VALVE CUT CONTENT V2+1: Digging through Valve's trash since 2003! - Games

If you want to talk about HL2-physics puzzles being bad and not very rewarding or coherent to stuff, you gotta talk about ludonarratives. HL2 is a game about running and shooting, and using different visual set-pieces to keep you from getting bored, the plot supports this. Having to make a see-saw with concrete-blocks and occasionally fire isn't very fun, and neither is throwing boxes into a puddle and sometimes as a result the water or something else moves or is electrified. The game isn't about those gameplay concepts and trying to enforce those mechanics is a waste of time. Instead, one could put more emphasis on exploring the running and shooting mechanics that half-life 2 has and having running and shooting puzzles reinforces those mechanics, and a good place to do that is in City 17, before the player even knows that combat even happens in the game. Teaching a player how to use cover, slice a pie, and not waste their energy bar, and having them memorize those skills before combat happens means you can have harder, more intricate and complex combat when you want it, and spending less time handholding the player through other means which are more frustrating for them. Like this is a problem that half life 2 has, because the game wants to rush into things without letting you learn how to play it, and while it does this to try to convey the feeling that you're doing everything on the fly, when you die 10 times to the same thing and Alyx or Barney is like "do this and this and this and this" and your brain can't decipher what it wants to actually do you get angry and want to stop. Like, you gotta optimize not only the game itself so that it runs okay, you gotta optimize the players time, skillset, and cognitive function. Your brain wants to take half a second to decide where to go, and if you get lost and aren't prepared to, you get angry and frustrated. You gotta like play your maps, and decide what your looking at in every-room and hallway and where you want to go, and where you know your supposed to go, and when you map, you gotta make the where you want to go, and the where your supposed to go, like congruent. Notice where people look when they play the maps and when they enter or exit a room where their eyes (camera) start pointing at, and where their eyes (camera) dart to first when they look for the exit, and map around that. You got to make every room where there's a gameplay mechanic relevant to the specific skillset you're trying to develop. Think of it kind of like your mapping for the first Portal game and Counter-Strike: Go at the same time, where in Portal everything is optimized towards portaling and that skillset and everything you do and hear is there to support that, and Counter-Strike, where the time it takes to go somewhere is calculated specifically, and where your eyes end up at a path and where your intend to move toward that path is made specifically so you don't have to think about it as much, and you can instead spend more mental-calculations aiming and shooting at people in their face. Like, thats essentially the jist of how you keep people from being lost in a map, basically. Also detailing in shapes that help move eye direction and simple shapes that your brain can process easily to orient them towards the right way to go, and putting lots more detail into important places your heading to that you can see in the background and where your exit specifically is would help too. Sorry for exploding my Ludo-narrative Dissonance with raspberry vinaigrette and a red wine reduction all over your faces, and being like "this is how mapping really works scrubs", and like also I don't really get why people would be lost in Dark Interval because most of it is literally the easiest to follow for me, and if I do get lost it's not really a "i'm tense" thing where i'll get mad, i'll usually treat it as like "I missed something, but this gives me a chance to look at all this cool art" I think 95navigator is like right, cause there should always be room to look around and do stuff in a videogame. But i disagree tho that open-world games are better than linear games. I think their both really good in their own rights, and really shitty in their own ways too. But open-world games could always be more linear and thats a good thing, and linear games could also be more open and thats a good thing too. It's just knowing about how much do you think you can want in a game, and how easy it would be to do it.

apologies there. i'm with you too on a second thought. at least when it comes to tutorials they did some things right: ep2 introduction to new players, portal introductions. jeep tutorial, kind of. ep1 does a good job forcing the player to go without the trusty weapon. or hl2 mini tut about crowbar or eli's yard gravgun play. Even antlions introduction! sure, so you're saying that trainstation should have more puzzles to explore and streetwar be more combat-ish than it is? should the game been longer? (hl2 is slightly shorter than hl1) lastly, it's up to the player to use the stuff wisely but the problem with the game is the misleading practices it teaches the player

Following standards rationale there, other things that can help guide the player are flickering lights (though you have to be careful not to make it TOO obvious - it has to fit within the environment), or dynamic supply crates (there was always a supply crate, or some goodies in any important place in HL2). Players in a dark space are always going to be guided by the few lights that space has - thats how the entire Lowlife chapter worked. And playwers who are lost are always going to be attracted to more and more goodies, especially if the level is quite hard.

