Battlefield 3 - Games - Facepunch Forum

I'm surprised by how positive most people here are towards BF3. In most other places I'm reading its just a bunch of whining.

[QUOTE=goon165;27941752] What part of "PC centric development" didn't you catch? [/QUOTE] BF2 was PC exclusive and its net code left much to be wished for.

[QUOTE=clanratc;27941815]The people who complain about mod tools should just read [url=http://forums.electronicarts.co.uk/battlefield-bad-company-2-pc/1350772-so-how-about-modtools.html]this[/url] anyway. A DICE employee explains why there are no mod tools in bfbc2, the same post can be applied to bf3.[/QUOTE] In short, It's extremely complex and damn near impossible to work with without intimate knowledge of every damn thing about the frostbite engine and making it digestible for public consumption would take hours and hours of work. work that would actually detract from the overall quality of the game as a whole (you know, the thing that actually makes the developer money so they can, you know, eat?.) [B]SO THAT'S WHY YOU DON'T GET YOUR MOD TOOLS AT LAUNCH. [/B] satisfied?, good.

[QUOTE=markfu;27941928]I'm surprised by how positive most people here are towards BF3. In most other places I'm reading its just a bunch of whining.[/QUOTE] If you'd have to identify a group of people by a single trait, associating fans with loud whining would be your safest bet by far.

[QUOTE=Im Crimson;27941951]BF2 was PC exclusive and its net code left much to be wished for.[/QUOTE] That was six years ago.

I'm actually a little worried after reading that article. It gave me the impression they are trying to simplify the game a little too much. The guy kind of shot down the notion of commanders, saying that BC2s teamwork mechanics were better. What!? Pointing your cursor at an objective and clicking a button so it gets a different border? The squad window should be in depth. It should have the markers and waypoints like BF2 had. While I agree a sole commander may not be the best solution, I'd like a nice organization tree that causes sqauds to teamwork and interface with other sqauds. I feel like DICE is making too many assumptions from the console market. They say things like a commander interface is too complicated and that 4 classes are enough. This is true on the console because you're playing with a group of other random players. Back in BF2 on the PC, you could join teamwork servers where everyone was into it, knew their roles, listened, understood the command interface. What I'm trying to say is that it's been a while since DICE has made a PC Battlefield and I hope they don't assume that everything they have learned from their console games also completely applies to us PC gamers. Not trying to disrespect the game or anything, but a few things in the article made me a little uneasy. DICE has had their shit together in the past so I'm hoping that they can alleviate my doubts in the coming weeks.

I, too, got quite uneasy upon reading the comments about a possible commander role. Can't quite conclude whether they are skipping it or not, but it seems likely.

I wouldn't care if the commander got cut. It would be nice to have a more deep way of giving orders to your squad mates other then an icon change though.

I liked it when you were in a squad and could bring up the map and select a location where you wanted your squad to go/attack/defend. Page king first time :D but I have no content apart from I have an awesome dad that is a die hard battlefield fan and I love it.

The latest bit that I'm extremely pissed off about is that from what heard, they are removing health bars and going with regenerating health....

[QUOTE=tesher07;27942340]The latest bit that I'm extremely pissed off about is that from what heard, they are removing health bars and going with regenerating health....[/QUOTE] where have you been for the past few years of fps's?

