League of Legends V4 - "You have been disconnected from PVP.net" - Games

I think they need to nerf Trist's ult and make it like Witch Slayer's (just a big bullet nuke) because I'm tired of Trist noobs saving every enemy with it. [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] Typical Shogun Post: BITCH MOAN BITCH MOAN I HAD A BADDY ON MY TEAM WAH LIFE IS SO HARD QQ

[QUOTE=valiant.;27105685]Hey guys, this champion has something that makes them unique. We need to get rid of it. While we're at it, since Karthus makes you play differently, and since Shen means you can't chase someone, and there are all these unique champions, we're going to remove their "gamechanging" stuff. [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] Somehow when someone complains about Udyr ganking everyone laughs and says "just buy wards" or Karthus' ult "just buy banshees veil" or Shen's ult "don't chase at low health" and everyone laughs at them. But people complaining about Eve get agreed with, even though you could "just buy Oracles" I don't get it.[/QUOTE] The same thread had explained why the oracles prolem exists. If you're in any lane you're scared the shit when they stealth early game. This forces all lanes(most notably mid) to buy vision wards; which sets back their effectiveness. If you recall at mid you lose exp making you behind early game. This isn't about "just buy oracles", this is about how in high elo games are decided in 10 mins at most whereas normal/low is only decided by around 15 minutes. 5 minutes is enough time to start snowballing/farming creep waves. It sucks when you are forced to play defensively when an eve is on the enemy team. It promotes turtling and camping which is never liked in LoL. Same reason why tanky DPS got nerfed on Patch 107.

Karthus makes you recall when you could have stayed and gotten more gold/XP and regained health with lifesteal/regen. Eve does the same thing, with more risk. You can buy items to save you from Karthus. You can buy items to save you from Eve. I really don't see the difference.

Oracles doesn't build into anything, though. No amount of MR stops her stun and BV doesn't stop her stun when their trist can just E you to break it. Karthus can be countered by buying Negatron cloak, holding it then buying BV. Eve can be countered by just spamming oracles and using them.. they build into nothing else and do not defend you from anything else unless they have another stealth character on their team. [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] On that note, 4th avatar change!

Except using a single ward and killing that unsuspecting Eve nets you a cool 300 gold, and puts them out of commission for a long while. An underleveled and underfarmed Eve/Twitch is useless. While high ELO Eves are extremely dangerous, they aren't any more OP than say a high ELO Corki.

Stealth is pretty flawed for both ends. Oracles are a hard counter for stealthing and before the other team gets access to them they're forced to be watchful and play defensively until the stealth char reveals themselves. Eve can be played without relying on your stealth ability while someone like Shaco can't.

[QUOTE=Jund;27106537]Except using a single ward and killing that unsuspecting Eve nets you a cool 300 gold, and puts them out of commission for a long while. An underleveled and underfarmed Eve/Twitch is useless. While high ELO Eves are extremely dangerous, they aren't any more OP than say a high ELO Corki.[/QUOTE] You might not get a kill and wards go out so fast you have to keep replenishing it, so when you DO kill her you're still down say 300g.

I must be super low ELO because not many of my games are decided by 10 mins. 15 or 20 mins yeah. But rarely 10

REINDEER KOGMAW HGNGHNGHGNn

Eve isn't OP but she is imbalanced. Kinda like Tryndamere. Neither of them are OP but they have stupid mechanics. It's a pain in the ass to go against a champ who can kill you but can't die for a set amount of time. And then have a spell (exhaust) that hard counters it, but if you don't take exhaust you're screwed. Not at all OP, but balanced poorly.

i know that everyone here hates AD eve but as i'm only level 12 it's tons of fun. feel free to hate but i enjoy it

Woowoowo. Hotshot is streaming Hotshotgg. lololo halo jump shootos [url]http://www.own3d.tv/live/214[/url] [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] Nvm he just stopped for a WoW raid or something [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] Nope he has 20 mins till it starts 'back to stalking'