Ok, forgive me if this is a late discovery, but since this thread needs a bit of reviving, Ill start. Remember the original Airex vmf's? Remember all that _orphaned hidden mess of stuff? Apparently, if you open that problematic vmf with Notepad++, and update the "editorbuild" and the "formatversion" to the absolute most recent values, it all goes away. All you need to do then is solve the orphaned problem using the "Check For Problems" dialog, and you start to be able to select every visgroup as it was. Once again, sorry if this is quite late, but I only discovered this now. Im quite shocked, as it means we can compile a fully functioning Airex as it was back in 2001.

[QUOTE=95Navigator;52899710]update the "editorbuild" and the "formatversion" to the absolute most recent values[/QUOTE] What would they be?

[QUOTE=HGrunt;52899843]What would they be?[/QUOTE] Creating any new map in Hammer (the SDK 2013 one), and opening it with Notepad++ as well reveals those values. For a map created now, my values are: "editorbuild" "6440" "formatversion" "100" Copying and pasting those values in any WC vmf with orphaned problems changes the visgroup handling. EDIT: On airex_0102, it even reveals visgrops that were once completely orphaned. There is a visgroup in that map named _sec tunnel that I have never seen before.

[QUOTE=95Navigator;52899880]On airex_0102, it even reveals visgrops that were once completely orphaned. There is a visgroup in that map named _sec tunnel that I have never seen before.[/QUOTE] That group was visible before editing the map with your method. Actually no new vis groups appeared for me. Maybe those groups were messed only on retail hammer? I was checking on HL2 leak hammer.

[QUOTE=BuTou;52900499]That group was visible before editing the map with your method. Actually no new vis groups appeared for me. Maybe those groups were messed only on retail hammer? I was checking on HL2 leak hammer.[/QUOTE] It never appeared to me, and if I open up a fresh 2001 copy of airex_0102, it doesnt appear as well. Actually a few never before seen visgroups popped up in every map I tested this on (provided that same map had orphaned problems in the first place). It may be because of Hammer differences, as you very well stated. Be advised I only tested this on the most recent Hammer, with an updated Source SDK 2013. I wouldnt know about the Leak Hammer, but if it works as well, all the better. This has the best results especially on the Dave maps (which are the messier ones, with tons of unused content in every vmf). It actually makes them usable now.

[QUOTE=95Navigator;52900668]if it works as well, all the better. [/QUOTE] It works well, even better than Source 2013 Hammer, because it's stable since Valve don't have a chance to spoil it with their "updates":v:

[QUOTE=BuTou;52900746]It works well, even better than Source 2013 Hammer, because it's stable since Valve don't have a chance to spoil it with their "updates":v:[/QUOTE] I admit sometimes I considered just mapping for the Leak altogether, if it weren't for things like particle effects, HDR, projected textures and just overall stability. The LeakNet patch is getting better and better (amazing work you guys), it just pushes me even further towards that possibility.

-snip-

That fix for _orphanedhidden makes me sad, because it means I spent hours back in the day manually reassembling stuff by hand for nothing

does enyone knows how to rotate a animation or smd file (whaterver you call it) to 90 degrees in blender i am porting some models from goldsource and i found some locked walking anims so i can add them to my model can somebody help me?

[QUOTE=Kuro.;52901758]That fix for _orphanedhidden makes me sad, because it means I spent hours back in the day manually reassembling stuff by hand for nothing[/QUOTE] But hey, now you can reassemble in 1/10 of the time, with 10 times more accuracy! Im working on a new, frsh version of the Airex chapter, and the differences are staggering. There were tons of small objects I missed.

[QUOTE=Kuro.;52901758]That fix for _orphanedhidden makes me sad, because it means I spent hours back in the day manually reassembling stuff by hand for nothing[/QUOTE] At least now you know you were (probably) on the right track!

