TF2 General Chat and Update Speculation Station - One of Several Edition - Games

[QUOTE=Cpt. Cakes;52514440]A reminder: Meet Your Match took like 4 years to complete I think (pretty sure valve announced that they were working on matchmaking around 2-3 years before it came out) and it still turned out insanely buggy. The Pyro/Jungle update has only been in development for slightly over a year now. I'd maybe hope for August, but wouldn't be surprised if it's in September or October.[/QUOTE] Well, we know how valve works, so 4 years sure, but with how many people working on it, how regularely? Seems obvious to me that development speed varies a ton at valve, depending on how many people work on the feature at any time. It's pretty much why they don't set deadlines anymore. So maybe only one or two devs were working on match making for the longest time on and off, but the whole team has focused on the pyro update. If we follow your logic, every update would have taken 4 years to make.

It is the general workflow for Valve. They'll have momentum on something and work on it for a good while, then get to another project and work on that for a while before coming back. I noticed this quite readily maybe a year after custom games came to Dota 2. The first year was great; some devs on the Dota 2 team came to our IRC channel on a semi-regular basis, gauged our input on things, made fixes and implemented suggestions where needed. Then it halted a few months later. I think this was around the time they announced Majors and the whole custom games thing kinda died like nothing happened. Valve's spontaneity is both a boon and a curse.

[QUOTE=ToyokaX;52514732]It is the general workflow for Valve. They'll have momentum on something and work on it for a good while, then get to another project and work on that for a while before coming back. I noticed this quite readily maybe a year after custom games came to Dota 2. The first year was great; some devs on the Dota 2 team came to our IRC channel on a semi-regular basis, gauged our input on things, made fixes and implemented suggestions where needed. Then it halted a few months later. I think this was around the time they announced Majors and the whole custom games thing kinda died like nothing happened. Valve's spontaneity is both a boon and a curse.[/QUOTE] A good example of this is Powerhouse. It was supposed to be in the game by the 2007 launch, but the developer who was working on the map never finished it and went on to other projects. He just recently returned to finish the map, and here it is. This also explains why it looks like some early TF2 maps like Hydro.

[QUOTE=Cpt. Cakes;52514745]A good example of this is Powerhouse. It was supposed to be in the game by the 2007 launch, but the developer who was working on the map never finished it and went on to other projects. He just recently returned to finish the map, and here it is. This also explains why it looks like some early TF2 maps like Hydro.[/QUOTE] Whats the most interesting part of that story, as i heard it's really true is, that NO ONE else touches the other peoples work. Not even to finish it up. I assume it's nowhere in some central version system either or if it is, then it's just not gonna be touched anyone else. Dare i say that this happened to Cactus Canyon and Asteroid too? Its actually the same thing with community maps that have gone official. Valve doesn't update them, but the creators will and submit changes to them. Only at the point where the original creator isn't anymore around and map needs some fix that cannot be just ignored, they will patch it.

VNN mentionned the CSGO official twitter being super active recently in his last video, and indeed it tweets almost daily and answers concerns of the community, so I cheaked out when was the last time tf2's twitted. Kinda regret I did. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/8JmzOpA.png[/IMG] (half of the facebook links are dead)

[QUOTE=ics;52514780]Whats the most interesting part of that story, as i heard it's really true is, that NO ONE else touches the other peoples work. Not even to finish it up. I assume it's nowhere in some central version system either or if it is, then it's just not gonna be touched anyone else. Dare i say that this happened to Cactus Canyon and Asteroid too? Its actually the same thing with community maps that have gone official. Valve doesn't update them, but the creators will and submit changes to them. Only at the point where the original creator isn't anymore around and map needs some fix that cannot be just ignored, they will patch it.[/QUOTE] They did however make lakeside event without talking to the community mapper who made lakeside first, though. I thought that was interesting when I heard it.

[QUOTE=Loth;52514788]VNN mentionned the CSGO official twitter being super active recently in his last video, and indeed it tweets almost daily and answers concerns of the community, so I cheaked out when was the last time tf2's twitted. Kinda regret I did. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/8JmzOpA.png[/IMG] (half of the facebook links are dead)[/QUOTE] now im bored and sad, do they have any other forms of social media to post stuff? other than the blog and this?

[QUOTE=UEAKCrash;52514797]They did however make lakeside event without talking to the community mapper who made lakeside first, though. I thought that was interesting when I heard it.[/QUOTE] That is interesting, as Lakeside is a huge aesthetic improvement over the original. It's my favorite event map by a huge margin.

