Major Update Speculation XXX: cp_orange_x3 confirmed!

[Punchy]

[QUOTE=KKres;49359103]You know what else can kill you from around the corner? Heavy rev-jumping out. From much larger distance. Also, the 'scary' phlog damage after krits is just 80% of normal minigun damage. Care to enlighten us why one is a [I]terrible disaster[/I] and the other normal part of game?
[/QUOTE]

Except heavy revs are extremely nerfed, and if you turn 180, run and jump the heavy will blast you 100 yards away. Try that with a phlog, you will disintegrate. Not to mention heavies are loud and you will more than likely hear him jolly yelling voice commands and unrevving a minute beforehand, allowing you to assume a heavy is nearby, while all a pyro has to do is taunt with a single voice command that can't be pinpointed to location by sound easy.

Pyro with mmph does NOT mean he has killed 2 players, it means he has spammed 1.5 players worth of fire damage. This is NOT outplaying, this is sitting 200 yards back spamming a scorch shot for 30 seconds. This is killing 2 dumb team players. that does NOT mean they outplayed you, it means he outplayed 2 idiots and you're gonna be punished for it.

[kariko]

[QUOTE=GeeNoVoid;49359068]It could just be reverted back to the way it was before the update. I personally wasn't bothered by it that much then. :pudge:[/QUOTE]

Same with every engi nerf in my opinion. Also does anyone have a list/comparison of "Updated various weapon descriptions to better detail their functionality"? I'm curious about that.

[Omgwtfbbq]

[QUOTE=kariko;49359219]Same with every engi nerf in my opinion. Also does anyone have a list/comparison of "Updated various weapon descriptions to better detail their functionality"? I'm curious about that.[/QUOTE]

I think it's just primarily adding descriptions to items that do not have immediately obvious functionalities, such as the Knife gaining a description about getting backstabs. (Then again, I've not played for a while, this may have been pre-existing).

[14bux]

[QUOTE=KKres;49359103]You know what else can kill you from around the corner? Heavy rev-jumping out. From much larger distance. Also, the 'scary' phlog damage after krits is just 80% of normal minigun damage. Care to enlighten us why one is a [I]terrible disaster[/I] and the other normal part of game?[/QUOTE]
First, you're playing a fat man who moves way slower than any other class, and you can run away. Even if you can't totally run behind a wall (which are easy to find) his range with it won't just pop out and kill you. Second, the rev speed doesn't make him invuln or heal. I'm not boarding the phlog hate train, but lets set a few things straight.

[QUOTE=KKres;49359103]Look, pyro had, in order, three common tactics - combos, airblasting, fire damage. First two were more effective, but with recent nerf, pyros moved to third - and surprise, surprise, some people woke up and discovered weak fire/afterburn puff damage of degreaser is [I]not[/I] what the pyro is really capable of and now screech to kill last pyro strong point. Which is really ironic, because without two above nerfs no one would even notice phlog change. It's that situational. Pyro with mmmph means he killed at least 2 players, killed soldier/heavy, heavily unequal match without airblast, or heavily damaged whole enemy team. This is very definition of outplaying you and frankly, I'll take phlog/backburner pyro any day over old degrea1337wombocombo180noscope stunlock instakill, thank you very much.[/QUOTE]

200 damage is not as crazy as you may think. The phlog doesn't operate on kills, so that allows you to earn mmph by merely setting things on fire then making a break for it, relying on afterburn to fill your meter (after burn does max 65 damage, but on average lets say about 30). Add on to that the fact that flares count towards phlog damage, you don't even have to get in ambush range to get the possibly team-destroying annihilation.

I don't advocate for people mindlessly hating on the phlog, but the fact of the matter is it's way too easy for a pyro to get the mmph, you can often walk right in front of a payload or point, spray two people, then run or mmph if you have it. It doesn't need to become nothing, it just needs tweaked. It's a decent concept.

[TheJukebox]

[URL="https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1306785"]There's a thread for complaining about the Phlog, and MUS isn't it.[/URL]

[Makzutheamazing]

Speaking about complaining:

are you people still miffed about the new hats having grades?

