Major Update Speculation V31: Gamechanging Edition - Games

recompiling a map is such ass even valve themselves hate it

would there be any chance of valve hosting official servers with random crits and weapon spread disabled in the future? i mean it would sort of make sense with the coming update focusing on competitive and all. i for one would absolutely love this since i think it would be a nice middleground between dead serious 6v6/HL and just dicking around on a public server.

[QUOTE=Avvy;50350915]weapon spread disabled[/QUOTE] I don't think they will ever disable it, they didn't do that for shotguns in CS:GO as well, probably that makes the game look weird in their opinion...

[QUOTE=kos8bit;50350954]I don't think they will ever disable it, they didn't do that for shotguns in CS:GO as well, probably that makes the game look weird in their opinion...[/QUOTE] Yeah, random spread is in CS:GO by default. If you turn off spray patterns and then shoot an entire round into a wall with a weapon multiple times the results will be different because of the spread.

Isn't spread off in matchmaking?

[QUOTE=Chrytin;50349202] To throw in my two cents and elaborate on what I said earlier, in terms of art style, aesthetic and principles, almost everything since GM has been absolutely detrimental, though that isn't to say it wasn't bad before, merely that GM and beyond it has been rapidly accelerating in a direction it really shouldn't be going. Rarity is another part of this poorly chosen direction, as it's being used as an excuse for putting in more ridiculous and out of place crap that shouldn't be in the game at all. Admittedly, out of place hats and other stuff is hardly new, but just because there is a history of artstyle breaking cosmetics does not mean that Valve should keep trying to one up themselves by adding even more out of place and visually unappealing garbage. They should look to those previous mistakes and make an honest attempt to not make them again. Just because the artstyle has already been diluted as it has been does not mean it should continue to be more so, and if possible, attempts should be made at fixing those missteps in the past so we can maybe one day see a game where all the hats and all the cosmetics actually seem to fit. But really that's beyond wishful thinking, and going forward I fully expect to see Valve continue the course of rarity tiers and out of place nonsense that only serves to further dilute and destroy the games already dying artstyle.[/QUOTE] This is absurd, GM and beyond is absolutely tame in comparison to what was in the game before. A banana hat is nowhere NEAR as jarring as the unusual and prof. killstreak particle effects or neon paints. Even unusual weapons are more fitting than a lot of the older unusual effects. Honestly I'd rather see 100 banana hats than one of these: [T]http://i42.tinypic.com/2cgk5lu.jpg[/T]

[QUOTE=Mort Stroodle;50351145]This is absurd, GM and beyond is absolutely tame in comparison to what was in the game before. A banana hat is nowhere NEAR as jarring as the unusual and prof. killstreak particle effects or neon paints. Even unusual weapons are more fitting than a lot of the older unusual effects. Honestly I'd rather see 100 banana hats than one of these: [T]http://i42.tinypic.com/2cgk5lu.jpg[/T][/QUOTE] And I made mention that there have been plenty of missteps already, but at least before it was just killstreaks and unusual effects (mostly) rather than most of the hats themselves. I'm of the opinion unusuals were a mistake and most paints outside the team colored ones shouldn't be in the game, but just because they are already doesn't mean that more aesthetic breaking shit like it should keep being added.

Welcome to the new episode of [b]MU[/b]h art[b]S[/b]tyle. So much negativity as of late even though the game is more balanced than ever.

[QUOTE=Magypsy;50350461]It's been like 4 months. Why can you still build out of bounds on Frontier's last point? This is fucking embarrassing.[/QUOTE] 5+ months, actually. The exact thing I predicted and raged about here happened - certain YT channels and TF2 forums made the ancient exploit publicly well-known and provided instructions on where and how to do it to players that would never find these things themselves, and hundreds of douchebags and bored kids jumped on the chance to ruin other people's experience for hours, weeks and months if need be. I know that, technically, you can absolutely point the finger of blame at Valve for letting that glitch remain in the engine for years and/or not at least fixing the most badly affected maps (Dustbowl, Mountain Lab, Badwater, Frontier, Upward...), but I think the old excuse of ''griefers raise awareness of an issue and force Valve's hand to fix stuff earlier than they otherwise would'' absolutely doesn't apply in this case. Because this isn't a case of a slight mapping oversight on a new map, but rather something in the engine that's been re-discovered and pointed out to a wider public and has the ability to break many of the existing maps. Before circa December, almost no one was aware of what exploits could be done using that crouching exploit in the engine, but after certain people that make their YT career by encouraging griefing 'playstyles' decided to popularize it among their viewerbase/fanbase and provide instructions that even 12-year old kids can follow, the amount of these shitheads doing it on Valve servers increased hugely. Haven't played Dustbowl or PL maps on Valve servers much in recent months, but I assume it's still very likely to run into an exploiter doing it on one of the above maps? Given how this is an engine-wide bug that can potentially break many maps and how the TF2 Team takes ages to fix things like these and avoids more radical, long-term solutions, I was 90% sure back then that it would take months to fix it, and make everyone's experience playing those maps worse. And here we are, almost half a year later, many maps still being open to griefing and not fixed on a per-map basis, and the quantum crouch thingy still being present in the engine. Yeah, that ''raising awarenes by exploitin' for a good cause'' is really working out, guys.