[QUOTE=Senor Muffin;52514808]now im bored and sad, do they have any other forms of social media to post stuff? other than the blog and this?[/QUOTE] Their facebook page, which does the exact same thing, repost blog posts, comic releases and some updates every few months. And half of the tweets are a link to the facebook page instead of you know...using twitter So basicely it's only the blog. Csgo has a blog too, but they use twitter to answer questions and give quick updates. they are also active on reddit, some of the tweets are a link to a reddit comment from a dev. The tf team answers questions sometimes on reddit, and communicates with communities like tf2maps from time to time for very specific engine/mapping related stuff that 's only interesting to them. So they do contact the community from time to time. the twitter is a huge missed opportunity though, they could tweet about community events or comp leagues like CSGO does. And it would be cool as hell if they shared great tf2 artwork/content made, there's never a shortage of that. It'd connect to the community in a cool way. Many games studios do that and it shows they understand their players.

[QUOTE=UEAKCrash;52514797]They did however make lakeside event without talking to the community mapper who made lakeside first, though. I thought that was interesting when I heard it.[/QUOTE] I heard that the harvest_event was complete surprise to the creator of it too, despite tf2 wiki saying otherwise. But those maps have been added the "old way" instead the way of some of the maps as moonshine_event and the ones i did. EDIT I dont know if it makes any difference on the way they were added. I guess Valve can do whatever they want with them at any point.

Rate Agree if you think we get something next week Rate Disagree if you think September or later Rate Optimistic if you think august

next week is august...

[QUOTE=AD/HD;52514996]next week is august...[/QUOTE] I mean mid august i suppose

[t]http://i.imgur.com/3roSgqj.png[/t] Painfully accurate shitpost stolen from reddit. I maintain: Mic Snobs (my server group) is shutting down our server on August 18th* and it is a race between that definite date and Valve's sluggish release of the Pyro update. *We're working on finding a replacement but it turns out game servers don't grow on Dracaenas.

[QUOTE=Ultravod;52515023][t]http://i.imgur.com/3roSgqj.png[/t] Painfully accurate shitpost stolen from reddit.[/QUOTE] would be if the line was flat at the bottom of the graph

What if they came up with a metal sink idea where you can buy more contracts with metal?

[QUOTE=CoolJosh3k;52515073]What if they came up with a metal sink idea where you can buy more contracts with metal?[/QUOTE] i think it would be cool if you could use metal to "repare" skins, and take them one wear level up, ie ft to mw

[QUOTE=CoolJosh3k;52515073]What if they came up with a metal sink idea where you can buy more contracts with metal?[/QUOTE] There are thousands of ways to prevent or even revert in-game items quantity growth, yet to this day none are implemented.

[QUOTE=ics;52514780]Whats the most interesting part of that story, as i heard it's really true is, that NO ONE else touches the other peoples work. Not even to finish it up. I assume it's nowhere in some central version system either or if it is, then it's just not gonna be touched anyone else. Dare i say that this happened to Cactus Canyon and Asteroid too? Its actually the same thing with community maps that have gone official. Valve doesn't update them, but the creators will and submit changes to them. Only at the point where the original creator isn't anymore around and map needs some fix that cannot be just ignored, they will patch it.[/QUOTE] I've had a thought before of some of the community contributors contacting WETA to see if they could model the weapons for the Medic and Scout Grodbort sets to finally get that shit finished and ready to implement. I'm not sure what legal stuff would go behind that, but I feel like it would be worth a shot at this point since WETA obviously won't do it.

[QUOTE=CoolJosh3k;52515073]What if they came up with a metal sink idea where you can buy more contracts with metal?[/QUOTE] >metal sink All spelling errors aside, I honestly think this would be a good idea. Last time i checked, there is about 10,000 refined metal in existence. The whole "metal sync" idea would be a good idea to help Refined Metal increase in price, therefore lowering the price of keys. Though i love this idea, i think it'd be hard to implement. I swear i saw a video on Youtube stating that the TF2 team had mentioned this idea, but they stated that they were having trouble testing it. [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Greenberg shit" - Novangel))[/highlight]

If the patch notes don't include a balance pass for almost every problematic weapon in the game (including the underpowered ones), I'm going to be severely disappointed. With each passing day, my expectations only mount. If it turns out that after all this time, the team focused most of their energies toward a map and a gimmicky contract system over the very foundation of the game, I think I'm going to check myself into the local psychiatric ward.