[Cock Boner]

[QUOTE=Makzu;49359535]Speaking about complaining:

are you people still miffed about the new hats having grades?[/QUOTE]

I was miffed until I realized about fifteen seconds later that they're just being up front about a system they've been using since crates were released

[Chrytin]

[QUOTE=Makzu;49359535]Speaking about complaining:

are you people still miffed about the new hats having grades?[/QUOTE]

I'm more miffed that crates are basically dead, because there are still weapons in this game without Strange variants. Sandvich, Buffalo Steak, Vita-Saw and plenty of others. Not to mention parts, which as a whole have now become more expensive than most of the weapons they are meant to be applied to. Low tier parts are almost non existant on the market because of Stat-swap tool crafting, and high value parts are from otherwise worthless old munitions and supply series that aren't being opened anymore. Basically, the switch to cases ensures that we only get hats, skins and reskins (Invasion). The last time we got new parts or normal stranges was march. I hope to god that if they release the last few weapons without Strange variants they aren't arbitrarily tiered, and that isn't even because of rarity. It's literally only because I hate tier names and colors showing up in the item info and it would make those stranges bastard outliers. I wouldn't put it past Valve to do that and make the Strange Sandvich elite grade so they can bring in more shekels from unboxing.

[pepetoads]

[QUOTE=Chrytin;49359610]I'm more miffed that crates are basically dead, because there are still weapons in this game without Strange variants. Sandvich, Buffalo Steak, Vita-Saw and plenty of others. Not to mention parts, which as a whole have now become more expensive than most of the weapons they are meant to be applied to. Low tier parts are almost non existant on the market because of Stat-swap tool crafting, and high value parts are from otherwise worthless old munitions and supply series that aren't being opened anymore. Basically, the switch to cases ensures that we only get hats, skins and reskins (Invasion). The last time we got new parts or normal stranges was march. I hope to god that if they release the last few weapons without Strange variants they aren't arbitrarily tiered, and that isn't even because of rarity. It's literally only because I hate tier names and colors showing up in the item info and it would make those stranges bastard outliers. I wouldn't put it past Valve to do that and make the Strange Sandvich elite grade so they can bring in more shekels from unboxing.[/QUOTE]

you know what would be crate?

an update with crates instead of cases!

[EmilyVasquez]

I think the reason the Vita-Saw would never get a strange is possibly due to copyright seasons.

[pepetoads]

[QUOTE=EmilyVasquez;49359678]I think the reason the Vita-Saw would never get a strange is possibly due to copyright seasons.[/QUOTE]

it got a killstreaker, im sure it can get a strangifier.

but there are so many other weapons that need a strange that it wouldn't be purposeful to dwell on one in particular.

[EmilyVasquez]

If there were weapons i'd want strangifiers to, it'd be: The Back Scatter, Iron Bomber, Quickiebomb Launcher, (maybe) the Panic Attack and also some reskins.

[cha0s]

-i should read-

[Saikyo]

-snips-

[TectonicImprov]

[QUOTE=Cock Boner;49359567]I was miffed until I realized about fifteen seconds later that they're just being up front about a system they've been using since crates were released[/QUOTE]

For cosmetic only crates you had the same chance to get any of the cosmetics, and on crates with stranges and hats, the hats were on the same rarity too. Rarity grades are stupid. One of my least favorite things about them is how thanks to them we have like, six new font colors. It's just pointless padding.

[kariko]

I want stranges for every weapon just because why not.

[Chrytin]

[QUOTE=EmilyVasquez;49359702]If there were weapons i'd want strangifiers to, it'd be: The Back Scatter, Iron Bomber, Quickiebomb Launcher, (maybe) the Panic Attack and also some reskins.[/QUOTE]

I believe every weapon in the game should have strangifiers and there would be a very simple way to do that and increase the value of stranges at the same time; Chemistry Sets. How they are to be obtained could be a variety of ways (MvM loot, drop, unbox, craft, etc.) but what is important is function. Basically it is the same as the series 1 and 2 Strangifier Chem sets with 1 difference; input and output are completely blank. So whatever strange weapon you put in is what strangifier you get out. I think this would strengthen the economy as a whole because it would increase the value of Collectors, Genuines and Vintages, as well as stranges, as the number of just stranges declines in favor of Strange Genuines and Strange Vintages, which may also lead to more unboxing. Literally everyone wins.

[Fluury]

It has been a year now, and I still want a Quickiebomb launcher Strange.

The main reason why I am annoyed about Cosmetic-Cases is because back then, certain Hats were rare because there were straight out so many Cosmetics in a crate. You'd have a , what, 1:67 Chance to get a certain hat, because there were 67 hats in there.