[QUOTE=Blueridge;27106330]Oracles doesn't build into anything, though. No amount of MR stops her stun and BV doesn't stop her stun when their trist can just E you to break it. Karthus can be countered by buying Negatron cloak, holding it then buying BV. Eve can be countered by just spamming oracles and using them.. they build into nothing else and do not defend you from anything else unless they have another stealth character on their team. [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] On that note, 4th avatar change![/QUOTE] Oracles last forever and are considerably less money than a BV. They are also used to destroy and counter wards. One person should be getting Oracles anyways, since you have to kill wards if you want to do Dragon/Baron. As long as you don't play like a retard, Eve is going to have trouble. However Karthus just nukes you if you have low health. I find his ult is MUCH more game disrupting than Eve. [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=EvilShadow777;27106592]Stealth is pretty flawed for both ends. Oracles are a hard counter for stealthing and before the other team gets access to them they're forced to be watchful and play defensively until the stealth char reveals themselves. Eve can be played without relying on your stealth ability while someone like Shaco can't.[/QUOTE] Shaco's stealth lasts like one second and has a built in blink. Eve relies on stealth, Shaco doesn't. You've got it backwards. [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Alteir;27107449]i know that everyone here hates AD eve but as i'm only level 12 it's tons of fun. feel free to hate but i enjoy it[/QUOTE] No one hates AD Eve here. The only two Eve players that I know of (Ninja and me) play AP, but AD is fine if you're into that. I lane as Eve though, so I play AP. :)

I'd just like to say one thing about this karthus/eve comparison: say you're at full or at least at a high-enough HP level for Requiem to not come close to killing you (base damage of 250, most karthus players seem to get Tear first, not AP). Say the champ you are playing is pantheon. You're about to go in for the kill against a very low [i]insert champ here[/i]. With Karthus on the enemy team, you can go past river and kill them, maybe even dive, and not have requiem kill you assuming you didn't do something idiotic like dive sion or tryndamere or something. But with eve, you can walk past the river and BOOM stun attack attack attack dead. And oracles doesn't help when a ghosted, mobility-booted, possibly ulting eve comes darting at you because the stun still works regardless of whether you see her. She isn't really OP but she's just not... right. I don't know how to word it

You're talking about the ideal situation in which Eve SHOULD be taking advantage of. Then it's the loss of the player with the oracles and their team not protecting them when needed. She's not OP. Not even close.

[QUOTE=NoShogun;27112402]I'd just like to say one thing about this karthus/eve comparison: say you're at full or at least at a high-enough HP level for Requiem to not come close to killing you (base damage of 250, most karthus players seem to get Tear first, not AP). Say the champ you are playing is pantheon. You're about to go in for the kill against a very low [i]insert champ here[/i]. With Karthus on the enemy team, you can go past river and kill them, maybe even dive, and not have requiem kill you assuming you didn't do something idiotic like dive sion or tryndamere or something. But with eve, you can walk past the river and BOOM stun attack attack attack dead. And oracles doesn't help when a ghosted, mobility-booted, possibly ulting eve comes darting at you because the stun still works regardless of whether you see her. She isn't really OP but she's just not... right. I don't know how to word it[/QUOTE] Karthus can kill you without even seeing you, from across the map. If you have Oracles and you're not traversing the map as a squishy (like pantheon) you're fine. If you're running through the jungle without backup you deserve to be ganked. [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] Oh and people complaining about wards: it hurts gankers too. Now we have to buy more wards to put in the jungle to get the ganks, you need more to defend you. Same thing.

never underestimate the power of the scout's code god damn teemo is too good

Also even if oracles does help you kill wards and give you awareness, it doesn't help too much against eve. Twitch doesn't have a stun and isn't blazing fast like Eve, so it can counter him better. Also, 400 gold isn't just a one-time investment. You honestly can't tell me that you won't die at least once in an average game. Get a veil to counter Karthus. Cool, now you've countered other champs who deal magic damage as well as increased your HP and Mana pools, and you get to keep it when you die. Get an Oracles to counter eve. Now you can kill wards and you haven't really solved the eve problem. [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] And I never said she was OP. She isn't, but Eve (and stealth in general) is in a strange, not-very-good place right now.

That's why you have a support champ that is unreliant on to many items (Nidalee) to get vision wards. She already has her trap so she doesn't need normal ones. So now she can use her mobility (cougar) to farm and spread around the map using vision wards to counter their wards.

[QUOTE=acfan;27112705]never underestimate the power of the scout's code god damn teemo is too good[/QUOTE] 1. Get to level 6 2. Plant mushrooms everywhere 3. ??? 4. Kills!

