The highlighting may be annoying, but at least the game has a valid excuse due to being a badass cybernetic. Then again, that's never stopped games from having intrusive HUD elements before. v:v:v
One thing that looked off in that gameplay video was that the third-person cover seemed really sticky. I mean, it looked cool and all, but it looked like Jensen didn't want to really budge. I wonder if that's WIP?
[QUOTE=MasterG;28725766]Oh, thought I read you could somewhere. Why's everyone so bothered about them?[/QUOTE]
Because it's handholding, it's ugly when to many objects are highlighted (breaks immersion too), and it makes exploring too easy. There won't be any joy if you discover a vent or a ladder somewhere. It insults the intelligence.
The should be at least some kind off highlighting so the player can see the difference between interactive and non-interactive objects. But this is just too much.
Just played DX1, its really good. at one point I was so immersed I felt like I was actually hacking stuff :3
[QUOTE=KorJax;28722973]Lol yeah
Because a section of gameplay from a tutorial level is really something to base a claim like that off of. Considering the tutorial for DX1 was almost exactly like that video (except a lot more open on a surface level which is why a lot of people hated the first level of DX1).
And don't say "BUT WHY NOT USE GAMEPLAY FROM A NON-TUTORIAL LEVEL?!" because:
1. Tutorials are easy to follow in short gameplay video form
2. It doesn't spoil anything
3. Over complicating video content for a game you are trying to explain to an open audience doesn't work
The only thing I don't like what I see so far about this game personally is the fact that everything is highlighted all the time. I'd much prefer DX1's method of subtly targeting things you can interact with when you hover your view over them.[/QUOTE]
Okay, allow me to go into more depth.
One tiny positive thing from that video is that in today's completely railroaded 100% linear corridor shooters, even that tiny bit of optional routes and paths is a welcome addition.
The rest of it... well the animation looks quite unnatural for 2010. No hit location. Slow enemy AI. Ridiculous long takedown cut scenes. What do other enemies in view range do while you do uber awesome move on their friends, twiddle their thumbs?
Commentator sounded weird, pretending to be exciting about "awesome" stuff she is talking about. And all ubercool new features she mentioned (optional routes, silent or non lethal takedowns...) would have been "meh"-ed in 2000. with angry question "is that all, where is..."
Furthermore, their claims that none of that is needed whatsoever and they will never force you to take silent or non lethal approaches... Once upon a time there were games like Thief and the original Deus Ex, and Hitman and even the original Splinter Cell where having segments where you are forced to be silent or not kill was an added challenge.
Note: success of that depended oh so much on level design and scripting.
Whats the point of adding stealth and takedowns and the rest of that crap when you proudly say none of it will be mandated from the player at any time?
Always glowing usable items win a special place in the "are you fucking retarded" hall of fame.
"Oh but it might still be a fun game"? "If it isn't the real Deus Ex sequel it can still be good game on its own!"
Fuck no.
With a disgusting color scheme, silly overdone takedowns, glowing objects, and a ridiculous rough voiced main character.
Though I don't mind the modern game industry. Saves me tons of time and bandwidth. Not really interested in playing Call of Halo Gears over and over again.
[QUOTE=The_Marine;28727290]Okay, allow me to go into more depth.
One tiny positive thing from that video is that in today's completely railroaded 100% linear corridor shooters, even that tiny bit of optional routes and paths is a welcome addition.
The rest of it... well the animation looks quite unnatural for 2010. No hit location. Slow enemy AI. Ridiculous long takedown cut scenes. What do other enemies in view range do while you do uber awesome move on their friends, twiddle their thumbs?
Commentator sounded weird, pretending to be exciting about "awesome" stuff she is talking about. And all ubercool new features she mentioned (optional routes, silent or non lethal takedowns...) would have been "meh"-ed in 2000. with angry question "is that all, where is..."
Furthermore, their claims that none of that is needed whatsoever and they will never force you to take silent or non lethal approaches... Once upon a time there were games like Thief and the original Deus Ex, and Hitman and even the original Splinter Cell where having segments where you are forced to be silent or not kill was an added challenge.
Note: success of that depended oh so much on level design and scripting.
Whats the point of adding stealth and takedowns and the rest of that crap when you proudly say none of it will be mandated from the player at any time?
Always glowing usable items win a special place in the "are you fucking retarded" hall of fame.