Hey, look up at the sky! It's a bird, wait, it's the password for the repo! ..it's a tripod? [IMG]https://i.imgur.com/pGc5Ztw.png[/IMG] [url]https://www.dropbox.com/s/wdz8xa0gwnvp0w9/thetripod.zip?dl=0[/url] ==NOT MADE FOR RETAIL, PLAY WITH A (PATCHED) HL2 LEAK==

[QUOTE=That Robot;52906298]Hey, look up at the sky! It's a bird, wait, it's the password for the repo! ..yeah, no, it's a map. Have fun. [url]https://www.dropbox.com/s/wdz8xa0gwnvp0w9/thetripod.zip?dl=0[/url] ==NOT MADE FOR RETAIL, PLAY WITH A (PATCHED) HL2 LEAK==[/QUOTE] This appears to be an edited ruins12/13 but with a brush tripod from War of the Worlds on it that stomps the ground and fires lasers occasionally, resulting in a shower of ERROR models. There's also an underground part added for some reason. Also, please provide screenshots of whatever file you post here. [t]https://i.imgur.com/9ToPLeB.png[/t] [t]https://i.imgur.com/5lhdsAR.png[/t]

Is that giant tripod supposed to be a strider?

[QUOTE=standards;52907066]Is that giant tripod supposed to be a strider?[/QUOTE] No, if it was supposed to be a strider it would have been as strider, as the model is available in the leak.

[QUOTE=standards;52907066]Is that giant tripod supposed to be a strider?[/QUOTE] H.G. Wells' War of the Worlds is the reason why alien invasion fiction since 1898 has to include alien tripods, HL2 included.

i think it'd be cool if striders were that size, and they were like these small mini-boss/ mini-levels where you like took cover from their lazers and they destroyed your cover, and block your path and stuff, and then you climbed up them and then destroyed them from the inside out, or like, rode on it, and when they collapsed you'd be in an entirely different area.

I find it abundantly amazing how people rate the reply to the mini-mod and not the original post itself :V

[QUOTE=PikaCommando;52906375]This appears to be an edited ruins12/13 but with a brush tripod from War of the Worlds on it that stomps the ground and fires lasers occasionally, resulting in a shower of ERROR models.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=PikaCommando;52906375]shower of ERROR models[/QUOTE] Holy shit just the thought alone makes me shiver a bit. I dunno what happened to me, or what the fuck is wrong with my brain, but I am incredibly fearful of the ERROR model itself. Just its appearance alone scares the FUCK out of me, enough to jump out of my chair. Im not even remotely joking. Insolence has an edited ERROR model with its texture invisible just because of this.

[QUOTE=95Navigator;52908493]Holy shit just the thought alone makes me shiver a bit. I dunno what happened to me, or what the fuck is wrong with my brain, but I am incredibly fearful of the ERROR model itself. Just its appearance alone scares the FUCK out of me, enough to jump out of my chair. Im not even remotely joking. Insolence has an edited ERROR model with its texture invisible just because of this.[/QUOTE] I thought I was the only one.

[QUOTE=95Navigator;52908493] Insolence has an edited ERROR model with its texture invisible just because of this.[/QUOTE] It was actually because I was too lazy to fix all the missing models so I $nodraw'd the ERROR's texture. I was a total hack :v:

[QUOTE=Sergeant Stacker;52908556]It was actually because I was too lazy to fix all the missing models so I $nodraw'd the ERROR's texture. I was a total hack :v:[/QUOTE] Is it possible to remove the shadow out of a model? The shadow itself ALSO scares the hell out of me.

I feel like a horrible person but for some reason this is very funny to me

similar thing for me, maybe I developed those weird fears when I remember as a young kid I fell into a black void in some shooter game, I got scared shitless by the lack of audio and pure blackness. I fell so far that polygons got distorted probably because of vertex precision loss. Still haunts me to this day, I am afraid to go out of bounds in video games

That must be kind of hard. ERROR models can be rudimentarly hidden... going out of bounds is really needed in some old WC maps. Must suck.

[QUOTE=95Navigator;52908562]Is it possible to remove the shadow out of a model? The shadow itself ALSO scares the hell out of me.[/QUOTE] $noshadow 1, no? I'm sure there's a parameter for it.