Back me up here bros. And if you don't agree don't post my fingers are getting tired. [url]http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=5062037&posted=1#post5062037[/url] [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=NoShogun;27112821]Also even if oracles does help you kill wards and give you awareness, it doesn't help too much against eve. Twitch doesn't have a stun and isn't blazing fast like Eve, so it can counter him better. Also, 400 gold isn't just a one-time investment. You honestly can't tell me that you won't die at least once in an average game. Get a veil to counter Karthus. Cool, now you've countered other champs who deal magic damage as well as increased your HP and Mana pools, and you get to keep it when you die. Get an Oracles to counter eve. Now you can kill wards and you haven't really solved the eve problem. [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] And I never said she was OP. She isn't, but Eve (and stealth in general) is in a strange, not-very-good place right now.[/QUOTE] Tanks shouldn't be dying. Tanks get Oracles. Mid game everyone sits around their tank. You don't sit there alone with a stealth champ running around. You don't sit there with >300 health when Karthus is on the other team. I really don't see the difference, and Oracles is not TEMPORARY. It's only temporary if you die, which you shouldn't unless your positioning was bad, so you deserve to die anyways. (or you lose a teamfight, which means you pretty much lost the game already.)

Don't bother Valiant. The LoL Forum is full of trash. Even if you do MAYBE convince somebody it isn't gonna do any good. Eve is "op" and that's that. That's how it works. Oh how I miss you Shaco. <3 RIP my friend.

Hey man, I gotta try. I'm not just going to sit around while a game I like gets fucked with. Thanks for the backup bro.

they're changing eve's stealth?

Fuck i'm getting on my smurf forum so I just can say stupid shit.

What is this about tanks not dying? They WILL die every so often if you're actually tanking. That's actually why leviathan is not a particularly great choice for tanks. But all of these pro-eve arguments compare Eve ganking to Karthus and Shen ults. It's a fair comparison I suppose, but if I may I would like to provide a counter-argument. Requiem has a longass cooldown (as it should) and doesn't do near the damage an Eve gank does, plus it doesn't stun. Also Karthus isn't particularly great earlygame besides his ult (try using defile, it'll eat up more of your Mana than it will their HP). Stand United is the one that people always use as a comparison to Eve ganks. Eve means that you can't extend, and shen means that you can't chase with low HP. The difference is that Eve can kill you (depending on which champion the enemy laner is playing, I admit) if you step out a little too far. A decent eve can punish even the tiniest extension with disproportionate consequences, and she can do it with relative ease. In a Vacuum (basically during a game with no shen or eve or karthus, etc), chasing will get you in to more trouble regardless. You're presumably running into enemy territory, man. Shen punishes something already risky with death (ult has a long CD, though, but it should) while eve punishes something that is neutral or even encouraged (stepping out to farm, or trying to kill a low HP enemy) with death. If you are really overextended and eve kills you, you deserve to die of course but right now what she can do and what she forces the other team to do is a bit much. Once again I'm going to say that I do NOT believe that she is OP, merely a champ with yucky design.

I Leviathan Shen and I get full stacks all the time. Use Feint not Vorpal. Don't initiate a 5v5. Keep the team busy. Have your carry backdoor. The enemy will try to split up. That's where they are weak. Get them as they begin to peel apart. >Also Karthus isn't particularly great earlygame >Never played against one that knows how to Lay Waste like a boss

I mean in terms of ganking, I should clarify. Wall isn't as good as you'd think, and Lay Waste spamming requires you to basically stand still. A good burster can get you down before you can burst them down with lay waste, although I get what you're saying. I'll give Levi Shen a try but I'd rather die as a tank than have Generic DPS Carry die. Also what I am about to say is an attempt to appeal to Valiant, as we have one thing in common: we both hate Zilean. He is like Eve in this respect: He's not OP but he's a pain to play against, and no one likes it. The shit he pulls is so frustrating and so effective it's silly, but it's not OP. It does change the way you play, though. That's how eve is, just silly and frustrating.

Zilean is easy. Level 1. He throws a bomb. Back off. When it explodes you have 7 seconds to attack. Stay out of range, he'll get impatient and try to catch you with a bomb by putting it on a minion. Back off, 7 seconds to attack. Repeat. Just like that game where we were Taric + Panth. Hide behind creeps, he puts bomb, step away from it, then move up and zone him.

hahahaha Dwragon's smurfing. Time to get on Crustacea [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Dwragon82997;27114562]Zilean is easy. Level 1. He throws a bomb. Back off. When it explodes you have 7 seconds to attack. Stay out of range, he'll get impatient and try to catch you with a bomb by putting it on a minion. Back off, 7 seconds to attack. Repeat. Just like that game where we were Taric + Panth. Hide behind creeps, he puts bomb, step away from it, then move up and zone him.[/QUOTE] Si es good point but part of the reason that he wasn't a problem was that we were TARIC AND MANTHEON. He gets in range for a bomb and he gets double-stunned. [editline]31st December 2010[/editline] I hope I don't offend anyone by debating with you guys. I like you all a lot but I just disagree with you. Still amigos, si?