At this point I honestly don't care anymore. My summer vacations are almost over, I won't have time to play the game in a long time. This wasn't probably the best choice Valve could pick, great updates like WAR or Love & war didn't need a year and a half to come out. And certainly those updates did not "need" to cancel both halloween and smissmas (which is debatable to call those "major" updates after the first time they did it). Also, a random guess I have is that the Heavy Update is going to be the last MAJOR update. After that, probably random patches here and there, but never something quite big.

[QUOTE=socks_;52515170]>metal sink All spelling errors aside, I honestly think this would be a good idea. Last time i checked, there is about 10,000 refined metal in existence. The whole "metal sync" idea would be a good idea to help Refined Metal increase in price, therefore lowering the price of keys. Though i love this idea, i think it'd be hard to implement. I swear i saw a video on Youtube stating that the TF2 team had mentioned this idea, but they stated that they were having trouble testing it.[/QUOTE] Metal sink is the commonly used grammatically correct term, as in we're "flushing" metal out of the economy. It's not about "synchronizing" anything.

[QUOTE=Chicken McFly;52515199]great updates like WAR or Love & war didn't need a year and a half to come out. [/QUOTE] I have to disagree on the implication that great update =/= needs a year and a half. WAR! was a very simple update. It was essentially "We make new weapons for these two classes plus a bonus one, pit those two classes together, see who wins and gets the bonus item, release some new maps + bug fixes." They were able to accomplish this in such short time due to the fact that TF2 was only two years old, with a low map count and low weapon count, which meant lesser need for rebalances, and less bugs. Love and War was average. Love and War was definitely NOT a great update

[QUOTE=Lord Exor;52515197]If the patch notes don't include a balance pass for almost every problematic weapon in the game (including the underpowered ones), I'm going to be severely disappointed. With each passing day, my expectations only mount. If it turns out that after all this time, the team focused most of their energies toward a map and a gimmicky contract system over the very foundation of the game, I think I'm going to check myself into the local psychiatric ward.[/QUOTE] I was pretty surprised there was no Bison buff or Pomson rework in the balance blog post. I'll be disappointed if those weapons aren't touched in the upcoming update.

[QUOTE=Lord Exor;52515197]If the patch notes don't include a balance pass for almost every problematic weapon in the game (including the underpowered ones), I'm going to be severely disappointed. With each passing day, my expectations only mount. If it turns out that after all this time, the team focused most of their energies toward a map and a gimmicky contract system over the very foundation of the game, I think I'm going to check myself into the local psychiatric ward.[/QUOTE] That's right, there io no room anymore for pushing any problems to wait for later - it has to adress everything. Besides, i didn't buy strange caber and classic for nothing in anticipation for this update

[QUOTE=ComodoreBluth;52515268]I was pretty surprised there was no Bison buff or Pomson rework in the balance blog post. I'll be disappointed if those weapons aren't touched in the upcoming update.[/QUOTE] I've found that over the 5 years I've been playing this game, every time they touch any of the Grordbort weapons, the community is outraged. I'd say they should just buff the bison, and leave the weapons alone.

[QUOTE=Chuggoth;52515279]Unless they're secretly porting it to source 2, such waiting times are fucking inexcusable.[/QUOTE] If they were porting to Source 2, the wait would be seven times longer.

[QUOTE=Chuggoth;52515279]Unless they're secretly porting it to source 2, such waiting times are fucking inexcusable.[/QUOTE] They would let us know if they were porting the game to Source 2 because it would break mods and they would almost certainly put out a beta before they ship Source 2 in the main client.

[QUOTE=socks_;52515237]I have to disagree on the implication that great update =/= needs a year and a half. WAR! was a very simple update. It was essentially "We make new weapons for these two classes plus a bonus one, pit those two classes together, see who wins and gets the bonus item, release some new maps + bug fixes." They were able to accomplish this in such short time due to the fact that TF2 was only two years old, with a low map count and low weapon count, which meant lesser need for rebalances, and less bugs. Love and War was average. Love and War was definitely NOT a great update[/QUOTE] Can you elaborate why? You just deny L&W was great with no argument whatsoever. My reasoning to say it was great is because I think it was the last update where they put a lot of effort and love into. Since then, the closest thing to that was Gun mettle, which was a good update too, had very good rebalances, but sadly it was the update that introduced a lot of the actual TF2 problems like tiered cosmetics, skins that affected a lot of the game performance and the long line of no new weapons in years. And in some way, the csgo-inspired economy system they introduced felt like a cashgrab, all updates are in a minium extent, but that was one of the updates that tried the least to hide it. L&W wasn't the best (minigun nerf), but for the most part was harmless, unlike GM and MyM. One of the most fun updates to try out the new weapons, features, taunts, etc. About the WAR update you are correct tho, I did not think about it that way.