"Oh but it might still be a fun game"? "If it isn't the real Deus Ex sequel it can still be good game on its own!"
Fuck no.
With a disgusting color scheme, silly overdone takedowns, glowing objects, and a ridiculous rough voiced main character.
Though I don't mind the modern game industry. Saves me tons of time and bandwidth. Not really interested in playing Call of Halo Gears over and over again.[/QUOTE]
Fair enough then, don't play it.
[QUOTE=spekter;28708714]Riutet I've literally only seen negative things from you both in the Dead Island thread and now in here.[/quote]
Then you must have selective memory sir, as I've repeatedly said in the Dead Island thread that I think it will be a good game even if does end up being very similar to Dead Rising or wacky.
I like to be critical though, I think Deus Ex: Human Revolution will be good for what it is, but there's not much for me to praise from what I've seen, so I'm going to criticise the game based on what is known because you guys already have the praise side covered. There's no need for me to re-iterate what has at many times in this thread been said in praise of the game, so I won't.
[quote]The tutorial level REQUIRES these hand holding techniques (by that I mean blatant prop placement), its just common logic. Also bare in mind EM have done demonstrations in the past and have said that those sections would be nothing like that in the final version.[/quote]
They keep showing popamole walkthroughs and say that the rest of the game won't be popamole, I'd like to believe that, but it reeks of bullshit.
[quote]You're throwing in a ton of assumptions when we've barely scratched the surface[/quote]
I'm not making assumptions, I'm making educated guesses and also I'm not even saying I'm right, just presenting an alternative possibility for ya'll.
[quote]you were doing this in the Dead Island thread.[/quote]
I was saying the game would likely be somewhat wacky, more and more like Dead Rising as time went on and not as serious as everyone thought it was going to be, based on what I'd heard and seen. And it actually looks like I might be right. :geno:
[quote]You're expecting people to listen to your opinions yet you're coming across as a troll because you quite clearly don't seem to like this game.[/quote]
They're somewhat my opinions, and somewhat just me playing Devil's Advocate, I want to like this game because I like Deus Ex, I will not JUST like the game and ignore anything that suggests that I may not like the game because it's a Deus Ex game, lest I set myself up for another IW level disappointment.
[quote]Me personally? I don't care about any of the third person crap nor will I judge this game purely from a tutorial level.[/quote]
I do, third person on ladders is unnecessary, third person behind cover is something I'd want as an option that can be turned on and off, third person for takedowns? Fuck that shit. Did you know there are no melee weapons in the game as far as anyone knows? This instant takedown crap has invalidated melee weapons, and as someone who did a melee weapon run through Deus Ex twice, I'm kinda disappointed. I'm not judging the rest of the game definitively based on this level, I'm suggesting what the rest of the game may be, not will be.
[quote]They have a lot of these systems in place for balance however highlighting [B]will[/B] get annoying if they don't lower the range or allow a toggle for it, its too invasive.[/QUOTE]
I agree that highlighting is very annoying, a lot of the secrets in Deus Ex I didn't discover until later playthroughs when I decided to get a little more observant, I was surprised that years after playing the game originally, there are still areas I've not once been in, did you know there was a secret under the floor of Alex Jacobson's office?
[editline]21st March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=NanoSquid;28712457]Oh man Riutet your opinion is so [i]right[/i] I can't believe any of these people are arguing I mean you convinced me I'm not getting it anymore
:colbert:[/QUOTE]
I'm not trying to convince you not to buy the game, I'm just stating what is apparent, whether you decide you still want to play the game is entirely up to you, don't be a smartarse. :v:
[editline]21st March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=hexpunK;28712544]I can see them including a option for disabling highlighting if the community requests it enough. Even DICE added that option to Mirrors Edge, which was considerably more linear than this will be.[/QUOTE]
Yeah honestly the reaction has been so negative that they'd be silly not to, even if they don't though there'll likely be a mod to disable it, I just hope they didn't make sections of the game wherein the player relies totally on the highlighting, that would suck.
[editline]21st March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;28715783]I bet within 3 days of release there will be a mod that removes the health-regen, object highlighting and whatever else "casual" they've put in.[/QUOTE]
Health regen is another issue entirely, chances are removing health regen when the game is designed to work with it will result in the game being impossible to play without ghosting.