[QUOTE=Mort Stroodle;50351145]This is absurd, GM and beyond is absolutely tame in comparison to what was in the game before. A banana hat is nowhere NEAR as jarring as the unusual and prof. killstreak particle effects or neon paints. Even unusual weapons are more fitting than a lot of the older unusual effects. Honestly I'd rather see 100 banana hats than one of these: [T]http://i42.tinypic.com/2cgk5lu.jpg[/T][/QUOTE] Except that is an unusual, and as the name would suggest, it's not as common as the banana hat. Have many times have you actually seen a full lime scout with lime unusual in-game before?

[QUOTE=riki2cool;50351525]Except that is an unusual, and as the name would suggest, it's not as common as the banana hat. Have many times have you actually seen a full lime scout with lime unusual in-game before?[/QUOTE] 10 [sp]thousands*[/sp]

[QUOTE=Drury;50351430]Welcome to the new episode of [b]MU[/b]h art[b]S[/b]tyle. So much negativity as of late even though the game is more balanced than ever.[/QUOTE] what does balance have to do with cosmetics plus that last claim is super arguable

[QUOTE=riki2cool;50351525]Have many times have you actually seen a full lime scout with lime unusual in-game before?[/QUOTE] Personally, i didn't EVER meet them though i am playing a lot and was playing even before paints were a thing. I am a scout main and can confirm that scout mains don't give a shit about their stuff color at all. Strange Scattergun is all you need! :v: And at least in my eyes stupid cosmetic loadouts it like a big sign "kill me", you go for that fucker first and when he is dead you don't care about his crappy taste untill he is spawned to die again.

[QUOTE=Hell-met;50351556]what does balance have to do with cosmetics plus that last claim is super arguable[/QUOTE] What does balance have to do with cosmetics? One is the literal game, the other is absolutely meaningless. Why even criticize it if it doesn't affect the game.

[QUOTE=Drury;50351597]What does balance have to do with cosmetics? One is the literal game, the other is absolutely meaningless[/QUOTE] Yeah guys accept my fat fuckin penis hat because it doesnt affect gameplay come on valve stop being a baby [QUOTE=Drury;50351597]Why even criticize it if it doesn't affect the game.[/QUOTE] because it [I]does[/I] affect the game??? Just because it's not tied to gameplay doesn't mean it's meaningless you bigot

Also FYI the Potassium Bonnet is available in unusual qualities. So, if you happen to have 1909 keys laying about, this might be the loadout for you: [IMG]https://i.gyazo.com/1e9837d21c718b9373d44463172551bf.png[/IMG]

[QUOTE=riki2cool;50351843]Also FYI the Potassium Bonnet is available in unusual qualities. So, if you happen to have 1909 keys laying about, this might be the loadout for you: [IMG]https://i.gyazo.com/1e9837d21c718b9373d44463172551bf.png[/IMG][/QUOTE] I want to travel back in time and show it to all the people who were worried about hats when the Sniper vs Spy update came out.

Then again, people whine about cosmetics and stuff, but when we got possibility to revive original bullshitless TF2 nobody gave a damn except a couple of people that hopped in to have some fun with some old exploits and left forever Pro tip: if you want the server to fill don't leave it right when you join if it's empty

[QUOTE=Magypsy;50351902]I want to travel back in time and show it to all the people who were worried about hats when the Sniper vs Spy update came out.[/QUOTE] theyd say "nice photoshop. is that a deviantart contest?"

[QUOTE=Punchy;50351729]Yeah guys accept my fat fuckin penis hat because it doesnt affect gameplay come on valve stop being a baby because it [I]does[/I] affect the game??? Just because it's not tied to gameplay doesn't mean it's meaningless you bigot[/QUOTE] So now we suddenly care about hats. Okay then, I guess I'll just time-travel back a few months when there was still common sense around.

[QUOTE=Drury;50351597]What does balance have to do with cosmetics? One is the literal game, the other is absolutely meaningless. Why even criticize it if it doesn't affect the game.[/QUOTE] [img]http://puu.sh/nuDKJ/c7f19ea4af.jpg[/img] These cosmetics barely affect the game at all!

