a beast of their own and we, as consumers, have been so used to this practice that is hard to grasp a company that simply works on something when it feels like. makes everyone feel detached given all these years of support and pride are answered with literal nothing - when we compare it to other companies in the same field. its like being jealous of the kid with the dad thats always gifts him with something, only because he bought his son's afection with stuff only to spoil him.

[QUOTE=Metaru;52712132]you... you really did not learn anything about hl3 did you. the more expectations you grow about something, the more you idealize it. wich in turn will make the unnavoidable dissapointment hit you even harder. there was a point of no return for HL3. expectations grew so big no ammount of manpower could match the ideal final result - to a point the thing sells more being vapowarebecause no matter what they do, they will not achieve what people expects it to be. this is valve we're talking, they have proven over time how they are basically detached from the whole industry, working at their own pace as they do not depend of anyone but themselves. while this might sound rude to us, customers, we should be more than aware how things works by now with them. we're tied to the only company that literally works whenever it feels like, however it feels like. by now we're either blessed by this, after all these years, or doomed by this.[/QUOTE] As a long time TF2 fan who has been on the recieving end of long update waits leading to jack fucking shit, i'm gonna have to shut down any belief that valve is somehow exempt from the rule. [QUOTE=Metaru;52712213] its like being jealous of the kid with the dad thats always gifts him with something, only because he bought his son's afection with stuff only to spoil him.[/QUOTE] It's more like your dad telling you we're going to disney world and after a 20 hour car trip he kicks you out at a gas station playground.

Capitalism wasn't invented yesterday, there's a reason why corporations have operated a certain way for hundreds of years--because it works. Doing whatever you feel like doing as a company with zero restrictions or considerations is inherently anti-consumer, and given consumer reaction to Valve as a whole lately, it shows, even to people that aren't very perceptive.

[QUOTE=Metaru;52712213]thats a fault on both sides. they've grown past the industry's workflow with rused pieces of shit that get content cut out for DLC purposes and cut ties a year or less after launch as they literally fund themselves, eich in return has turned them into a beast of their own and we, as consumers, have been so used to this practice that is hard to grasp a company that simply works on something when it feels like. makes everyone feel detached given all these years of support and pride are answered with literal nothing - when we compare it to other companies in the same field. its like being jealous of the kid with the dad thats always gifts him with something, only because he bought his son's afection with stuff only to spoil him.[/QUOTE] "Grown past rushed pieces of shit" *glances at the games last major update* :thinking:

So for the pyro update do you guys think that if a pyro gets a reflect kill on the person that fired the projectile that it should count as a self assist like when the medic is healing a spy and the spy backstabs the medic?

When you have money, you dont need to care about the needs of the little people. Things like HL3 release becomes obsolete when you dont have to do it for the money, but you make a lot of people disappointed. You can sit on it forever, untill its good enough to valve standards. If its ever made in the first place. It's the same with TF2. Company is doing fine, there is no monetary incentive to release this update untill it's done and good enough to release. Doesnt matter if players wait new content in agony, thats just something that the player like us would have to do anyway. Sad but true.

[QUOTE=Ultravod;52711300]File under: Victory, Pyrrhic.[/QUOTE] Im keeping a printscreen of this until halloween drops by

[QUOTE=Lord Exor;52712248]Capitalism wasn't invented yesterday, there's a reason why corporations have operated a certain way for hundreds of years--because it works. Doing whatever you feel like doing as a company with zero restrictions or considerations is inherently anti-consumer, and given consumer reaction to Valve as a whole lately, it shows, even to people that aren't very perceptive.[/QUOTE] It clearly works for Valve. People who are sometimes upset at them are just a very vocal minority. Almost all of their current and past titles are huge success stories, making unimaginable amounts of money. (Then there's Steam.) Their way of doing things is what resulted in all these. There is no reason to try and fix something that's not broken.