[QUOTE=Sean C;27942041]I'm actually a little worried after reading that article. It gave me the impression they are trying to simplify the game a little too much. The guy kind of shot down the notion of commanders, saying that BC2s teamwork mechanics were better. What!? Pointing your cursor at an objective and clicking a button so it gets a different border? The squad window should be in depth. It should have the markers and waypoints like BF2 had. While I agree a sole commander may not be the best solution, I'd like a nice organization tree that causes sqauds to teamwork and interface with other sqauds. I feel like DICE is making too many assumptions from the console market. They say things like a commander interface is too complicated and that 4 classes are enough. This is true on the console because you're playing with a group of other random players. Back in BF2 on the PC, you could join teamwork servers where everyone was into it, knew their roles, listened, understood the command interface. What I'm trying to say is that it's been a while since DICE has made a PC Battlefield and I hope they don't assume that everything they have learned from their console games also completely applies to us PC gamers. Not trying to disrespect the game or anything, but a few things in the article made me a little uneasy. DICE has had their shit together in the past so I'm hoping that they can alleviate my doubts in the coming weeks.[/QUOTE] Simplicity and Depth that's what every developer who wishes for their game to be widely excepted wants; a game that is simple enough to grasp by most people and deep enough to keep those players entertained and playing. Don't needlessly over complicate things, keep all the important stuff the player needs to know to play, excel, and have fun simple and use that as a basis to introduce new concepts to the player that further evolve the experience while keeping it easily understandable and manageable. Take Minecraft for example, very simple core game mechanics but at the same time it has [B]SHEAR SUBMARINE CRUSHING DEPTH[/B] with the amount of things you can do once you understand them.

[QUOTE=tesher07;27942340]The latest bit that I'm extremely pissed off about is that from what heard, they are removing health bars and going with regenerating health....[/QUOTE] It hasn't been officially confirmed, at least from what I know.

[QUOTE=Melon_Mapper;27942368]where have you been for the past few years of fps's?[/QUOTE] Doesn't make it any less of a retarded system.

[QUOTE=Miskav;27942445]Doesn't make it any less of a retarded system.[/QUOTE] Miskav speaks the truth, what's so bad about health bars, anyway?

[QUOTE=Miskav;27942445]Doesn't make it any less of a retarded system.[/QUOTE] I didn't say it was or wasn't retarded, I was just stating that it's no suprise that they're using it.

[QUOTE=goon165;27942382]Simplicity and Depth that's what every developer who wishes for their game to be widely excepted wants; a game that is simple enough to grasp by most people and deep enough to keep those players entertained and playing. Don't needlessly over complicate things, keep all the important stuff the player needs to know to play, excel, and have fun simple and use that as a basis to introduce new concepts to the player that further evolve the experience while keeping it easily understandable and manageable. Take Minecraft for example, very simple core game mechanics but at the same time it has [B]SHEAR SUBMARINE CRUSHING DEPTH[/B] with the amount of things you can do once you understand them.[/QUOTE] Too bad it seems they're having a lot of trouble with the depth part. It needs to be passed kiddie pool depth, AKA BC2. BF2 wasn't over complicated, anyway.

Battlefield 3 could have health bars. Like some others have said before, the HUD is probably a WiP. We'll just have to wait for official confirmation.

[QUOTE=Miskav;27942445]Doesn't make it any less of a retarded system.[/QUOTE] sure it's an illogical idea, you hide behind something for a few seconds and you magically heal all wounds, but it keeps the game flowing. stopping halfway through a level to go hunting for Medkits because you got you dopey ass shot off slams the breaks on the finely crafted experience the developer has set up for you, and instead of you progressing and continuing to the next awesome firefight or god help you [B][U][I]THE BOSS[/I][/U][/B] your backtracking looking in every hidey hole for a box with a cross on it. And what happens when you can't find any?, you walk into a situation where you get killed over and over again because you don't have enough health to make it through the next firefight or face the boss in an unwinable battle. at that point you have to ether restart the whole level again or give up in frustration. In multiplayer it's even worse. take battlefield 2 for example, you take a hit from some jackass you can't see that takes 3/4s of your health, what now? you gotta go find a medic or run the risk of getting killed in the first fight you come across or dieing at a critical moment that sinks the teams chances of winning. I think BC2's way of doing it works just fine, maybe make regen a little slower so that medics are still relevant but you aren't killed by the first shot because you couldn't find a medic. this isn't fun, and the developer knows it, that's why regenerating health is so prominent. Having regenerating health may be illogical but it's better than the alternatives.