Hats would get a certain value because of the Quality of the cosmetic, not because Valve forces it.

[Ben 10 Fluid]

[QUOTE=Blackavar;49357542]doesn't make it any less dumb

we're about to get matchmaking, which will strip pubs of activity

and we ought to balance toward it.[/QUOTE]

That kind of terrible "logic" makes me dislike the competitive scene of tf2.

[pepetoads]

[QUOTE=xASTRIXx;49359924]That kind of terrible "logic" makes me dislike the competitive scene of tf2.[/QUOTE]

yeah because casual counter-strike is so fun, balanced, and great! that's why it's the number one first person shooter!

[Doctor Hunt]

Strange Iron Curtain when

[Chrytin]

[QUOTE=Doctor Hunt;49360096]Strange Iron Curtain when[/QUOTE]

When we get the Strange Promos case with a Comando Grade Iron Curtain Strangifier. Be ready for Assasin Grade Lugermorph Strangifiers and Elite Grade Severed Head Strangifiers. Valve needs more of those unbox shekels.

[TectonicImprov]

[QUOTE=xASTRIXx;49359924]That kind of terrible "logic" makes me dislike the competitive scene of tf2.[/QUOTE]

I too dismiss entire communities because of one person's dumb remark.

[Joofle]

[QUOTE=Punchy;49359109]Except heavy revs are extremely nerfed[/QUOTE]

A little while back you were complaining that Valve thinks Heavy is fine as he is with the revup nerfs. Are we to assume that if those nerfs were reverted you would be complaining about how powerful it is like you are now with the phlog?

[QUOTE]and if you turn 180, run and jump the heavy will blast you 100 yards away.[/QUOTE]

This much is true but even then the heavy has enough range to finish you off after said ass blasting.

And pyros [I]have[/I] to make noise while taunting with the phlog. If you hear a heavy spamming voice commands from around the corner then it's his own fault for making that choice.

Not saying your point is bad but it's not unbiased either.

[EmilyVasquez]

Did you make an account just to complain to Punchy :v:?

[Punchy]

[QUOTE=Joofle;49360286]A little while back you were complaining that Valve thinks Heavy is fine as he is with the revup nerfs. Are we to assume that if those nerfs were reverted you would be complaining about how powerful it is like you are now with the phlog?

This much is true but even then the heavy has enough range to finish you off after said ass blasting.

And pyros [I]have[/I] to make noise while taunting with the phlog. If you hear a heavy spamming voice commands from around the corner then it's his own fault for making that choice.

Not saying your point is bad but it's not unbiased either.[/QUOTE]

If he had his damage spread reverted [I]or[/I] lessen the impact of his damage buildup, I would complain of nothing. And most times i've escaped a corner heavy I've easily found cover to hide, forcing him to unrev if he wants to make chase giving plenty more oppertunity to run

also, heavies are not always at fault for voicelines. He screams about the cart, shooting his weapons and eating. He is just a loud class in general, valve developed him this way specifically so people could tell if one is nearby. Valve didn't give pyro the same treatment, him being a flank class who is meant to be sneaking his way into enemy territory, not meteor blasting anybody who steps into theirs for a second.

[Joofle]

[QUOTE=EmilyVasquez;49360339]Did you make an account just to complain to Punchy :v:?[/QUOTE]

Nah, I made one a little while ago. I just never had anything to say until now.
Just a lurker pretty much

[DONK! 2x]

[QUOTE=Joofle;49360286]
And pyros [I]have[/I] to make noise while taunting with the phlog. If you hear a heavy spamming voice commands from around the corner then it's his own fault for making that choice.
[/QUOTE]
the problem is all of pyro's lines are MMMPH BMMHMHPHH, so it's a bit hard to tell if it's a phlog taunt or just a regular screaming pyro

[Dragadur]

[QUOTE=DONK! 2x;49360449]the problem is all of pyro's lines are MMMPH BMMHMHPHH, so it's a bit hard to tell if it's a phlog taunt or just a regular screaming pyro[/QUOTE]

I'm pretty sure the taunt has one specific warcry.

[Chrytin]

[QUOTE=Dragadur;49360473]I'm pretty sure the taunt has one specific warcry.[/QUOTE]

Not if you use a voice command; use of any voice commands will cancel out the noise he makes when he taunts. I just call for a medic when I pop my Mmph because it makes the pyro silent much faster.