Business wise, perhaps. But in terms of their legacy and esteem among gamers, I dunno, I feel like Valve have been slipping and slacking off as a game developer for years now, and a bunch of their 'visionary' ideas of late have failed or seem to be failing, to an extent... Valve scored a jackpot over a decade ago with Steam as a digital store and I'd imagine a great majority of their income and profits comes from the store itself. Another seemingly great and profitable idea was their concept of a free-to-play business model and cosmetic microtransactions that aren't pay-to-win and encourage emotional attachment of players to games/characters, which results in player retention. But their subsequent attempts at innovation and changing the landscape of PC gaming and the way games are played have either failed (Steam Machines, Steam Controller), or are in a so-so position currently and not selling as well as expected (VR, I think there's still many monetary and logistical reasons why most gamers simply won't be able to afford or willing to set up the hardware for a long time; plus the games so far mostly look incredibly dumbed-down and basic in terms of gameplay mechanics, and are way overpriced for what they offer). They've abandoned several of their beloved series (Half-life, Portal, Left 4 Dead) and their current three games are all essentially old MP titles (Dota 2 and CSGO are very much just updated versions of ancient mods) based on very old ideas/concepts, and two of the three are still running on an engine that's over 12 years old. They've developed a new engine that they've so far used only for porting their existing pride and joy, Dota 2. CSGO and TF2 have also received far less support and updating in the last few years than they have in the past - undestandable, given the conservative attitude of the CSGO world and the age of TF2, but especially in the latter's case I would still hope for more regular weekly/monthly updating as there's still tons of stuff to fix or improve, especially after the big changes that MyM brought 9 years after the game's release. And while the cosmetic microtransactions have proven to be a visionary idea in terms of profits and lengthening the lifespan of their games, they've become more and more of a running gag and laughing stock in light of Valve's lack of real game development (new IPs, continuation of popular franchises). With the gambling scandals of CSGO, it's also brought a darker aspect to the whole idea and somewhat hurt Valve's reputation. And I personally believe that the Mann Co. Store's current prices are an absolute scam and ripping off of newer, uninformed players and should've been adjusted/lowered years ago. Maybe I'm a cynical ex-Valve fanboy, but there's tons of developers that are more productive than they are in terms of an output of quality new titles, and are also way more professional and 'with the times' as far as regular updating, balancing attempts, transparency, social media presence, interacting with the community etc. go.

[QUOTE=Ultravod;52711300]File under: Victory, Pyrrhic. When Valve makes no mention of TF2 and Source2 (with the possible exception of a lolnope.jpg) and the Pyro (not Pyrrhic) update continues to be delayed and [I]Halloween is upon us,[/I] where are we then? * More freshly warmed over Merasmissions. * More ranks to the sodding gargoyle. * The above will completely not work for the first 3+ days. * Possibly some new (terribly balanced) community event maps. * A new crate UH I MEAN case, with tiered cosmetics (assembled, seemingly at random, from Workshop submissions.) * One of these new cosmetics will share the name with an item from 2011, causing much confusion on the SCM until Valve hastily renames it ...a week later. * There will be something fantastically wrong with the item server for the first few hours as there has been with every event launch since Gun Mettle. * The resulting glitch items will be the best economy relating thing about the update. * 4 new unusual effects exclusive to the case/the event. At least one will be non-horrible. * A new unusual taunt effect or two, and probaby some new -ifiers for the taunts that lack them. * Heavy will get fucked over as he did last year when Valve forgets to add an -ifier for the Table Tantrum until the last two days of the event. * No, I'm not bitter. * [url=https://wiki.teamfortress.com/w/images/1/13/Heavy_jeers03.wav]Yes, I am completely bitter about what happened with the Proletariat Posedown.[/url] * No double unusual unbox rate this year (which is a blessing in disguise.) * Some gee whiz mechanic surrounding the possibility of a bonus item when unboxing. * Possibly a return of Halloween spells, probably via the mechanic mentioned above. (The only good news.) * Spells will not be tradable or marketable (because fuck you.) * Balance changes remain "on hold" as the update continues to be delayed. * Community servers continue twist in the wind as Valve offers no new way to funnel traffic to them apart form the server browser. * Related to the above, a bug emerges that stops the new event maps from working for community servers/Mac clients/other random unfortunates. * The above will be fixed ...four months later. * No changes to Valve official Casual or Competitive modes. * A lesser TF2 cheat gets detected by VAC, resulting in a tiny banwave. * NullCore and Cathook remain completely undetected. Cheaters continue to dominate Valve servers as they queue in groups and are immune to kickvotes. * A Valve employee make a vague statement about the the key sales numbers from this Halloween event not being as good as they had hoped and makes an elusion to TF2's future being questionable. * Event ends, radio silence continues until Smissmass. * A new case with an exclusive key, and a bunch of tiered cosmetics hastily grabbed off the workshop. * The Festivizer now works on a handful of new weapons. That festive Brass Beast, Liberty Launcher and Shortstop no one wanted are now a thing. * Gaben seen via satellite image, working on his new floating knife factory/speed shop/souse vide restaurant in the Bellevue harbor. * Deadringer remains unnerfed. * At least one FP user has had enough and goes an hero with an RL Toxx. * Man, this got dark.[/QUOTE] Make a bingo card

[QUOTE=Drag0600;52711794]Something is terribly wrong with my TF2. I've taken a break and have been playing other shooters, just came back to Team Fortress and something feels off about my mouse. Anyone know what it could be?[/QUOTE] Did vsync get enabled? Happened to me when I took a break, the input delay it creates is massive.

Anyone else feels like they're either really lucky with hat drops? I've had about 4 or 5 hat drops, 2 of which were 1 month apart from each other. I also see people get those more often.