[editline]21st March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=JCDentonUNATCO;28718160]Don't worry guys Riutet just shits up every thread he goes into by telling everybody that the game is going to suck and that everyone is overhyping it.[/QUOTE]
No I don't, check the Skyrim thread or The Witcher thread. :smug:
Even then I never claim what I'm saying is truth, only possibility.
[editline]21st March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=The_Marine;28727290]Lots of words[/QUOTE]
:salute:
[editline]21st March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Alex141;28727352]Fair enough then, don't play it.[/QUOTE]
Is that snarkiness? Are you suggesting that he is wrong in pointing out how the video suggests that HR may be a decline from Deus Ex? That he should just deal with it and not be disappointed?
Or am I wrong in how I have interpreted your post?
I'll take instant takedowns over the original deus ex's melee system any day. It's so frustrating to hit an enemy in the back of the head only to have him turn around and yell. Then you get gang raped by him and all his friends through no fault of your own and have to reload. Maybe they could be quieter, and first person would be alright but in all honesty I see no problem with it otherwise.
[QUOTE=froztshock;28728073]I'll take instant takedowns over the original deus ex's melee system any day. It's so frustrating to hit an enemy in the back of the head only to have him turn around and yell. Then you get gang raped by him and all his friends through no fault of your own and have to reload. Maybe they could be quieter, and first person would be alright but in all honesty I see no problem with it otherwise.[/QUOTE]
You know why that happened?
Because you didn't level up low-tech. Don't put enough points into low-tech? The stun-rod is the only reliable way to take a guy down with melee without him having a chance to fight back or alert others.
If you did level up low-tech, you'd find that yes, the guards would go down in one hit from the baton. You know why this is? Deus Ex was a synthesis of RPG and FPS, and as it should be, the player is to a greater degree subject to the ability of the character he has created. The consequence of not leveling up low-tech was that you were now subject to the ammo scarcity of stun-rods, and as a result you were limited in what you could do in one area, in exchange for a boost in competency in another. It creates those situations where you're really improvising and trying out crazy things, struggling even.
Some of my favourite Deus Ex stories are from when the game presented me with a situation that another type of character, specifically not mine, would be best suited for, and I was forced to get creative in how I handled that situation.
[QUOTE=Riutet;28728224]You know why that happened?
Because you didn't level up low-tech. Don't put enough points into low-tech? The stun-rod is the only reliable way to take a guy down with melee without him having a chance to fight back or alert others.
If you did level up low-tech, you'd find that yes, the guards would go down in one hit from the baton. You know why this is? Deus Ex was a synthesis of RPG and FPS, and as it should be, the player is to a greater degree subject to the ability of the character he has created. The consequence of not leveling up low-tech was that you were now subject to the ammo scarcity of stun-rods, and as a result you were limited in what you could do in one area, in exchange for a boost in competency in another. It creates those situations where you're really improvising and trying out crazy things, struggling even.
Some of my favourite Deus Ex stories are from when the game presented me with a situation that another type of character, specifically not mine, would be best suited for, and I was forced to get creative in how I handled that situation.[/QUOTE]
Hmm, I didn't realize that the effectiveness of the baton when it came to sneak attacks was tied to your low tech skill. Makes sense.
[QUOTE=Alex141;28727352]Fair enough then, don't play it.[/QUOTE]
ok
[QUOTE=RIUTET]I'm not making assumptions, I'm making educated guesses [/QUOTE]
[IMG]http://cdn.fpcontent.net/fp/ratings/funny2.png[/IMG]
[QUOTE=ZakKa!;28728959][img_thumb]http://cdn.fpcontent.net/fp/ratings/funny2.png[/img_thumb][/QUOTE]
That was the joke, yes.
On a side note, saw this in /v/, as well as a few other images, if you post on the Eidos forums and don't like highlighting I'd suggest posting them there.
[img]http://i.cubeupload.com/eZmDFp.jpg[/img]
There will be a mod within hours of the games release to change that.
Didn't they say it's a glitch that everything is highlighted and not just what you are looking at?
[QUOTE=POLOPOZOZO;28730285]Didn't they say it's a glitch that everything is highlighted and not just what you are looking at?[/QUOTE]
I thought it was that the ladder stayed highlighted while you were climbing it.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;28730156]There will be a mod within hours of the games release to change that.[/QUOTE]
Hope so, and that the game isn't designed with the highlight being necessary to play of course.