[QUOTE=goon165;27941959]In short, It's extremely complex and damn near impossible to work with without intimate knowledge of every damn thing about the frostbite engine and making it digestible for public consumption would take hours and hours of work. work that would actually detract from the overall quality of the game as a whole (you know, the thing that actually makes the developer money so they can, you know, eat?.) [B]SO THAT'S WHY YOU DON'T GET YOUR MOD TOOLS AT LAUNCH. [/B] satisfied?, good.[/QUOTE] you don't know that for sure, have you worked with it before? it's something to complain about

[QUOTE=goon165;27942698]sure it's an illogical idea, you hide behind something for a few seconds and you magically heal all wounds, but it keeps the game flowing. stopping halfway through a level to go hunting for Medkits because you got you dopey ass shot off slams the breaks on the finely crafted experience the developer has set up for you, and instead of you progressing and continuing to the next awesome firefight or god help you [B][U][I]THE BOSS[/I][/U][/B] your backtracking looking in every hidey hole for a box with a cross on it. And what happens when you can't find any?, you walk into a situation where you get killed over and over again because you don't have enough health to make it through the next firefight or face the boss in an unwinable battle. at that point you have to ether restart the whole level again or give up in frustration. Having regenerating health may be illogical but it's better than the alternatives.[/QUOTE] In a single player game yeah health packs aren't as widely available, but in a game focused on team work, if you're playing it the right way there will be a medic behind you to heal you, if not, well, thats your fault for not getting your shit sorted out and trying to go it alone.

[QUOTE=goon165;27942698]sure it's an illogical idea, you hide behind something for a few seconds and you magically heal all wounds, but it keeps the game flowing. stopping halfway through a level to go hunting for Medkits because you got you dopey ass shot off slams the breaks on the finely crafted experience the developer has set up for you, and instead of you progressing and continuing to the next awesome firefight or god help you [B][U][I]THE BOSS[/I][/U][/B] your backtracking looking in every hidey hole for a box with a cross on it. And what happens when you can't find any?, you walk into a situation where you get killed over and over again because you don't have enough health to make it through the next firefight or face the boss in an unwinable battle. at that point you have to ether restart the whole level again or give up in frustration. In multiplayer it's even worse. take battlefield 2 for example, you take a hit from some jackass you can't see, what now? you gotta go find a medic or run the risk of getting killed in the first fight you come across or dieing at a critical moment that sinks the teams chances of winning. Having regenerating health may be illogical but it's better than the alternatives.[/QUOTE] What you're forgetting is that the BF series has always been multiplayer oriented. There is no linear progression in multiplayer, there are no bosses. There should always be medics on your team. All those arguments fail when you talk about Multiplayer, instead of singleplayer where the idea originated.

Regenerating or not, there better be a health bar. BC2 was dumb as shit. How am I supposed to know how much health I have?

[QUOTE=evilweazel;27942771]In a single player game yeah health packs aren't as widely available, but in a game focused on team work, if you're playing it the right way there will be a medic behind you to heal you, if not, well, thats your fault for not getting your shit sorted out and trying to go it alone.[/QUOTE] Except, honestly, game communities can't be trusted with your [in game] life.

[QUOTE=Miskav;27942782] There should always be medics on your team. [/QUOTE] Just because there should be medics on your team, doesn't mean that there will be.

[QUOTE=JerryK;27942769]you don't know that for sure, have you worked with it before? it's something to complain about[/QUOTE] Have you?, no?, than we have no choice but to take the developers word for it. also added a little tidbit about multiplayer to my last comment.

[QUOTE=Erebus.;27942827]Just because there should be medics on your team, doesn't mean that there will be.[/QUOTE] I have never, ever been in a match in BF2 where there weren't at least 4(64man server) or 2(32) medics. And I've logged over 1000 hours on that.

[QUOTE=goon165;27942849]Have you?, no?, than we have no choice but to take the developers word for it. also added a little tidbit about multiplayer to my last comment.[/QUOTE] so if a movie director said his movie was the best movie ever made would you go see it without hearing from someone else who has seen it already?

[QUOTE=JerryK;27942934]so if a movie director said his movie was the best movie ever made would you go see it without hearing from someone else who has seen it already?[/QUOTE] Yes, only one way to find out.

[QUOTE=JerryK;27942934]so if a movie director said his movie was the best movie ever made would you go see it without hearing from someone else who has seen it already?[/QUOTE] That's a horrible analogy. Really horrible.