[QUOTE=Cpt.MEEM;52712772]Anyone else feels like they're either really lucky with hat drops? I've had about 4 or 5 hat drops, 2 of which were 1 month apart from each other. I also see people get those more often.[/QUOTE] This was propably 2010-2011 but i saw a guy get a drop ~30 mins a part and another guy getting a drop in the same hour. Personally, i used to got ~1 in a year or so.

[QUOTE=Cpt.MEEM;52712772]Anyone else feels like they're either really lucky with hat drops? I've had about 4 or 5 hat drops, 2 of which were 1 month apart from each other. I also see people get those more often.[/QUOTE] I feel like I've been seeing people get a lot more non-weapon drops lately, like paints and name tags, but on my end it seems like I've barely been getting drops at all. Isn't eight weapons a week the average?

[QUOTE=$shakes;52712785]I feel like I've been seeing people get a lot more non-weapon drops lately, like paints and name tags, but on my end it seems like I've barely been getting drops at all. Isn't eight weapons a week the average?[/QUOTE] Something between 2-13, luckiest week i've had was 13 and a hat.

I've only got about maybe 5 or 4 hat drops ever.

[QUOTE=Cpt.MEEM;52712772]Anyone else feels like they're either really lucky with hat drops? I've had about 4 or 5 hat drops, 2 of which were 1 month apart from each other. I also see people get those more often.[/QUOTE] I got a single hat drop a few months ago but before that nearly every time I got a hat drop I would get another one within a month or two.

[QUOTE=Lord Exor;52712248]Capitalism wasn't invented yesterday, there's a reason why corporations have operated a certain way for hundreds of years--because it works. Doing whatever you feel like doing as a company with zero restrictions or considerations is inherently anti-consumer, and given consumer reaction to Valve as a whole lately, it shows, even to people that aren't very perceptive.[/QUOTE] I dont know what you're talking about, Valve treats DOTA 2 just fine.

[QUOTE=Oizen;52712908]I dont know what you're talking about, Valve treats DOTA 2 just fine.[/QUOTE] A lot of people in this thread are melodramatic to the point of absurdity.

Heres how I imagine it actually is, -Dota 2 has 10x the players TF2 has -CS:GO has 5x the players TF2 has why the fuck would you give TF2 attention when you could make content for that many more people, and make that much more money instead? Economically, we don't matter as much.

[QUOTE=C. Blades;52712271]"Grown past rushed pieces of shit" *glances at the games last major update* :thinking:[/QUOTE] the game itself was relased after nine years of development. sure, if you want to judge the game and the people that have worked on it (past and present) based exclusively on the last two years, out of ten, go ahead.

[QUOTE=Oizen;52712945]Heres how I imagine it actually is, -Dota 2 has 10x the players TF2 has -CS:GO has 5x the players TF2 has why the fuck would you give TF2 attention when you could make content for that many more people, and make that much more money instead? Economically, we don't matter as much.[/QUOTE] a source of income is a source of income, and goddamn is tf2 one hell of a stable source. you don't know much about economics if you only pay attention to the short term. [QUOTE=Metaru;52712986]the game itself was relased after nine years of development. sure, if you want to judge the game and the people that have worked on it (past and present) based exclusively on the last two years, out of ten, go ahead.[/QUOTE] mind you that they literally changed what tf2 was gonna be multiple times. this game did not literally have nine years of development.

[QUOTE=Oizen;52712945]Heres how I imagine it actually is, -Dota 2 has 10x the players TF2 has -CS:GO has 5x the players TF2 has why the fuck would you give TF2 attention when you could make content for that many more people, and make that much more money instead? Economically, we don't matter as much.[/QUOTE] because the people working on tf2, unlike those on csgo and dota 2, has admited to do so out of pure love for the game and their joy to see the game grow - and the money. [QUOTE=Jichael;52712987] mind you that they literally changed what tf2 was gonna be multiple times. this game did not literally have nine years of development.[/QUOTE] hell, if we're talking numbers, the game has been in development for over twenty years and counting, giving tf2 became valve's proving grounds.

Why are people stupidly pessimistic? Tf2 can easily be way more popular than csgo and DotA. Valve doesn't care about tf2 not because it doesn't make money for them. They don't care because for some reason, everyone at valve loves DotA and VR personally.

[MEDIA]https://twitter.com/ValveTime/status/911988843695493120[/MEDIA] [URL="https://www.drewwolf.com/tf2alt"]Direct Link![/URL] That's a pretty neat look into an alternative dimension TF2. My favorite is Granny Demo.

cigar-chomping demoma'am ftw

[QUOTE=Metaru;52712992]because the people working on tf2, unlike those on csgo and dota 2, has admited to do so out of pure love for the game and their joy to see the game grow - and the money. .[/QUOTE] Only when people go visit them. What do you expect them to say "lol we do this job because we dont have to do anything" It honestly sounds like everyone who visits them gets a load of corporate PR bullshit.