[editline]21st March 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=froztshock;28730326]I thought it was that the ladder stayed highlighted while you were climbing it.[/QUOTE]
That was it, the ladder is supposed to stop glowing once you interact with it.
From the video I thought it was only what you were immediately looking at I imagine with the fuss people have been making they will add it as as option
Deus Ex Megathread - GLOWING OBJECTS EVERYWHERE Edition
I don't mind the highlight concept but I just don't want everything highlighted 24/7 unless I turn on an option for that or hold a key (like in Stalker). It just looks really really bad aesthetically, and makes the game feel extremely video-gamey, which is exactly what we don't want with a Deus Ex game.
And the orange highlight is so strong it's kind of offputting as well. If they took the highlight effect and killed the stroke by about half it would be much more pleasing to the eye. Look how thick the lines are for object highlighting in DX1 are - they are rather thin but work really well and are aesthetically pleasing. You don't need a blaringly thick highlight stroke for it to be functional and helpful.
[editline]21st March 2011[/editline]
Also picked up the Icarus Effect book today, looking forward to the first good read I've had in a year.
The worst part really is that it has the potential to give away secrets outright, the highlight in Deus Ex 1 only came up when you were point blank and staring directly at a secret panel/wall/other item, which meant you either had to be very lucky, very observant or to have acquired knowledge of it from within the gameworld.
Discovery ain't quite the same when you have a bright orange entity shouting, "Hey Nimrod, over here you cunt." at you.
I agree, it sucks, but all the same, it's going to get fixed awfully easy and I'm still going to enjoy it.
I'd keep it on if it was only on things that aren't part of the environment, like dropped weapons or ammo and the like. I see it as bad design if one ladder isn't climbable where another would be; you should see a ladder and think "I can climb that" and be right, not see a ladder and think "It's not glowing, I can't climb it"
In other words, for some things I'd like it, but for the obvious things it's annoying. That and it makes sense that it would highlight potentially useful things such as weapons, ammo, keys, etc; as well as mission goals. It's an augmentation designed to make things easier for the user (I'd assume) to distinguish under pressure.
If you can glance at a combat scene when you're low on ammo and see the ammo bright as day, that's good from an in-character perspective, especially in the dark-gritty-visuals thing we get going. But shit like doors or ladders or computers, it'd just be an information overload for the user to highlight absolutely everything he can interact with.
I still think there should be a proper melee system. :smug:
Have you ever played the Riddick games? Similar melee would be awesome.
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iEdtWtIEyI[/media]
Riddick has a nice melee system but most of it is still based on takedowns. Although disarming is always fun.
[QUOTE=OutOfExile2;28733349]Riddick has a nice melee system but most of it is still based on takedowns. Although disarming is always fun.[/QUOTE]
It still has a nice level of involvement though, the takedowns work without having to go into third person also. I'm disappointed that HR has dropped the low-tech skill tree. :(
[QUOTE=Riutet;28729795]That was the joke, yes.
On a side note, saw this in /v/, as well as a few other images, if you post on the Eidos forums and don't like highlighting I'd suggest posting them there.
[img_thumb]http://i.cubeupload.com/eZmDFp.jpg[/img_thumb][/QUOTE]
Seriosuly, you are getting your info from /v/ youtube and reddit, neither of which are credible.
[QUOTE=Riutet;28733511]It still has a nice level of involvement though, the takedowns work without having to go into third person also. I'm disappointed that HR has dropped the low-tech skill tree. :([/QUOTE]
That skill tree was annoying.
Points shouldn't dictate how well I can hold a gun.
[QUOTE=JohnEdwards;28733644]Seriosuly, you are getting your info from /v/ youtube and reddit, neither of which are credible.[/QUOTE]
No I'm not, I'm getting images and comments that are poking fun at Human Revolution from /v/, youtube and reddit. Because they're entertaining, and have a hint of truth to them.
[QUOTE=Dr Bob;28733692]That skill tree was annoying.
Points shouldn't dictate how well I can hold a gun.[/QUOTE]
But it added more ways to customize your character, and subsequently, added more replayability.
[QUOTE=Dr Bob;28733692]That skill tree was annoying.
Points shouldn't dictate how well I can hold a gun.[/QUOTE]
In an FPSRPG, points can and, to a debatable extent, should dictate how well you can hold a gun. It worked well in Deus Ex. It's an FPSRPG, not just an FPS.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.