[QUOTE=Drury;50351976]So now we suddenly care about hats. Okay then, I guess I'll just time-travel back a few months when there was still common sense around.[/QUOTE] the weird thing is you trying to steer the discussion away for no reason "you dont like those hats huh? well you're wrong because the game is more balanced than before!" ??

[QUOTE=Magypsy;50352017][img]http://puu.sh/nuDKJ/c7f19ea4af.jpg[/img] These cosmetics barely affect the game at all![/QUOTE] True. So why do we suddenly give a shit about banana hats and unusuals then. [editline]19th May 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Hell-met;50352060]the weird thing is you trying to steer the discussion away for no reason "you dont like those hats huh? well you're wrong because the game is more balanced than before!" ??[/QUOTE] I'm not steering the discussion anywhere, the discussion is that hats are wrong because muh artstyle and I'm just calling bull.

[QUOTE=Avvy;50350915]would there be any chance of valve hosting official servers with random crits and weapon spread disabled in the future? i mean it would sort of make sense with the coming update focusing on competitive and all. i for one would absolutely love this since i think it would be a nice middleground between dead serious 6v6/HL and just dicking around on a public server.[/QUOTE] Kind of late, but isn't weapon spread disabled by default on valve servers? (IIRC, it was because disabling weapon spread broke lmaobox)

Also outright saying TF2 is a terribad game because of muh artstyle, is this 2009

[QUOTE=Drury;50352066]True. So why do we suddenly give a shit about banana hats and unusuals then.[/QUOTE] Because most of the biggest offenders have come out in the past few months. The ridiculous hats and unusual effects are ill-fitting, sure, but we never really got any cosmetics that blurred lines this badly until Valve started accepting community fixes a few months back.

[QUOTE=Magypsy;50352081]Because most of the biggest offenders have come out in the past few months. The ridiculous hats and unusual effects are ill-fitting, sure, but we never really got any cosmetics that blurred lines this badly until Valve started accepting community fixes a few months back.[/QUOTE] I'm entirely on board with this [QUOTE=Chrytin;50349202]I feel like this video is pretty relevant to the topic especially with the tier system in TF2 and just how far the artstyle has fallen from its original, intended form. [video]https://youtu.be/Q9RjDRLBWio[/video] To throw in my two cents and elaborate on what I said earlier, in terms of art style, aesthetic and principles, almost everything since GM has been absolutely detrimental, though that isn't to say it wasn't bad before, merely that GM and beyond it has been rapidly accelerating in a direction it really shouldn't be going. Rarity is another part of this poorly chosen direction, as it's being used as an excuse for putting in more ridiculous and out of place crap that shouldn't be in the game at all. Admittedly, out of place hats and other stuff is hardly new, but just because there is a history of artstyle breaking cosmetics does not mean that Valve should keep trying to one up themselves by adding even more out of place and visually unappealing garbage. They should look to those previous mistakes and make an honest attempt to not make them again. Just because the artstyle has already been diluted as it has been does not mean it should continue to be more so, and if possible, attempts should be made at fixing those missteps in the past so we can maybe one day see a game where all the hats and all the cosmetics actually seem to fit. But really that's beyond wishful thinking, and going forward I fully expect to see Valve continue the course of rarity tiers and out of place nonsense that only serves to further dilute and destroy the games already dying artstyle.[/QUOTE] I'm absolutely not on board with this.

Well this video is kinda too much, i don't even remember when did i spend real life money on cosmetics in games last time, but i still feel kinda guilty (don't know how to describe that feeling properly) after watching it for some reason lol

[QUOTE=Drury;50351597]What does balance have to do with cosmetics? One is the literal game, the other is absolutely meaningless. Why even criticize it if it doesn't affect the game.[/QUOTE] If you've actually listened to the dev commentary you'd know that's wrong because art direction is one of the most talked about things in it. Visuals and aesthetics have a huge part in gameplay with tf2, with class, team and weapon identification being the biggest examples. Loads of cosmetics and effects not only hinder your ability to identify threats but also make for a wildly inconsistent presentation. And if you are someone who wants this game to attract and keep in new players, the gratuitous amount of theme breaking visual clutter and particle effects are in no way helpful to fulfilling that goal. It makes people write the game off as confusing, tacky and visually overwhelming. Far from what it was originally, or even prior to Mannconomy when unusuals first came out. The first few waves of hats really complimented the artstyle and helped add a bit of variety to the game. But as of late that's far from the case. Sure, all the hats and skins and unusuals don't directly affect the balance of weapons or the gameplay of maps, but it's foolish to suggest that they don't have a notable effect on the game as a whole.

The game was good. The artstyle died. The game was still good. It is still good. End of story.